[dafodilkemmy]

US Urged to Stop Sending Rice to Haiti

BBC News - US urged to stop Haiti rice subsidies

AE

[BostonDoctorTTT]

nothing other than rice?

[lionsiy]

It is the cutting of the import tariffs that Aristide signed that caused the problem- and perhaps the Haitian government will increase their import tariffs - certainly they are still holding onto the boycott against Domnican eggs and chickens which was started a few years ago under the guise of protection from the avian flu. That premise was pretty much exposed as non operative since the flu itself jumped into Haiti. The DR could not get the international certification that Haiti insisted on since it would have to quarantine all chickens And some of the those cock fighting birds travel around in big SUVs with tinted black windows, probably with their own sunglasses on. Anyway.... there is an effective boycott across the border on Dominican chickens and eggs.

The rice is not only now a staple in Haiti - wheras it used to be luxury eaten only once a week- but it is a commercial product traded across the border. I do not know how it is that it comes into Haiti cheaper than the DR with DR-CAFTA - but it does.

Now the US is not the only country which subsidizes its agriculture. The EU spends a good portion of its budget in subsidizing agriculture as well.

[Master_B]

cutting import tariffs is a good thing - haiti needs to be able to compete on the open world market.

the USA is entirely at fault by subsidizing its rice growers and destroying the haitian market.

this is the right kind of giving back: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/06/bu...hosla.html?hpw

[dumadegg]

cutting import tariffs is a good thing - haiti needs to be able to compete on the open world market.

the USA is entirely at fault by subsidizing its rice growers and destroying the haitian market.

this is the right kind of giving back: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/06/bu...hosla.html?hpw

how is cutting import tariffs making haiti more competetive?

[lionsiy]

cutting import tariffs is a good thing - haiti needs to be able to compete on the open world market.

the USA is entirely at fault by subsidizing its rice growers and destroying the haitian market.

this is the right kind of giving back: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/06/bu...hosla.html?hpw

I think it a bit naive to think that Haiti is going to be able to compete with agro business....

Joseph Steiglitz, Nobel winner and former World Bank official.. does argue that the developing world looses about 6 times the amount spent on "foreign aid" from subsidies and protective tarriffs in the developed world.

[Master_B]

how is cutting import tariffs making haiti more competetive?

because local industry learns how to compete and ends up with a long term sustainable business. see the problems in the DR now with the artificially low propane pricing due to government subsidy and the industry that built up around modifying cars to take advantage of it.

haiti has to find industries where it can have a true competitive advantage (aside from being the NGO capital of the world). yes, they do exist.

[lionsiy]

because local industry learns how to compete and ends up with a long term sustainable business. see the problems in the DR now with the artificially low propane pricing due to government subsidy and the industry that built up around modifying cars to take advantage of it.

haiti has to find industries where it can have a true competitive advantage (aside from being the NGO capital of the world). yes, they do exist.

such as what?

working in maquiadoras for 60 hours a week at 70 gourde an hour?

[Master_B]

such as what?

working in maquiadoras for 60 hours a week at 70 gourde an hour?

thats up to haiti to figure out. DR has done rather well on the same island.

there's hundreds of other caribbean and pacific islands which don't share similar proximity to the world's wealthiest market and do just fine.

its time for haitians to stop playing victim and figure things out. i hope you aren't supporting their victimhood.

[lionsiy]

thats up to haiti to figure out. DR has done rather well on the same island.

there's hundreds of other caribbean and pacific islands which don't share similar proximity to the world's wealthiest market and do just fine.

its time for haitians to stop playing victim and figure things out. i hope you aren't supporting their victimhood.

No,.. certainly not a supporter of victim hood.--

but neither do I think that their future needs to look like the DR..

there is something quite precious in Haiti ... something that travels a different path altogether.... can not really describe it...

but the DR has done well by doing what? selling off its beaches, ---- cheap tourism... prostitution,.. gambling.... narco trafficing...

at the base of it the issue is the DR is SELF SUSTAINING in food... and so Haiti has to first get back to the that point..

