[Narkeere]

Hi,

I grabbed up the Majjhima Nikaya off of amazon because in a lot of the more introductory books of selections from the Pali Canon - I saw this one in the footnotes being referenced a lot

I see that it's the second book of the five suttas so I'm going to invest in the Digha Nikaya just to sort of start from the beginning.

Is there really any major differences in teachings and doctrines if I go from studying the Pali Canon to something more removed from Theravada say as Zen?

I have been reading a lot zen centered books - and I am starting to see differences where in the more original teachings of Buddhism it seems to be about going against the stream while in a Taoist influence school of Buddhism seems to be about going with the flow of things.

Maybe I've got it wrong - and if I do - that may be just exactly a problem I am going to run into when I am mixing my area of focus.

Any help would be appreciated! Thanks!

[ibiDb4uu]

hi Gerrard

imo, practising is the most important thing. Zen may encourage a more smooth practise

this is because, imo, the Zen verses were spoken to smooth out what can be perceived as a rather 'regimented' Pali teachings

personally, i was a practitioner well before i read the suttas and the "going against the stream" discourses in the Pali suttas never did resonate with me

it is best to go with & test one school for a suitable period of time. so there is no harm in exploring the Zen instruction

with metta

element

[Nifoziyfar]

There are big differences in methods of practice and approaches in different traditions and schools.

As Element suggests above it is necessary to stick with one approach for enough time to see if it is a good fit for you as an individual, especially in how it relates to the core teachings.

The problem I see with not doing this, is that it would be easy to miss the essential features and get caught up with focusing on minor aspects.

Beginning with studying the Tripikata is a sound beginning and I can see how individual study could be enhanced by having some instruction from one of the Theravadian schools to aid understanding and beginning practice.

[annouhMus]

I see that it's the second book of the five suttas so I'm going to invest in the Digha Nikaya just to sort of start from the beginning.

to add, the Digha Nikaya does not represent the beginning. much of it, probably most of it, was composed after buddha's death

buddha started here: Three Cardinal Discourses of the Buddha

John Ireland's translation of the Itivuttaka is also a very good starting point

[kHy87gPC]

to add, the Digha Nikaya does not represent the beginning. much of it, probably most of it, was composed after buddha's death

buddha started here: Three Cardinal Discourses of the Buddha

John Ireland's translation of the Itivuttaka is also a very good starting point

At Access to Insight - I have read this quote -

" Recent scholarship suggests that a distinguishing trait of the Digha Nikaya may be that it was "intended for the purpose of propaganda, to attract converts to the new religion."

Bhikkhu Bodhi, Connected Discourses of the Buddha (Somerville, Mass.: Wisdom Publications, 2000), p.31, referring to Joy Manné's "Categories of Sutta in the Pali Nikayas and Their Implications for Our Appreciation of the Buddhist Teaching and Literature," Journal of the Pali Text Society 15 (1990): 29-87.

[Knongargoapex]

for me, the Sigalovada Sutta is essential reading and the Maha-parinibbana Sutta is important historically (and spiritually)

however, apart from those two, the suttas in DN have always felt rather alien to me (even before i learned about their history)

[Rexaviennatutr]

Beginning with studying the Tripikata is a sound beginning and I can see how individual study could be enhanced by having some instruction from one of the Theravadian schools to aid understanding and beginning practice.

Or indeed to provide important revelations and aids to later practice, as I discovered personally with the suttas and a teacher of the Theravada Forest Tradition, after 20 years of previous involvement with Tibetan Buddhism.

.

[intifatry]

Not sure what you mean by "going against the stream" but if it means that the dhamma is more towards the super mundane than the worldly dhamma, then I have to say that most of the suttas in the majjhima nikaya are such. The MN probably is not the best starting point for a complete beginner.

I agree with what others have said. I personally encourage you to look into the teachings of the Thai forest tradition. Most of the teachings are not contradictory to the suttas but in plain, clear, simple language. It seems like a good palce to start imo

[Xqjfxmfk]

Thanks for the replies guys!

As Element suggests above it is necessary to stick with one approach for enough time to see if it is a good fit for you as an individual, especially in how it relates to the core teachings.

My practice of meditation ultimately is going to be more Zen focused because that is the source from which I learned about meditation.

