[TriammaMade]

After reading several threads here it has come to my attention that several members think that Christmas being hijacked or assaulted is hogwash. I'd like to offer the following observance of a 50 year old man..........me!

Last night I went to the shopping for my grandson. Instead of finding stores decorated to the hilt with Christmas/Holiday tunes gleefully filling the stores with holiday cheer, I found that if the store was photographed, no one would be able to detect that it was just days before Christmas.
Living near in a big city as I child, I have memories of department stores that dedicated entire floors to Christmas. Decorated to the hilt, they had ten times the toys to choose from. Parents took the kids to see Santa and let them point out their dream gifts.. ( if you're good , maybe Santa will bring you one ) What a time of year to be a kid! Christmas seemed like it would never get , time seemed to stand still from Thanksgiving on.
So where did it all go? Do some adults who want to move towards secularism feel that their own selfish demands should override the joy of our children? Would it really kill them to let kids visit decorated stores and hear Christmas carols?
I'm looking at the Christmas of today and let me tell you folks , it sucks! I feel fortunate to have experienced it when it was all it could be...........a virtual fantasyland to feed the mind of a child.

[stoneeZef]

Perhaps you guys who are concerned about the "Theft Of Christmas" should leave the Bible Belt, where this seems to be happening exclusively. There are two Christmas trees up in my office, Christmas decorations, Christmas songs, and general Christmas cheer at every shop I go to. And the kicker is that I work/live in an area that is predominantly Jewish and leans hard to the left.

Judging by all the anecdotal evidence on this board, it appears that the only place that a war on Christmas is occurring is in Christian strongholds... Perhaps the red states ought to take a lesson from the liberals and end the war on Christmas.

[deandrecooke]

Well, aside from the Christmas tree and decorations in my school, the Christmas decorations at the Texaco, the Christmas lights that are on almost every house and the Christmas tree and decorations that adorn my own home, its true that Christmas is missing.
Right across the border in Danville, VA, people had up Christmas lights the day after Thanksgiving, I even saw a Christmas flamingo in someones yard.

This whole situation is really sad. It seems like people are so focused on "the war on Christmas" that they aren't celebrating it.
I am though - I am baking (pies and bread) - helping to wrap gifts - and sending out Christmas cards.
I was raised to believe that the true meaning of Christmas had to do with the birth of Jesus Christ. That we should remember those who are less fortunate, who have no place to go (like Mary and Joseph) and that the lord our king was born on Christmas eve. It was a time when my entire family still got together and gorged ourselves on crab cakes and fudge and watched us grand kids open gifts and watching Rudolph and the Santa watch (anyone remember that?) on TV.

How that translates into raising a stink over the lack of decorations or the word Christmas is beyond me. Christmas is still here, whether its on signs in Macy's window - or your midnight mass on Christmas eve.
It is something that is in your heart and at the end of the day no liberal or commie or whoever you think is trying, can take that away. I suppose the best way to celebrate Christmas is to do it your way. Don't worry about how other people do it or don't do it and stop worrying if their aren't enough decorations up in town. No one can take Christmas away from you, so stop giving other people that much power!

So Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays, Seasons Greetings, Happy Hanukkah, Happy Kwanzaa, Merry Festivus and Have a great Ramadan.
And remember, egg nog makes the holidays brighter!

[Emedgella]

After reading several threads here it has come to my attention that several members think that Christmas being hijacked or assaulted is hogwash. I'd like to offer the following observance of a 50 year old man..........me!

Last night I went to the shopping for my grandson. Instead of finding stores decorated to the hilt with Christmas/Holiday tunes gleefully filling the stores with holiday cheer, I found that if the store was photographed, no one would be able to detect that it was just days before Christmas.
Living near in a big city as I child, I have memories of department stores that dedicated entire floors to Christmas. Decorated to the hilt, they had ten times the toys to choose from. Parents took the kids to see Santa and let them point out their dream gifts.. ( if you're good , maybe Santa will bring you one ) What a time of year to be a kid! Christmas seemed like it would never get , time seemed to stand still from Thanksgiving on.
So where did it all go? Do some adults who want to move towards secularism feel that their own selfish demands should override the joy of our children? Would it really kill them to let kids visit decorated stores and hear Christmas carols?
I'm looking at the Christmas of today and let me tell you folks , it sucks! I feel fortunate to have experienced it when it was all it could be...........a virtual fantasyland to feed the mind of a child.

Ditto the good doctor's points.

And Toronto - the atheist-secularist capital of North America (or perhaps second to Berkeley California), is the host of the oldest and largest Santa Claus parade in North America - indeed, recently a couple of smaller Santa parades have been created for each of the suburbs and small towns that surround Toronto.