I am sorry -- feeling feisty today... but I do not think that anyone can promote the Capitalist model of endless growth and expanding debt...ç

imagine where the DR would be now if it had not accepted the "help " of the world bank and the imf and have stayed out of debt -- as Trujillo left it...

[Master_B]

haiti's future can be whatever they want. here's some places to look at for ideas.

List of island countries - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Name Geographic configuration Geologic location Population [Area]] (km²) Density (per km²)
Antigua and Barbuda Centred on two major islands Continental shelf
Australia Centred on one major island Australian continent
Bahamas Spread over a group of islands Continental shelf
Bahrain Centred on one major island Continental shelf
Barbados Centred on one major island Continental shelf 269,556 430 627
Brunei Part of a larger island Continental shelf
Cape Verde Spread over a group of islands Oceanic
Comoros Spread over a group of islands Oceanic
Cuba Centred on one major island Continental shelf 11,451,652 110,861 102
Cyprus[n 1] Centred on one major island (de jure)
Part of a larger island (de facto) Continental shelf 793,963 9,251 85
Dominica Centred on one major island Continental shelf
Dominican Republic Part of a larger island Continental shelf
East Timor Part of a larger island Continental shelf
Federated States of Micronesia[n 2] Spread over a group if islands Oceanic
Fiji Spread over a group of islands Oceanic
Grenada Centred on one major island Continental shelf
Haiti Part of a larger island Continental shelf
Iceland Centred on one major island Oceanic 316,252 103,000 3.1
Indonesia Spread over a group of Islands Two continental shelves 234,693,997 1,919,440 134
Ireland Part of a larger island Continental shelf 4,239,848 70273 60
Jamaica Centred on one major island Continental shelf
Japan Spread over a group of islands Continental shelf 127,433,494 377,873 337
Kiribati Spread over a group of islands Oceanic
Madagascar Centred on one major island Oceanic
Maldives Spread over a group of islands Oceanic 329,198 298 1,105
Malta Centred on one major island Continental shelf 404,500 316 1,282
Marshall Islands[n 2] Spread over a group of islands Oceanic
Mauritius Spread over a group of islands Oceanic 1,244,663 2,040 610
Nauru One island Oceanic 13,635 21 649
New Zealand Spread over a group of islands Continental shelf 4,027,947 268,680 15
Northern Cyprus[n 1] Part of a larger island Continental shelf
Palau[n 2] Spread over a group of islands Oceanic
Papua New Guinea Part of a larger island Continental shelf
Philippines Spread over a group of islands Continental shelf 88,706,300 300,000 276
Saint Kitts and Nevis Centred on two major islands Continental shelf
Saint Lucia Centred on one major island Continental shelf
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines Centred on one major island Continental shelf
Samoa Spread over a group of islands Oceanic
São Tomé and Príncipe Centred on two major islands Continental shelf
Seychelles Spread over a group of islands Oceanic 87,500 455 192
Singapore Centred on one major island Continental shelf 4,553,009 704 6,369
Solomon Islands Spread over a group of islands Oceanic
Sri Lanka Centred on one major island Continental shelf
Taiwan[n 3] Centred on one major island Continental shelf 22,911,292 36,188 633
Tonga Spread over a group of islands Oceanic
Trinidad and Tobago Centred on two major islands Continental shelf