I can see how certain problems may arise in having two different areas of focus but ultimately I like being knee deep in searching and understanding the differences. I do see however that I may get caught up in minor issues so I need to have some discernment. Ultimately going against the stream or going with the stream is a minor issue of a choice in metaphor. The major issue is how I deal with the arising of negative traits in myself and as I've been learning so far in the MN that it takes wise attention and mindfulness how to decline negative traits.

The problem I see with not doing this, is that it would be easy to miss the essential features and get caught up with focusing on minor aspects.

to add, the Digha Nikaya does not represent the beginning. much of it, probably most of it, was composed after buddha's death

buddha started here: Three Cardinal Discourses of the Buddha

John Ireland's translation of the Itivuttaka is also a very good starting point

I'll check out the three cardinal courses when I feel led towards reading that - I'll bookmark it.

Not sure what you mean by "going against the stream" but if it means that the dhamma is more towards the super mundane than the worldly dhamma, then I have to say that most of the suttas in the majjhima nikaya are such. The MN probably is not the best starting point for a complete beginner.

I agree with what others have said. I personally encourage you to look into the teachings of the Thai forest tradition. Most of the teachings are not contradictory to the suttas but in plain, clear, simple language. It seems like a good palce to start imo

I'll check out that as well.

As much as it seems I'm getting over my neck with all the different replies I do feel a control over not being terribly confused. I sort of am taking an objective approach to it - an aloofness from becoming too involved with identifying with the different schools I am looking into.

I like the idea of getting to the original teachings of the Buddha meanwhile looking at different opinions that evolved over time.

[GillTeepbew]

I sort of am taking an objective approach to it - an aloofness from becoming too involved with identifying with the different schools I am looking into.

I like the idea of getting to the original teachings of the Buddha meanwhile looking at different opinions that evolved over time.

Ok sounds fine. I don't think I particularly follow a certain school either. I just read the sutta pitaka and think that most of what I need to know is fortunately still there.

However, when I first started reading the nikayas, I found some suttas a bit abstruse and condensed so reading something written in more detail by a modern-day teacher can spread some light into what some suttas actually say in certain contexts. For this cross referencing, I usually go to teachers of a particular school.

[Oberjej]

Hi gerrardthor! I have been Buddhist for about 9 years, and have experienced many of the same issues you have. I've read a lot of books on the Theravada, Zen, Pure Land, and Tibetan approaches, and during most of this time practiced Pure Land.

However, about a year ago I finally decided to focus on Theravada, as I particularly like the teachings of Ajahn Chah, who was of the Thai-Forest Tradition. As I assess this process, my own psychological/karmic makeup seems to resonate more with "strictness" as opposed to "warm and fuzzy", if you will pardon my oversimplifications. Also, very recently, I have become aware of the concept of Emptiness as kind of a "bridge" or common thread amongst all the schools I've been exposed to.

Anyway, I seem to have "made peace" with this whole thing, and I'm confident that your pure heart will eventually find the correct choice for you. Best wishes on The Path, Tom

[Unonounaple]

For me the most important reading is "The long discourses of the buddha"

[intifatry]

Just my personal opinion here, so take with a shaker of salt. I think starting with some of the Pali Cannon is a very good way to start. It is a great way to get started. If you want to branch out, I really like the Heart Sutra.

[Thorwaywhobia]

For me the most important reading is "The long discourses of the buddha"

I have it on order coming in the mail soon.

What value do you see in me starting with the Digha Nikaya as a beginner?

[maliboia]

Just my personal opinion here, so take with a shaker of salt. I think starting with some of the Pali Cannon is a very good way to start. It is a great way to get started. If you want to branch out, I really like the Heart Sutra.

Do you mind giving me a general idea of what you over all take from the Heart Sutra?

[Cabinanteerip]

Do you mind giving me a general idea of what you over all take from the Heart Sutra?

I think in this case a link to the sutra would be better, simply because it is very short, and I'm not sure I can summarize something that short. Here's a link, to a google book preview of Red Pine's translation and commentary. It's what I'm currently reading and it is really good if you want to check it out. This link is just a preview so all you can see is the sutra itself, but it should be a good starting place. http://books.google.com/books?id=bZl...20pine&f=false

[Acalsenunse]

http://www.buddhanet.net/e-learning/heartstr.htm I found it here. I guess that's it. It basically sums up probably a whole lot of things I've read before. Thanks!

[carpartsho]

http://www.buddhanet.net/e-learning/heartstr.htm I found it here. I guess that's it. It basically sums up probably a whole lot of things I've read before. Thanks!

Yeah it is considered by some to be Buddhism in nutshell.