[Big A]

Just for imagination sake,what if China were able to dominate the world economically and culturally and take over the place of Hollywood with their own version for future decades,and influence the world with their soft power just like the West had done for centuries,do you think our local Christian will convert back to their borned to be Buddhist or Taoist religions?

To me those local Christian converts are mostly converting due to worshipping Western soft power/culture in this contemporary time.They simply are easily overwhelmed and influenced by a nice packaging culture and believe!Just like you normally see in a Hollywood movie where a young naive kid is easily influenced and overwhelmed by a stronger opponent to join a cause!

Are our Singaporean so weak in self confident?

[Big A]

... Are our Singaporean so weak in self confident?

brame ze world's bestest paid gahmen ...

dey say u peasants no pea blains 2 tink ... juz simply do wat ze gahmen say ...

so, dat simply explains y peasants hv no self confidence ...

[S.T.D.]

Just for imagination sake,what if China were able to dominate the world economically and culturally and take over the place of Hollywood with their own version for future decades,and influence the world with their soft power just like the West had done for centuries,do you think our local Christian will convert back to their borned to be Buddhist or Taoist religions?

To me those local Christian converts are mostly converting due to worshipping Western soft power/culture in this contemporary time.They simply are easily overwhelmed and influenced by a nice packaging culture and believe!Just like you normally see in a Hollywood movie where a young naive kid is easily influenced and overwhelmed by a stronger opponent to join a cause!

Are our Singaporean so weak in self confident?

It is highly unlikely, discounting the outliers.

This is because Christianity is very different from Buddhism and Taoism. It is not a product of Hollywood nor a result of advertising nor packaging.

It is more about a message of Hope, one in which a parallel cannot be found in Buddhism or Taoism which emphases other aspects.

Therefore unlike your reasoning, my belief is that Christianity is not centred on the self but on an eternal external. It is very difficult to shake this unless you can prove that there is no God.

To conclude, it has nothing to do with self-confidence but everything to do with a loving God.

[doctorzlo]

It is highly unlikely, discounting the outliers.

This is because Christianity is very different from Buddhism and Taoism. It is not a product of Hollywood nor a result of advertising nor packaging.

It is more about a message of Hope, one in which a parallel cannot be found in Buddhism or Taoism which emphases other aspects.

Therefore unlike your reasoning, my belief is that Christianity is not centred on the self but on an eternal external. It is very difficult to shake this unless you can prove that there is no God.

To conclude, it has nothing to do with self-confidence but everything to do with a loving God.

Are you a Convert?To be fair to yourselves and your ancesters,ask yourselves honestly have you read and study with equal effort the Buddhism and Taoism Scripts just like you've studied and championed Christianity?

It is just like when you see two persons are quarrelling,(one well educated, nicely dressed and speaking good English with a Western slang and one Heartlander not so nicely dressed up and not able to speak well) and you just listen to the well articulation of the well educated guy and without truely listen to the Heartlander .Immediatelly you jump into conclusion that this well dressed guy's story makes sence (just like what you say above) without listening to heartlander's side of the story and think he is not right!!

This is exactly what I mean all the converts are merely overwhelmed by the more sophistcated culture!Just for Imagination sake if there is a 180 degree turn in today's situation that China were to lead the World over the West in everything of our life,will you convert back to what you are borned to be?Is this a self confident issue?Are singaporean merely a followers and not a leader in their life?

That is why I admire our MM which had a article a few months ago in the Chinese paper where he mentioned quite clearly about today's youth influenced by the Western culture and religion.He used to be called Harry but he dropped it for his own original Asian name .He maintains and stays steadfast with Buddhism because he is a very self confident leader which only he would influence others and not the other way round!

[S.T.D.]

Are you a Convert?To be fair to yourselves and your ancesters,ask yourselves honestly have you read and study with equal effort the Buddhism and Taoism Scripts just like you've studied and championed Christianity?