United Kingdom Centred on one major island Continental shelf 60,587,300 244,820 246
Tuvalu Spread over a group of islands Oceanic
Vanuatu Spread over a group of islands Oceanic
[edit]Dependencies and other notable regions
Name Geographic configuration Geologic location Country
Åland[n 4] Spread over a group of islands Continental shelf Finland
Alderney Single Island Continental shelf Guernsey
United Kingdom
American Samoa Spread over a group of islands Oceanic United States
Anguilla Continental shelf United Kingdom
Aruba Single Island Continental shelf Netherlands
Ashmore and Cartier Islands Continental shelf Australia
Baker Island Single island Oceanic United States
Bermuda Single island Oceanic United Kingdom
Bouvet Island Single Island Oceanic Norway
British Indian Ocean Territory Spread over a group of islands Oceanic United Kingdom
British Virgin Islands Spread over a group of islands Continental shelf United Kingdom
Cayman Islands Spread over a group of islands Continental shelf United Kingdom
Christmas Island Centred on one major island Australia
Cocos (Keeling) Islands Centred on two major islands Australia
Cook Islands[n 5] Spread over a group of islands Oceanic New Zealand
Coral Sea Islands Spread over a group of islands Continental shelf Australia
Falkland Islands[n 6] Centred on two major islands Continental shelf United Kingdom
Faroe Islands Spread over a group of islands Denmark
French Polynesia Spread over a group of islands Oceanic France
Greenland Centred on one major island Continental shelf Denmark
Guam[n 7] Single island Oceanic United States
Guernsey Centred on one major island Continental shelf United Kingdom
Heard Island and McDonald Islands Spread over a group of islands Continental shelf Australia
Howland Island Single island Oceanic United States
Isle of Man Single Island Continental shelf United Kingdom
Jarvis Island Single island Oceanic United States
Jersey[n 8] Single island Continental shelf United Kingdom
Johnston Atoll Single island Oceanic United States
Kingman Reef Single island Oceanic United States
Macau Centred on one major island Continental shelf China
Mayotte Centred on one major island France
Midway Atoll Single island Oceanic United States
Montserrat Centred on one major island Continental shelf United Kingdom
Navassa Island Single island Continental shelf United States
New Caledonia Centred on one major island Continental shelf France
Niue[n 5] Single island Oceanic New Zealand
Netherlands Antilles[n 9] Spread over 5 major islands Continental shelf Netherlands
Norfolk Island Centred on one major island Australia
Northern Mariana Islands Spread across a group of islands Oceanic United States
Pitcairn Islands Spread over a group of islands Oceanic United Kingdom
Puerto Rico Centred on one major island Continental shelf United States
Saint Helena Oceanic United Kingdom
Saint Pierre and Miquelon Centred on two major islands Continental shelf France
Sark Single island Continental shelf Guernsey
United Kingdom
Saint Helena Oceanic United Kingdom
South Georgia and the South Sandwich Islands[n 6] Spread over a group of islands Oceanic United Kingdom
Svalbard[n 10] Spread over a group of islands Norway
Tokelau[n 5] Spread over a group of islands Oceanic New Zealand
Turks and Caicos Islands Spread over a group of islands Continental shelf United Kingdom
U.S. Virgin Islands Spread over a group of islands Continental shelf United States
Wake Island Single island Oceanic United States
Wallis and Futuna Centred on two major islands Oceanic France

