[spineeupsenry]

OK, I have a question that is not easily answered by my current contacts and I am wondering in Kendo-World can help.

I'm looking for shoes to practice on mats with. Crazy but serious, I've looked at soft dance shoes and wrestling shoes.

I currently practice iaido on Zebra Training mats (the 1 1/2 inch thick mat used for contact martial arts) twice a week for the last 3 1/2 years. They are killing my feet and I now suffer from a hyper extended left big toe. Also my ankles ache too from balancing on the stuff.

I have no foot or ankle problems on a hard surface. Removal of the mats during practice is not an option. And now I hear I'm now starting 4 times a week training on the mats. OW!

I correctly tape the toe and wear light tabi. Although the tape is effective at first, it looses grip with sweat and doesn't work by the 3rd tatei-heiza routine. (A rather severe sitting on toes posture.) Not to mention taping a toe is a lot of tape X 4 days a week is quite pricey.

Any alternatives for footwear out there that won't harm mats? Has anyone experienced this?

Sincerely,
Netty

[gundos]

Hi,

Take a look at Tae Kwon Do shoes (the WTF style ones by Adidas, for instance). Talk to your sensei first and see if they would be allowed (and I would also suggest talking to a podiatrist and see what they recommend before trying/buying anything).

http://www.google.ca/search?q=adidas...efox-a&safe=on

[Jesslovers]

Thanks. I'll look into the suggestion it's the most promising in my seach for a shoe.

I will be seeing a foot doc from my clinic to see if the type of acceptable shoe (or shoes) I find in my search will do the support I need before I buy a pair.

I forgot to mention soft sole or leather sole shoes are permitted by the facility, and shoes that won't interfere with seiza type practice by my sensei.

Anyone else has suggestions/confirmations/experience?

[trowUrillioth]

I've never used these but they might be useful: http://www.vibramfivefingers.com/

[inhitoemits]

A suggestion is kung fu shoes with cotton soles. These are soft and thin, and I think they will be more quiet on the mats than shoes with rubber soles. Also they have no ties etc that you will feel in seiza.

[itsmycock]

Neil,

Whoa? Now those are different shoes. I used to rockclimb years ago and those shoes are a considerable advancement from what I used to wear.

For as how unconventional they look, it'd probably give the toe support I need for martial arts and the freedom I need for iai as I would need in rock climbing (everything on the big toe). But would my sensei accept my taste in shoes? Luckly the shoe is stocked at the local climbing places so I'll check them out as a wild card pick.

If on the way off chance these are a pick to use, I'll let you guys know.

Thanks

[Maypeevophy]

A suggestion is kung fu shoes with cotton soles. These are soft and thin, and I think they will be more quiet on the mats than shoes with rubber soles. Also they have no ties etc that you will feel in seiza.

I looked at Kung fu shoes online early in my search, but they were well padded. Do you have a link to an example?

Thanks

[MeatteCen]

I don't know if the Vibram ones will work for you either, I just showed them as another data point. They might work well for outdoor kendo practice. Personally I'd be looking at leather dance shoes, like the soft shoes Irish dancers wear (the ladies' ones, not the mens' shoes with the heel).

[8jIDXQ80]

Does anyone else in the group have this trouble, or similar? I have only ever trained once on mats. It's not possible to iaido well on mats. I know some clubs that have a dojo with mats and they have terrible trouble working on a wooden floor.
Do any other clubs do iaido on mats? The reason I ask is because I wonder if you could suggest moving to a different hall where there is a wooden floor, especially if you are going to be increasing to more nights a week.

Wearing shoes is likely to be not much help for your iaido, even if it helps the toe. 2 wrongs don't make a right. While it might take the pain out of your feet you are not going to be learning how to control your contact with the ground. iaido is designed to be performed with bare feet on a wooden floor for many reasons, not just tradition, and this part of your iaido will be lost.

Having said all of the above, I'm concerned about your comment concerning tate hiza. You should not be sitting on your toes, tate hiza should not cause you this kind of trouble. If it is and its hurting on mats you are definitely not sitting in tate hiza correctly. it should be possible on a solid floor, so if it hurts on mats you need to find out why. I wonder therefore if you are not sitting correctly in seiza too, and therefore I wonder if it is the way you are sitting that is the problem, especially if, as I suspect, you are the only person having this trouble.

[Appenianags]

This type: http://www.bokleipo.com/product_info...2b6a71f969e8ea

E-bogu also have a similar type without laces, but with a rubber sole.

[inve.tment]

Neil,

Whoa? Now those are different shoes. I used to rockclimb years ago and those shoes are a considerable advancement from what I used to wear.

For as how unconventional they look, it'd probably give the toe support I need for martial arts and the freedom I need for iai as I would need in rock climbing (everything on the big toe). But would my sensei accept my taste in shoes? Luckly the shoe is stocked at the local climbing places so I'll check them out as a wild card pick.

If on the way off chance these are a pick to use, I'll let you guys know.

Thanks

Hi, long time lurker, first time poster
I picked up some Five Fingers two weeks ago, and I can honestly say they're the only shoes I've worn since. I love 'em, and I'll recommend them for outdoor practise in a heartbeat. For mat training, though; not so much. As they're made to feel like you're barefooting it, there's not really a whole lot of support going on. But by all means, get a pair anyway! Then you too can enjoy the weird looks and snide remarks that follow when wearing a pair of foot gloves

[cjOTw7ov]

[QUOTE=H.Sandsleth;333966]This type: http://www.bokleipo.com/product_info...2b6a71f969e8ea

Thanks for the link. That looks like good footware. For some reason, search engines were brining up a more sparing padded type shoe and I dismissed the 'kung fu' title immediately.