And you can't go ten feet in this city without finding decorated christmas trees, holly and jiggle bells - and yes, even (gasp) nativity scenes - though you'd probably be hard pressed to find a nativity scene on public property, it is not entirely unheard of. And they have caroling at the park in front of City Hall on Christmas Eve...

War on Christmas? Apparently only in the USA - and as the good doctor has noted, apparently only in the Bible-Belt south... (where liberals and secularists are presumed to be rare)... hmm... kinda makes you wonder what is really going on...

[italertb]

Actually, I have an interesting follow up suggestion. Whether you subscribe to the collection of anecdotal evidence, power of suggestion, and urban legend that is "The War on Christmas" (duhn duhn duhn!) or not, I think everyone would agree that there is certainly a lot of media attention, discussion, and whatnot about it.

Now, let's just say for argument's sake that political pundits and chicken littles from the hard right were doing just the tiniest bit of shit-stirring and smoke blowing (remember - argument's sake). Now, if this were happening, might all the media attention regarding the war on Christmas have an adverse effect?

To be clear, let's say that Joe is a small business owner who gets a lot of email forwards, reads a lot of blogs, and is generally politically interested. Let's say that Joe gets lots of emails from his right wing friends about how Christmas is under seige, how the ACLU sues people who say the word "Christmas", how all the major corporations refuse to have denominational decorations, etc. Might such a Joe not just walk over to his store-front window, and replace the "Merry Christmas" sign, out of fear of retribution, inspired by his 'concerned' friends?

Is the war on Christmas a self-fulfilling prophecy? Are corporations taking down the Christmas trees because crusading nut-job Bill O'Reilly assures them they'll be sued if they don't?

Did anyone know that in 2003, the ACLU stepped into defend kids who had been suspended from school for selling candy-canes?
http://www.aclu.org/religion/tencomm...s20050302.html

Did anyone know that a similar "War on Christmas" was waged by the communists in 1959? And by Jews in 1921? Is this Christmas War III?

[nretdjuend]

Perhaps you guys who are concerned about the "Theft Of Christmas" should leave the Bible Belt, where this seems to be happening exclusively. There are two Christmas trees up in my office, Christmas decorations, Christmas songs, and general Christmas cheer at every shop I go to. And the kicker is that I work/live in an area that is predominantly Jewish and leans hard to the left.

Judging by all the anecdotal evidence on this board, it appears that the only place that a war on Christmas is occurring is in Christian strongholds... Perhaps the red states ought to take a lesson from the liberals and end the war on Christmas.

Dr........to be fair, I think the no Christ in Christmas workplaces, schools, stores, etc can be found scattered throughout our 50 states. I don't think your geographical assessment would be found to be accurate.

[BostonDoctorTTT]

Ditto the good doctor's points.

And Toronto - the atheist-secularist capital of North America (or perhaps second to Berkeley California), is the host of the oldest and largest Santa Claus parade in North America - indeed, recently a couple of smaller Santa parades have been created for each of the suburbs and small towns that surround Toronto.

And you can't go ten feet in this city without finding decorated christmas trees, holly and jiggle bells - and yes, even (gasp) nativity scenes - though you'd probably be hard pressed to find a nativity scene on public property, it is not entirely unheard of. And they have caroling at the park in front of City Hall on Christmas Eve...

War on Christmas? Apparently only in the USA - and as the good doctor has noted, apparently only in the Bible-Belt south... (where liberals and secularists are presumed to be rare)... hmm... kinda makes you wonder what is really going on...

The war on Xmas seems to be mostly retailer driven. Wal-Mart and Target have stores nationwide. In any case , the only point I have to make is that the kids are the ones that get the shit end of the stick. If anyone wants to argue that, c'mon.

[MgpojuWy]

Dr........to be fair, I think the no Christ in Christmas workplaces, schools, stores, etc can be found scattered throughout our 50 states. I don't think your geographical assessment would be found to be accurate.

First of all, what makes your geographical assessment any more accurate than mine? You supplied anecdotal evidence, and so did I. So far, in this thread, there are three regional testimonies that Christmas is as popular as ever, and one against it. Each of us can only testify to what we see.

Secondly, I think any removal of Christ from Christmas has been done by Christian commercialization of the holiday, and not attempts by atheists to undo it. In other words, any real War on Christmas has been waged by its celebrants and not anyone else. To be sure, the possibility that kids don't grow up thinking the holiday is about merchandise and the birth of Santa Claus, might actually be the thing that saves and not ruins the institution.

[Amfdaaandhaq]

Incidentally, in a nod to situational irony, I have to run off to my office's Christmas luncheon. I'll be back later to discuss...

[HRS1H7gO]

Incidentally, in a nod to situational irony, I have to run off to my office's Christmas luncheon. I'll be back later to discuss...