[dumadegg]

because local industry learns how to compete and ends up with a long term sustainable business. see the problems in the DR now with the artificially low propane pricing due to government subsidy and the industry that built up around modifying cars to take advantage of it.

haiti has to find industries where it can have a true competitive advantage (aside from being the NGO capital of the world). yes, they do exist.

which local industry? cutting import tariffs means cheap foreign goods will flood the market, which, at least as far as agricultural products go, are often times themselves subsidized. it is not as if they were producing crappy tv's and jeans like they did in mexico under isi which are artificially protected from better competition by import taxes. cutting import tariffs in haiti will only increase poverty.
also don't act as if haitians (poor haitians at least) were playing the victim while in reality being the masters of their own destiny. they have a corrupt elite and a messed up political system, and that is to no small part due to outside powers meddling and cooperating with said corrupt elite. they are screwed and there is not much they can do about it except migrate

[Hmwmzian]

Adrian Bye asserts that the DR has done rather well. maybe he should break that bit of news to the 42% of the population living below the poverty line.

[Master_B]

Adrian Bye asserts that the DR has done rather well. maybe he should break that bit of news to the 42% of the population living below the poverty line.

not many of those dominicans below the poverty line are queuing up to go to haiti to live off mudcakes

[themsrsdude]

Adrian Bye asserts that the DR has done rather well. maybe he should break that bit of news to the 42% of the population living below the poverty line.

Indeed, he can start by pointing to the 38% of the population that no longer fills the ranks of the poor, effectively turning the DR a country of 42% poverty rather than the approximately 80% poverty the country registered four to five decades ago. One has to wonder what will happen in the next four to five decades (albeit massive immigration from Haiti threatens to slowdown this process, maybe even revert it; but let's assume the migration problem will eventually be under control).

[lionsiy]

not many of those dominicans below the poverty line are queuing up to go to haiti to live off mudcakes

every time i see that reference i want to punch the young AP reporter who wrote that story. Jonathan Katz,... since he really did it with a sensationalist point of view..

those mud cookies are actually made from a special clay soil which is brought down from the mountains and contains bismuth... also the main ingredient in pepto bismol ... and an aid to stopping diarhea....

haitians have been using the mudcakes for years.

and while the list of other island countries may be interesting... i know that Haiti is not actually going to follow any other country.

they have resisted colonization
they have resisted being "Christainized"

and they have not sold off their land

as soon as there is a new government in place... after November--.- there will be a second passage of the bill allowing the diaspora to have dual citizenship .--- and then-- in a few years.--- the very educated and sucessful Haitians from abroad will have an opportunity to really aid the nation.

[Master_B]

every time i see that reference i want to punch the young AP reporter who wrote that story. Jonathan Katz,... since he really did it with a sensationalist point of view..

those mud cookies are actually made from a special clay soil which is brought down from the mountains and contains bismuth... also the main ingredient in pepto bismol ... and an aid to stopping diarhea....

interesting, i didn't know that.. here's the article:

Poor Haitians Resort to Eating Dirt

i'll be more careful with the mudcakes reference in future. thanks for the pointer.

and while the list of other island countries may be interesting... i know that Haiti is not actually going to follow any other country.

they have resisted colonization
they have resisted being "Christainized"

and they have not sold off their land and thats precisely the problem. haitians resist everything except handouts. but i will be making sure generous donors are aware of this. i think haitians can find other options for themselves on their own since they value "their way" so much.

[Nmoitmzr]

and thats precisely the problem. Haitians resist everything except handouts.

The very notion that Haitians in Haiti are somehow lazy and rely on handouts is ridiculous.

The money that goes to Haiti does not go to working class/poor Haitians.
Period.

If you would like I will expand on what happens to this cash - I am busy now - doing business in Haiti - but there is no way I am going to let that one slide.

[lionsiy]

The very notion that Haitians in Haiti are somehow lazy and rely on handouts is ridiculous.

The money that goes to Haiti does not go to working class/poor Haitians.
Period.

If you would like I will expand on what happens to this cash - I am busy now - doing business in Haiti - but there is no way I am going to let that one slide.

Thanks, Pedro... we could both jump on that one--

REALLY

even Dominicans, when speaking of Haitians.-. say that they are muy trabadores!

the VAST portion of the money that goes to Haiti lands up in the hands of various NGOs who are in the business of keeping the poor just that.--- poor

it is their source of income.

What is happening now with the money that was given for the quake relief is that is being held very tightly by a consortium of the donors so that it gets used for projects that will build infrastructure and create self sustaining businesses-----

There is a lot of grumbling about people still living in tents

but remember that they are being given food and water in those camps

and PauP is expected to have aftershocks for two years.....}}

so plans are being made to decentralize the country -- to improve access to the more remote cities and provide opportunities there so that a third to a half of the population of the capital can move out....