[ZonaPutaX]

Dear friends,

I'd be interested in hearing your comments about this sutta.



WILL ALL BEINGS ATTAIN LIBERATION? (AN 10.95)


On one occasion a wandering ascetic named Uttiya approached the Blessed One. After exchanging greetings and cordial talk, he sat down to one side and asked the Blessed One:

“How is it, Master Gotama: is the world eternal—is only this true and everything else false?”
“This, Uttiya, I have not declared: that the world is eternal; and that only this is true and everything else false.”

“How then, Master Gotama: is the world non-eternal—is only this true and everything else false?” “That, too, Uttiya, I have not declared: that the world is non-eternal; and that only this is true and everything else false.”

“How is it, Master Gotama: is the world finite or infinite? Are the life principle and the body
the same or different? Does the Tathāgata exist after death or does he not exist after death? Does he exist as well as not exist or neither exist nor not exist after death? Is any one of these statements the only one that is true and everything else false?”

“All that, Uttiya, I have not declared: that the world is finite … that the Tatāgata neither
exists nor does not exist after death; nor do I declare that any one of these statements is the only true one and everything else false.”

“But how is it, Master Gotama? To all my questions you have replied that you have not sodeclared. What, after all, does Master Gotama actually declare?”

“Having directly known it, Uttiya, I have taught the Dhamma to my disciples for the
purification of beings, for getting beyond sorrow and lamentation, for the ending of pain and grief, for attaining to the method of liberation and for realising Nibbāna.”

“But if Master Gotama, from direct knowledge, teaches the Dhamma to his disciples for the purification of beings, for getting beyond sorrow and lamentation, for the ending of pain and grief, for attaining to the method of liberation and for realising Nibbāna, will the whole world thereby be emancipated, or half of it or a third part of it?”

At these words, the Blessed One kept silent.

Then this thought occurred to the Venerable Ānanda: “May Uttiya the wanderer not conceive a harmful opinion, by thinking, ’When I asked the ascetic Gotama a question on an ultimate issue, he foundered and did not reply. Probably he was unable to do so.’ For such a view would bring harm and suffering to Uttiya for a long time.”

Then the Venerable Ānanda turned to Uttiya, saying: “I shall give you a simile, friend Uttiya, for with the help of a simile intelligent people may come to understand the meaning of what was said.

“Suppose, friend Uttiya, there is a king’s border town, with strong ramparts and turrets on sound foundations, and with a single gate. There is also a gate-keeper, intelligent, experienced and prudent, who keeps out people unknown and admits only those who are known. That gatekeeper walks along the path that girdles the town all round, and while doing so he does not notice in the ramparts any hole or opening, not even one big enough for a cat to slip through. Though he does not have the knowledge of how many creatures enter the town or leave it, yet he does know this: ’Any larger creatures that enter or leave this town can do so only by this gate.’

“Similarly, friend Uttiya, the Tathāgata is not concerned with whether the entire world will be emancipated by his teaching or half of it or a third part.

But the Tathāgata is aware that whosoever has been emancipated, is now emancipated or will be emancipated from the world all these will do so by removing the five hindrances that defile the mind and weaken understanding, by firmly establishing their minds in the four foundations of mindfulness, and by cultivating the seven factors of enlightenment in their true nature.

That same question, friend Uttiya, which you had asked the Blessed One before, you have asked him again in another way.”

https://mywebspace.wisc.edu/jrblack/...anguttara3.pdf



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[Battwenue]

Hi Aloka

I think this is one of the really difficult questions to give a clear answer to, but out of what i understand and how i see this sutta, Maybe Buddha did not answer clear on this question because He knew that if he answer it all mankind would not need to think and wonder about this.

“But if Master Gotama, from direct knowledge, teaches the Dhamma to his disciples for the purification of beings, for getting beyond sorrow and lamentation, for the ending of pain and grief, for attaining to the method of liberation and for realising Nibbāna, will the whole world thereby be emancipated, or half of it or a third part of it?” In my mind and understanding not everyone can reach this.
Example, How can animals cultivate Buddhism? you can say, well you just read the text to them. That maybe one way but do the really understand what you want to tell them? can they reflect on your words?

The thinker

[Poll Pitt]

My answer would be maybe.
There are an infinite number of beings and an infinite number of worlds, the universe is a really big place, as well as other realms.
For any being to become Liberated/Enlightened they must first find the Dharma. Then practice and study/contemplate/meditate on it.
Also there would have to be the fortunate event of a Buddha to present the Dharma.
Our world was fortunate to have this happen.
And we were fortunate to have a precious human birth in which to experience the Dharma.

As to animals my friend, I believe they can understand the words. Our dogs and cats will sit and listen intently when I do my practice. I'm not too sure if they are able to reflect on this though. But who knows.
They also sit or lay around very peacefully when I meditate. I feel fortunate that our home is almost always a very peaceful place to be. I should mention I'm the only Buddhist in our home, but there is no "issue" with that, my family accepts this.

[Centurnion]

Hi theseeking1

I am agree that the cats i have get really calm when i meditate and sometimes one of them crawl in to my lap and sleep there under my meditation. I believe we have a energy field they notice when we meditate and this make them calmer

The thinker

[VastDrura]

Originally Posted by AN 10.95 "But if Master Gotama, from direct knowledge, teaches the Dhamma to his disciples for the purification of beings, for getting beyond sorrow and lamentation, for the ending of pain and grief, for attaining to the method of liberation and for realising Nibbāna, will the whole world thereby be emancipated, or half of it or a third part of it?”

In my mind and understanding not everyone can reach this.
Example, How can animals cultivate Buddhism? you can say, well you just read the text to them. That maybe one way but do the really understand what you want to tell them? can they reflect on your words?
I don't think that the sutta is suggesting that animals in particular cultivate Buddhism. Saying "the whole world" is just using general terms to illustrate a point. Ananda goes on to say :

“Similarly, friend Uttiya, the Tathāgata is not concerned with whether the entire world will be emancipated by his teaching or half of it or a third part.

But the Tathāgata is aware that whosoever has been emancipated, is now emancipated or will be emancipated from the world all these will do so by removing the five hindrances that defile the mind and weaken understanding, by firmly establishing their minds in the four foundations of mindfulness, and by cultivating the seven factors of enlightenment in their true nature. "

[eI7iqNot]

I know that is was not used the word animals but i meant to say that it is only humans who can cultivate, but if you was reading to your animal to hope it could get a understanding, this i think would be impossible

[Frinzer]

“But if Master Gotama, from direct knowledge, teaches the Dhamma to his disciples for the purification of beings, for getting beyond sorrow and lamentation, for the ending of pain and grief, for attaining to the method of liberation and for realising Nibbāna, will the whole world thereby be emancipated, or half of it or a third part of it?” Was the Buddha suppose to have the power to predict the future?

[outdog]

Uttiya's question is unbeneficial as it doesn't conduce to his liberation. His primary concern should be his own emancipation. He too has asked questions irrelevant to the goal.


“Similarly, friend Uttiya, the Tathāgata is not concerned with whether the entire world will be emancipated by his teaching or half of it or a third part.

But the Tathāgata is aware that whosoever has been emancipated, is now emancipated or will be emancipated from the world all these will do so by removing the five hindrances that defile the mind and weaken understanding, by firmly establishing their minds in the four foundations of mindfulness, and by cultivating the seven factors of enlightenment in their true nature. "