[leadmoffer]

Many people have noticed similarities between what happened in Germany in the 1930's and what is happening now in America. This recent article explores some of the parallels.

Fascism then. Fascism now?

The Toronto Star
Nov. 27, 2005

When people think of fascism, they imagine Rows of goose-stepping storm troopers and puffy-chested dictators. What they don't see is the economic and political process that leads to the nightmare.

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/Con...d=970599119419

[Vipvlad]

This is so monumentally stupid it's astounding. Now the Canadians have a history of having frozen bains but this article and thread take the cake.
Canada is in far greater danger of slipping into a communist dictatorship than the US ever was or will be of becoming a fascist state.
This is so stupid it surprises me that these people can even write.
I'm not going to comment any further because these morons at the Toronto Star (red star?) don't know their history or more likely are having a bad case of penis envy. I can understand the originator of this thread not knowing diddly about history and what let to the rise of the fascists in Germany. I can understand that. Lot's of folks don't know shit about historical events and how they apply today, but a newspaper should know better.

[shemadagaswer]

I need to add that Canada is on the verge of flying appart with the result that the US is going to be obligated to pick up the pieces and the American taxpayer will be bailing out and rescuing yet another bunch of losers.

Canada heading toward breakup , Ignatieff warns
"Mission Accomplished"? You make the country weak and then you privatize everything. It works perfectly for the World Bank in debt ridden countries but this formula will work equally as well right here in resource rich Canada. The Corporation is winning the war.
(4Canada)

Toronto Star, April 16, 2005
ISABEL TEOTONIO
STAFF REPORTER

The current political crisis in Ottawa is destroying national unity and hurtling Canada toward a constitutional crisis, Harvard scholar Michael Ignatieff said yesterday at Osgoode Hall Law School in Toronto.

Whenever the next election rolls around, Quebec nationalist parties will likely swell in support and with that surge comes a renewed call for separation, he warned. But this time, a referendum to separate could result in an "unequivocally" clear result.
http://www.vivelecanada.ca/article.p...50416095316670 I think Canadians would do well to worry about their own country and less about the US except as it relates to how they are going to act when most of Canada becomes part of the US.
Shit, they are going to have to forget socialism and start worrying about working for a living instead of sponging off others.
Sad, sad.

[AK47rulz]

This is so monumentally stupid it's astounding. Now the Canadians have a history of having frozen bains but this article and thread take the cake.
Canada is in far greater danger of slipping into a communist dictatorship than the US ever was or will be of becoming a fascist state.
This is so stupid it surprises me that these people can even write.
I'm not going to comment any further because these morons at the Toronto Star (red star?) don't know their history or more likely are having a bad case of penis envy. I can understand the originator of this thread not knowing diddly about history and what let to the rise of the fascists in Germany. I can understand that. Lot's of folks don't know shit about historical events and how they apply today, but a newspaper should know better.

In other words, shoot the messenger!!!

"Anti-fascism" indeed!

An excellent article, well worth reading.

[ClaudeMarkus]

This is so monumentally stupid it's astounding. Now the Canadians have a history of having frozen bains but this article and thread take the cake.
Canada is in far greater danger of slipping into a communist dictatorship than the US ever was or will be of becoming a fascist state.
This is so stupid it surprises me that these people can even write.
I'm not going to comment any further because these morons at the Toronto Star (red star?) don't know their history or more likely are having a bad case of penis envy. I can understand the originator of this thread not knowing diddly about history and what let to the rise of the fascists in Germany. I can understand that. Lot's of folks don't know shit about historical events and how they apply today, but a newspaper should know better.

Perhaps an American spin to the same effect. #7 stands out to me as being "already in the process".

http://mvp-seattle.com/pages/pageFascism.htm

[envenonearo]

Geez Louise, what a bunch of idiotic Liberal claptrap.
Waaa, waaa, me want my mommy!
Liberals can't get elected to dog catcher in the US so they resort to this kind of moronic idiocy.
No wonder Americans won't elect Democrats and don't trust them.
I consider anything political coming out of a blue state as so much whiney-baby, America hating trash.
God forbid we ever allow another Democrat to occupy the White House!

[Vobomei]

Geez Louise, what a bunch of idiotic Liberal claptrap.
Waaa, waaa, me want my mommy!

This doesn't surprise anyone.

I consider anything political coming out of a blue state as so much whiney-baby, America hating trash.

Indeed, I consider anything at all coming out of you to be the same.