It is just like when you see two persons are quarrelling,(one well educated, nicely dressed and speaking good English with a Western slang and one Heartlander not so nicely dressed up and not able to speak well) and you just listen to the well articulation of the well educated guy and without truely listen to the Heartlander .Immediatelly you jump into conclusion that this well dressed guy's story makes sence (just like what you say above) without listening to heartlander's side of the story and think he is not right!!

This is exactly what I mean all the converts are merely overwhelmed by the more sophistcated culture!Just for Imagination sake if there is a 180 degree turn in today's situation that China were to lead the World over the West in everything of our life,will you convert back to what you are borned to be?Is this a self confident issue?Are singaporean merely a followers and not a leader in their life?

That is why I admire our MM which had a article a few months ago in the Chinese paper where he mentioned quite clearly about today's youth influenced by the Western culture and religion.He used to be called Harry but he dropped it for his own original Asian name .He maintains and stays steadfast with Buddhism because he is a very self confident leader which only he would influence others and not the other way round!

I find your reasoning suspect.

But if it makes you happy that your theoretical exposition is true, stay with it.

[Big A]

That is why I admire our MM which had a article a few months ago in the Chinese paper where he mentioned quite clearly about today's youth influenced by the Western culture and religion.He used to be called Harry but he dropped it for his own original Asian name .He maintains and stays steadfast with Buddhism because he is a very self confident leader which only he would influence others and not the other way round!

Hmm...u very sure abt that? U very sure MM didnt consult other "Master" other than buddhist monk?

[LottiFurmann]

I find your reasoning suspect.

But if it makes you happy that your theoretical exposition is true, stay with it.

It seems I have hit the tune right!It is just like 2 sales persons selling a product one is a nice looking angmo and the other a local heartlander not so nice looking but you tend to listen more to that angmo and buy from him.

It is also like you feel nice walking into a church than a traditional temple which you feel awkward.

It is also like you are inside a lift speaking Chinese initially and when some angmo walk in ,you turn to English!

This is confident issue!Though I am not a religious guys knowing nothing about religions,I think more or less it is our weakness in ourselves that we are overwhelmed by anything foreign!

Why not all the resources of our educated people being poured into our borned to be religions like Taoism or Buddhism and built up the image of Temples to look modern like a Angmo Churches ,singing Buddhist or Taoist religious songs with hands holding high emotionally?Re-write the Taoist or Buddhist scripts with modern terms and influence our young to believe what you call to be true god!

I believe all these could be done if we are confident in ourselves!What say you?

[NeroASERCH]

It seems I have hit the tune right!It is just like 2 sales persons selling a product one is a nice looking angmo and the other a local heartlander not so nice looking but you tend to listen more to that angmo and buy from him.

It is also like you feel nice walking into a church than a traditional temple which you feel awkward.

It is also like you are inside a lift speaking Chinese initially and when some angmo walk in ,you turn to English!

This is confident issue!Though I am not a religious guys knowing nothing about religions,I think more or less it is our weakness in ourselves that we are overwhelmed by anything foreign!

Why not all the resources of our educated people being poured into our borned to be religions like Taoism or Buddhism and built up the image of Temples to look modern like a Angmo Churches ,singing Buddhist or Taoist religious songs with hands holding high emotionally?Re-write the Taoist or Buddhist scripts with modern terms and influence our young to believe what you call to be true god!

I believe all these could be done if we are confident in ourselves!What say you?

I say that has already been done. You can look around and compare the results.

Buddhists youth have gatherings where they sing songs and fellowship together. The Soka Association has a very nice building, strong small groups, great bonding.

Muslims have gatherings for their youths with slogans like 'Love Islam".

I do not know about Hindus.

This is a free world and the methods of delivery are converging.

As to whether they will convert back it all depends on why they like that religion in the first place.

If they like the aircon, the excitement, the hard rock atmosphere, the relationships they can find, then they may convert if they find a more exciting place. That is probably the basis of your thoughts.

If they like the idea that God, so distant and unknown in the other religions, is so near and close to you in Christianity, then there is no way they can convert because that sort of reality is not found in Buddhism, Hinduism and to a certain extent, not found in Islam too (God, yes but personal God, no).

