[Ygd2qr8k]

Hello


I have been reading Ajan Buddhadasa's work "me and mine". In reading the section on cessation of me and mine Ajahn writes that "when a body has died if clinging has no ceased then "I am" shall continue to arise" (paraphrased) and in the first chapter he writes that kammas effect can be felt accross lives


This struck me as Ajahn usually does not venture into such areas of discussion, so I was hoping to get any info on this from people who are more intimate with Ajahns teaching style. Also if anyone knows if this is an editing issue?


metta

[KuznehikVasaN]

Hello


I have been reading Ajan Buddhadasa's work "me and mine". In reading the section on cessation of me and mine Ajahn writes that "when a body has died if clinging has no ceased then "I am" shall continue to arise" (paraphrased) and in the first chapter he writes that kammas effect can be felt accross lives


This struck me as Ajahn usually does not venture into such areas of discussion, so I was hoping to get any info on this from people who are more intimate with Ajahns teaching style. Also if anyone knows if this is an editing issue?


metta

You might want to bounce that one off Santikaro. Looks like he is referring to what he refers to as "everyday language vs. Dhamma language" -- the putthujjana belief of "cessation of the aggregates" vs. the Dhamma of Nibbana ("cooling") of clinging to the aggregates as self.

[Filmania]

"when a body has died if clinging has no ceased then "I am" shall continue to arise"

As I understand means at the death of one ego-identification in the mind, if there is still tendency for clinging in the mind then there will be many future mental births as "I am".

kammas effect can be felt accross lives

A life here is the duration of one mental birth and death. So whatever action you do based on this mental "life span" will effect the next.

For example, you kill someone out of anger. When you killed the person you felt no regret or remorse but contentment. Once the deed is done and the police starts the investigations you start to feel scared that you will be caught. You sit down and regret killing the person. First you were born mentally as an "angry killer" and the actions done during that birth triggered, at the event of death of the angry killer, another mental birth as a "scared/guilty man". That seems to be what BB is referring to when he says "kammas effect can be felt accross lives".

I don't think it has anything to do with physical birth or rebirth

[flowersnewaho]

Hello

I have been reading Ajan Buddhadasa's work "me and mine". In reading the section on cessation of me and mine Ajahn writes that "when a body has died if clinging has no ceased then "I am" shall continue to arise" (paraphrased) and in the first chapter he writes that kammas effect can be felt accross lives

This struck me as Ajahn usually does not venture into such areas of discussion, so I was hoping to get any info on this from people who are more intimate with Ajahns teaching style. Also if anyone knows if this is an editing issue?

metta

Awesome! I so like this guy (see also my recent post on the General Buddhism Forum *)
This, to me, is the essence of rebirth, and karma - the lot. So, although I still know next to nothing of the guy, definitely not an editing issue as far as I am concerned. I never used to understand rebirth and karma, but it is well explained here by this man. I can try to talk about it further in my own way, but this may well lead to lively diversifying discussions. Nothing stopping us, however, to discuss it further in private messages. Let me know.

j

*) http://www.buddhismwithoutboundaries...p?topic=3185.0

[Hixinfineedom]

This, to me, is the essence of rebirth, and karma - the lot. So, although I still know next to nothing of the guy, definitely not an editing issue as far as I am concerned.

Dear Jan

All I can say is your point of view is mere speculation.

I listened to this guy speak in person when he was alive possibly over 50 times.

There is either a translation issue here or it is a kind of play with words to reinforce a point, that is, something like "me and mine" is so strong in the mind of humans that even death cannot cease its babbling.

It is definitely not the way this guy taught.

Any work translated by Donald K Swearer represents probably the earliest English translations, where Buddhadasa would not have worked intimately with the translator.

The original lecture would not have been spoken to a Western audience.

Kind regards

E

[timgillmoreeztf]

The text states:

[img width=300 height=217]http://i38.tinypic.com/20p1z6b.jpg[/img]

...... Click HERE to see a larger image .........




Also, you could consider kindly requesting of Santikaro to comment.

santi@liberationpark.org

[Piemonedmow]

Originally Posted by jan This, to me, is the essence of rebirth, and karma - the lot. So, although I still know next to nothing of the guy, definitely not an editing issue as far as I am concerned.

Dear Jan

All I can say is your point of view is mere speculation.

I listened to this guy speak in person when he as alive possibly over 50 times.

There is either a translation issue here or it is a kind of play with words to reinforce a point, that is, something like "me and mine" is so strong in the mind of humans that even death cannot cease its babbling.

It is definitely not the way this guy taught.

Any work translated by Donald K Swearer represents probably the earliest English translations, where Buddhadasa would not have worked intimately with the translator.

The original lecture would not have been spoken to a Western audience.

Kind regards

E



Hey Element. Interesting. Me and mine is embedded in a falsified reality that persists. For instance, people regularly dream of diseased family members and this effects their current world. This is interwoven with associated beliefs that tend to hang around for a bit also, often millennia, as part of more general cultural beliefs.

So I like that. Possibly the guy's been misquoted, and he isn't as cool as I think he is, but the Quote Aloka-D gave, I liked also: http://www.buddhismwithoutboundaries...38793#msg38793

But I agree (even with me thinking I have awesome intuition) two quotes isn't a helluvalot. Time will tell.

[RgtrsKfR]

Possibly the guy's been misquoted, and he isn't as cool as I think he is....

What in the world is that supposed to mean?

[Trissinas]

The tenth and last defilement is Ignorance. This covers every kind of defilement not yet mentioned. The word "ignorance" refers to a condition of lack of knowledge, and in this case "knowledge" means real knowledge, correct knowledge. Naturally no creature can exist without having some knowledge, but if that knowledge is false, it has the same value as no knowledge. Most people suffer from chronic ignorance or false knowledge; most of us are benighted. The most important questions for human beings are those that ask: "What is suffering, really?," "What is the real cause of the arising of suffering?," "What is real freedom from suffering?" and "What is the real way to attain freedom from suffering?" If some individual has real knowledge, if he is free of ignorance, he is reckoned as enlightened. The totality of human knowledge is of untold extent, but the Buddha classed most of it as not essential. The Buddha's enlightenment encompassed only what need be known. The Buddha knew all that need be known. The word "omniscient" or "all - knowing" means knowing just as much as need be known: it does not include anything non-essential.
buddhadasa

[glagoliska]

Hi Inji,

Could you say how this quote is relevant ,where its been taken from and with a link to the source if possible, please?

[alanamosteller]

The tenth and last defilement is Ignorance. This covers every kind of defilement not yet mentioned. The word "ignorance" refers to a condition of lack of knowledge, and in this case "knowledge" means real knowledge, correct knowledge.

It is from Handbook for Mankind, in the essay "Emancipation from the World":

http://www.buddhanet.net/budasa12.htm

[scoussysows]

The Buddha's enlightenment encompassed only what need be known. The Buddha knew

Yes, again a practical, rather than a theoretical approach. This guy does have a good insight, and is not just following what he's reading. Thanks Inji.

[TodeImmabbedo]

Originally Posted by inji The Buddha's enlightenment encompassed only what need be known. The Buddha knew

Yes, again a practical, rather than a theoretical approach. This guy does have a good insight.... http://www.buddhanet.net/budasa2.htm

[rowneigerie]

Great, thanks

[Dayreive]

So all the good folks are in agreement that this is a possible translation issue?