[Jesslovers]

I was actually nodding in agreement with much of this article, up until this point:

It was the liberals of that era who clamoured for unfettered personal and economic freedom, no matter what the cost to society. Such untrammelled freedom is not suitable to civilized humans. It is the freedom of the jungle. In other words, the strong have more of it than the weak. It is a notion of freedom that is inherently violent, because it is enjoyed at the expense of others. Such a notion of freedom legitimizes each and every increase in the wealth and power of those who are already powerful, regardless of the misery that will be suffered by others as a result. The use of the state to limit such "freedom" was denounced by the laissez-faire liberals of the early 20th century. The use of the state to protect such "freedom" was fascism. Just as monopoly is the ruin of the free market, fascism is the ultimate degradation of liberal capitalism. A little too much reflexive hostility here towards the capitalist economic model that built the current prosperity of the US, Canada, Great Britain, Australia et al. At any rate, the "freedom of the jungle" mentioned here is merely an inevitable reflection of human nature, not bound to any political economic model. Scratch the surface of notionally socialist nation-states like France and you'll find just as much social and economic inequality. Even in such bastions of "enlightened" welfare-capitalism as Canada and the Scandinavian countries you still get monied elites, the educated outperforming the under-educated, the more talented rising further in society than the unskilled, etc, etc.

Furthermore, I have to point out that people on the left of politics cry "fascism" so often that the term has lost all credibility and applicability. Indeed even one of my best friends, a Green/Anarchist/Socialist university student, regards any political viewpoint even slightly right-of-centre as "fascist", including traditional democratic conservatism, classical liberalism, and libertarianism!

[venediene]

Furthermore, I have to point out that people on the left of politics cry "fascism" so often that the term has lost all credibility and applicability. Indeed even one of my best friends, a Green/Anarchist/Socialist university student, regards any political viewpoint even slightly right-of-centre as "fascist", including traditional democratic conservatism, classical liberalism, and libertarianism!

People on the 'right' tend to protest a mite bit too much with little more than character assassination whenever the word is raised. This is very suspicious behaviour (self-incriminating) and this tends to confirm the accusation rather than addressing it.

But this thread is located in the partisan cesspool section of the site so I don't expect to (or plan to) engage in any substantive discussion here at all upon the topic.

For all intents and purposes, fascism is best understood as the political philosophy of 'might makes right'. Now just take a step back and consider who are the ones making that argument... I heard it a hundred times in the justification for the invasion of Iraq...

[andrekuper]

People on the 'right' tend to protest a mite bit too much with little more than character assassination whenever the word is raised. This is very suspicious behaviour (self-incriminating) and this tends to confirm the accusation rather than addressing it.

That hasn't been my experience, at least not here in Australia - I can't speak with much authority on the North American state of affairs, of course. If you took a look at the current state of Australian politics, one of the first things you would notice is the frequency with which the Howard Government and the Liberal Party in general get accused of being "fascist", by a whole spectrum of their political critics: unions, churches, student activist groups, the Greens, Labour Party MPs, and so on. And it has to be said that this is a patently ridiculous accusation - while the Liberals are a conservative party, conservatism in the Australian mould has a much more moderate political philosophy than, for example, the US Republicans or even the British Tories. In tone and policy, the Howard government are closer akin to Tony Blair's New Labour or fiscal-conservative US Democrats. Pertinent example - it is currently fashionable to cry "fascist" over the government's new industrial relations reform package, which apparently will put us back 100 years, strangle the labour union movement, and generally make us all slaves of Big Business (the avatar of all that is evil). The joke is that, even after the reforms go through, Australia will still have a labour market that is more protected and tightly regulated than such social democracies as Canada, New Zealand, Denmark and the UK!

The danger is that by crying wolf on "fascism" whenever and wherever we disagree with a conservative government's (usually democratic!) agenda, we diminish our ability to confront that political philosophy when it does rear its ugly head. China, Singapore, Burma, Iran, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, even Russia : these are examples of nation-states which are already following a fascist agenda in all but name, or starting to travel down that path, and need to be firmly confronted over the issue. The United States on the other hand is just a capitalist democracy with a bungling, disconnected, and corporate-sympathetic government which isn't going to last beyond the end of GWB's second term. I would have to credit the Bush administration and the Republican right with some level of actual competence and intelligent planning ability, before believing they could get away with implementing some sort of German or Italian-style fascist state!

[cxddfrxc]

If it were to happen, it would be like a thief in the night. It would have to be brought on by another catastrophe. Another terrorist act that would stun Americans into inactivity (deer in headlights). Timing being right before election. The Prez would halt elections as that would be a vunerable time. The remainder of the Patriot Act would become fully implemented and executed. The draft would shortly follow to march soldiers into some other land. Then...another attack on U.S. soil!! Martial Law is declared, interest rates frozen, the media corralled (except for FOX, they were given the heads ups) The national symbol becomes a single white star on a field of blue. National guard police the cities, and voila, David Bowie singin," This is not America. Nooo"

I scared myself......