However all these are theoretical. What is important (at least should be important) is why are you focusing on this aspect and not on the more crucial aspect of living - is there God and is He found in Christianity? Because if you believe there is no God, then the rest is not important because it becomes doing good, living good and being good. That you can do without the need for religion.

[Beerinkol]

If they like the idea that God, so distant and unknown in the other religions, is so near and close to you in Christianity, then there is no way they can convert because that sort of reality is not found in Buddhism, Hinduism and to a certain extent, not found in Islam too (God, yes but personal God, no).

U very sure on that stmt? Have u ever heard or seen how a Muslim doing his supplication? Every prayer or any deed the Muslims start and speak "In the Name of Allah". Not in the name of Jesus or Muhammad.

On the contrary, Xtians are closer and pray to their Master, Jesus, than to their LORD "ALLAH".

[PhillipHer]

U very sure on that stmt? Have u ever heard or seen how a Muslim doing his supplication? Every prayer or any deed the Muslims start and speak "In the Name of Allah". Not in the name of Jesus or Muhammad.

On the contrary, Xtians are closer and pray to their Master, Jesus, than to their LORD "ALLAH".

Yes I am quite sure of my statement.

I am also quite sure you do not understand my context.

[Fegasderty]

.....included in the above post

[HedgeYourBets]

I am also quite sure you do not understand my context.

Hmmm...ya lor. Like ur 3 in 1 theory. Now add another one Allah. 4 in 1 now. This one I will never understand.

[doctorzlo]

Hmmm...ya lor. Like ur 3 in 1 theory. Now add another one Allah. 4 in 1 now. This one I will never understand.

That is not a correct analogy.

But let's live with our differences.

We just happen to have different paths.

[Lt_Apple]

I say that has already been done. You can look around and compare the results.

Buddhists youth have gatherings where they sing songs and fellowship together. The Soka Association has a very nice building, strong small groups, great bonding.

Muslims have gatherings for their youths with slogans like 'Love Islam".

I do not know about Hindus.

This is a free world and the methods of delivery are converging.

As to whether they will convert back it all depends on why they like that religion in the first place.

If they like the aircon, the excitement, the hard rock atmosphere, the relationships they can find, then they may convert if they find a more exciting place. That is probably the basis of your thoughts.

If they like the idea that God, so distant and unknown in the other religions, is so near and close to you in Christianity, then there is no way they can convert because that sort of reality is not found in Buddhism, Hinduism and to a certain extent, not found in Islam too (God, yes but personal God, no).

However all these are theoretical. What is important (at least should be important) is why are you focusing on this aspect and not on the more crucial aspect of living - is there God and is He found in Christianity? Because if you believe there is no God, then the rest is not important because it becomes doing good, living good and being good. That you can do without the need for religion.

Can I just ask you a simple question?And I hope you answer me honestly right inside your heart : I guess you are a convert from Taoism or Buddhism and beside being overwhelmed by the sophistication of the Bible, but did you convert PARTIALLY because you also worship the Western Culture OR I put the question another way round,you convert because you look down on your own borned to be religion or culture?

[doctorzlo]

That is not a correct analogy.

Be frank to urself. Tell me is Jesus the God of Israel?

[Ifroham4]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Or43q3_FzM

watch this vidz boys, its hilarious...talk about christians and their behaviour

[Ifroham4]

Hi all,

I found this. FYI.

you called this absurd? you should see this, Kong Hee said 上帝 in China is GOD, wtf.... so funny, everything he said 1

The original ‘unknown’ god of China
An Ancient pictogram script points to the Bible

First published:
Creation 20(3):50–53
June 1998

by Ethel Nelson

Mystery concerns the 450-year-old Temple of Heaven complex in Beijing, China. Why did the emperors sacrifice a bull on the great white marble Altar of Heaven at an annual ceremony, the year’s most important and colourful celebration, the so-called ‘Border Sacrifice’? This rite ended in 1911 when the last emperor was deposed. However, the sacrifice did not begin a mere 450 years ago. The ceremony goes back 4,000 years. One of the earliest accounts of the Border Sacrifice is found in the Shu Jing (Book of History), compiled by Confucius, where it is recorded of Emperor Shun (who ruled from about 2256 BC to 2205 BC when the first recorded dynasty began) that ‘he sacrificed to ShangDi.’ 1