Good , have a cup of nog for me...............then when you get back proceed to convince me that anti Xmas only exists south of the Mason Dixon line. (like racism)

[arrismVam]

Dr........to be fair, I think the no Christ in Christmas workplaces, schools, stores, etc can be found scattered throughout our 50 states. I don't think your geographical assessment would be found to be accurate.

I don't know. As I've said before, I live in a heavily liberal area, too, and there is definitely no shortage of Christmas around here. Christmas lights, Christmas trees, Nativity scenes, Mall Santas, Christmas music blaring in every store, wreaths, reindeer, everything is in abundance in both home and store. There is a Christmas tree and a giant wreath in the lobby of my office building that I walk past every morning.

I'd almost go out on a limb and say that Christmas has been getting bigger and even more extravagant these last couple of years.

If there is some sort of war on Christmas, Christmas is winning by a huge margin in this extremely liberal area...maybe we could send the Virginia Defense Force over to you guys in the bible belt and give you some help?

[Peapeuddedbaw]

I don't know. As I've said before, I live in a heavily liberal area, too, and there is definitely no shortage of Christmas around here. Christmas lights, Christmas trees, Nativity scenes, Mall Santas, Christmas music blaring in every store, wreaths, reindeer, everything is in abundance in both home and store. There is a Christmas tree and a giant wreath in the lobby of my office building that I walk past every morning.

I'd almost go out on a limb and say that Christmas has been getting bigger and even more extravagant these last couple of years.

If there is some sort of war on Christmas, Christmas is winning by a huge margin in this extremely liberal area...maybe we could send the Virginia Defense Force over to you guys in the bible belt and give you some help?

Maybe we should load up the kids and grandkids and shop and celebrate in Virginia! Are the Target and wal-Mart stores in VA decorated, stocked and playing Christmas music? They damn sure arent here. Our independent businesses are, but the mega retailers arent.
Living in a small community limits your shopping choices. This Christmas thing has really soured me on some retailers.

[Finkevannon]

Liberal New Yorker here - Christmas seems to be alive and well here too. I was even in Target the other night (gasp!) and they had plenty of decorations up, although I didn't notice any signs saying "Merry Christmas". Plenty of Christmas tree shaped decorations though.

Just went to my companys Christmas party the other night - it wasn't a "Holiday" party.

The wife and I are going shopping in Manhattan tonight, as we always do at Christmas time, to enjoy all the lights and decorated trees. I wish I had a digital camera to capture the proof that Christmas is alive and well.

[zlopikanikanza]

Oh yeah, I almost forgot to point out that my OP didn't include any of these words:

liberal
democrat
far left

It was merely a comparison of then and now mixed with some genuine sadness for todays kids.

[Buhoutsoupfap]

Maybe we should load up the kids and grandkids and shop and celebrate in Virginia! Are the Target and wal-Mart stores in VA decorated, stocked and playing Christmas music? They damn sure arent here. Our independent businesses are, but the mega retailers arent.
Living in a small community limits your shopping choices. This Christmas thing has really soured me on some retailers.

Last time I was in Target was right after Thanksgiving and they did seem to have quite a few decorations up and for sale. Don't recall whether they had Christmas music playing or not.

The Walmart is a half hour drive west, so I haven't been there in forever. Told you it was a liberal area....

[MicoSiru]

Wally World in Danville is decorated if I remember correctly.

[Nutpoode]

I wish I had a digital camera to capture the proof that Christmas is alive and well.

Yea, I was thinking about this the other day. I should start taking pictures with my camera phone of all the massive displays of Christmas in my area to show that Christmas is still hoppin'...

One day, the people in the Bible Belt will realize that liberals are just stealing all their Christmas stuff and bringing it back to liberal parts of the country, so that they can have the greatest Christmas ever...

"Where the hell did we get all these wreaths and decorations and christmas trees!?"
"Dude, it's practically a free-for-all in the Bible Belt, just go and complain about something, take it out of the garbage when it gets taken down, then bring it back here!"

[angeldimmon]

Did anyone know that in 2003, the ACLU stepped into defend kids who had been suspended from school for selling candy-canes?
http://www.aclu.org/religion/tencomm...s20050302.html

Top Ten ways you know you're a really fjewked up antichristian nazi:

10...
9...
8...
7...
6...
5...
4...
3...
2...
1 Even the ACLU is telling you to chill.

[Adeniinteme]

Top Ten ways you know you're a really fjewked up antichristian nazi:

10...
9...
8...
7...
6...
5...
4...
3...
2...
1 Even the ACLU is telling you to chill.

That's, like, only one way.

[investor]

Did he get that list off of the Letterman show?