Thanks again.

[gechaheritt]

Wookiesmurf,

Thanks for the info! I'll probably look to get a pair anyway for the outdoorsy non-martial stuff I do based on the your recommendation.

Thanks Neil for bringing them up. I do appreciate it.

Netty

[Unhappu]

OK I found a couple of pictures on the net to help explain the situation for the foot in case I have my terms mixed up as well as my spelling.

This link shows the agressive form tate hiza which requires some painful footwork. (Note the superflexed toe)

http://www.hvezdicka.cz/galerie/staz.../DSC_1392.html

This link shows the neutral form of tate hiza which isn't so painful as it is immobile.

http://www.hvezdicka.cz/galerie/staz.../DSC_1016.html

Hope this helps explain why and what type of shoes I need for my gaijin feet. :-)

[Escamsrasiush]

I bought the cotton sole for my motherin law for tai chi and she swears by them.

http://www.taichifinder.co.uk/index....6dee6578673e89

They seem cheap enough to take a punt on.

[layedgebiamma]

OK I found a couple of pictures on the net to help explain the situation for the foot in case I have my terms mixed up as well as my spelling.

This link shows the agressive form tate hiza which requires some painful footwork. (Note the superflexed toe)

http://www.hvezdicka.cz/galerie/staz.../DSC_1392.html

Those pictures just show the differences in the posture at complete rest (the second), and live toes at nukitsuke or notto.

So your group stays in active toes the whole time you're down in tatehiza? Interesting. What style do you study?

[bubborn]

Who can tell me whether is there a kendo club in Brunel or University of Brunel.

[kasandrasikl]

OK I found a couple of pictures on the net to help explain the situation for the foot in case I have my terms mixed up as well as my spelling.

This link shows the agressive form tate hiza which requires some painful footwork. (Note the superflexed toe)

http://www.hvezdicka.cz/galerie/staz.../DSC_1392.html

This link shows the neutral form of tate hiza which isn't so painful as it is immobile.

http://www.hvezdicka.cz/galerie/staz.../DSC_1016.html

Hope this helps explain why and what type of shoes I need for my gaijin feet. :-)

The posture in the first of these 2 pictures is called Iai goshi kamae, the 2nd is called tate hiza. Iai goshi kamae is generally (though not exclusively) a zanshin kamae in iaido, much like jodan and hasso in the seitei gata. Some schools use it as a starting position for kata.

Tate hiza means raised or vertical knee (shin) to identify it from Seiza no kamae. It is a resting position like Seiza and you should be able to sit in that position in a relaxed manner for extended periods.

My initial response, expressing concern that the OPs posture might be wrong as he was uncomfortable in tate Hiza was expressly relevant to the resting position. Siting in iaigoshi kamae on mats is very uncomfortable as it causes the toes, especially the big toe, to bend too far back as the foot sinks into the mats. This will not be resolved by using any form of footwear, if anything it will be made worse.

[Peptobismol]

Alright, I have a sports foot doctor appt on Monday. Yay! I'm bringing some choices of footware including some posted. Thanks for the links.

Between my Sensei and the doc I should find something to help. I'll let you guys know the results.

Thanks for the correct terms. It is a common form in iaido. The man in the picture is 7th Dan in Muso Shinden and 8th Dan in Aikito. The iai goshi kamae shown is during the noto and zanshin period of the kata. This particular position I have seen held for 30 excrusiating seconds in video.

Unfortunately, The Senseis (more than one style) I train under request not to post on the forum without consulting and require that the dojo or the style not be included in the discussion. I find this rather wise and why I'm mostly a lurker.

Netty

[irresseni]

Unfortunately, The Senseis (more than one style) I train under request not to post on the forum without consulting and require that the dojo or the style not be included in the discussion. I find this rather wise and why I'm mostly a lurker.

Netty

It isn't Chikara is it? It's the St. Paul Budokan dojo, and they may or may not be also still using this name still for their dojo. They teach multiple "arts" that are crap because the so-called sensei has no formal training in JSA.) We've dealt with them here before. And, I wouldn't be surprised if they had made up this new policy due to the bashing their sensei who posted, got here.

Only McDojo(fake) people say this kind of stupid stuff. If they are so danged secret there is NO point in studying with these people. There are only two legitimate dojos in all of Minnesota for Iaido and BOTH do not mind their dojos and style being mentioned. And, there are no legitimate kenjutsu dojos in Minnesota either, which the St. Paul Budokan also claims to teach, but they don't. It was all made up.

Oh yeah, and if you are up North in the Duluth area, there is a McDojo claiming to teach iai and kenjutsu too, and the guy is self-taught and should not be teaching.

You need to visit both the Mutokai Iaido dojo-they teach MSR(Muso Shinden Ryu) Iaido in Minneapolis and the Twin Cities Toyama Ryu batto-do dojo which is also Iaido.

These are the only dojos you should be associating yourself with, and it is ok in any real dojo, to tell what you study and post on a forum about it.

I will be back with links to these dojos for you. I have to go do a few things first.

Kaoru