Who is ShangDi? This name literally means ‘the Heavenly Ruler.’ By reviewing recitations used at the Border Sacrifice, recorded in the Statutes of the Ming Dynasty (AD 1368), one may begin to understand the ancient Chinese reverence for ShangDi. Participating in this rite, the emperor first meditated at the Temple of Heaven (the Imperial Vault), while costumed singers, accompanied by musicians, intoned:

‘To Thee, O mysteriously-working Maker, I look up in thought. … With the great ceremonies I reverently honor Thee. Thy servant, I am but a reed or willow; my heart is but that of an ant; yet have I received Thy favouring decree, appointing me to the government of the empire. I deeply cherish a sense of my ignorance and blindness, and am afraid, lest I prove unworthy of Thy great favours. Therefore will I observe all the rules and statutes, striving, insignificant as I am, to discharge my loyal duty. Far distant here, I look up to Thy heavenly palace. Come in Thy precious chariot to the altar. Thy servant, I bow my head to the earth reverently, expecting Thine abundant grace. … O that Thou wouldest vouchsafe to accept our offerings, and regard us, while thus we worship Thee, whose goodness is inexhaustible!’2

Thus we find the emperor worshipping ShangDi. Can we possible trace the original intention of this magnificent ceremony of antiquity? As the emperor took part in this annual service dedicated to ShangDi, the following words were recited, clearly showing that he considered ShangDi the Creator of the world:

‘Of old in the beginning, there was the great chaos, without form and dark. The five elements [planets] had not begun to revolve, nor the sun and moon to shine. You, O Spiritual Sovereign, first divided the grosser parts from the purer. You made heaven. You made earth. You made man. All things with their reproducing power got their being’ 3

For the Christian, the above recitation sounds strangely familiar. How closely it reads to the opening chapter of the biblical Genesis! Note the similarity with excerpts from the more detailed story as recorded in the Hebrew writings:

‘In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. The earth was without form, and void; and darkness was on the face of the deep. …

‘And God said, “Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear”; and it was so. And God called the dry land Earth, and the gathering together of the waters called He Seas. …

‘And God made two great lights: the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: He made the stars also. …

‘So God created man in His own image; …’ (Genesis 1:1-2, 9-10, 16, 27-28)


ShangDi, the Creator-God of the Chinese, surely appears to be one and the same as the Creator-God of the Hebrews. In fact, one of the Hebrew names for God is El Shaddai, which is phonetically similar to ShangDi. Even more similar is the Early Zhou pronunciation of ShangDi which is ‘djanh-tigh’ [Zhan-dai].4 Another name for their God which the ancient Chinese used interchangeable with ShangDi was Heaven (Tian). Zheng Xuan, a scholar of the early Han dynasty said, “ShangDi is another name for Heaven (Tian)”.5 The great philosopher Motze (408-382 BC) also thought of Heaven (Tian) as the Creator-God:

‘I know Heaven loves men dearly not without reason. Heaven ordered the sun, the moon, and the stars to enlighten and guide them. Heaven ordained the four seasons, Spring, Autumn, Winter, and Summer, to regulate them. Heaven sent down snow, frost, rain, and dew to grow the five grains and flax and silk so that the people could use and enjoy them. Heaven established the hills and river, ravines and valleys, and arranged many things to minister to man’s good or bring him evil.’ 6

How did ShangDi create all things? Here is one further recitation from the ancient Border Sacrifice rite:

‘When Te [ShangDi], the Lord, had so decreed, He called into existence [originated] heaven, earth, and man. Between heaven and earth He separately placed in order men and things, all overspread by the heavens.’ 7

Note that ShangDi ‘called into existence,’ or commanded heaven and earth to appear.

Compare this with the way the Hebrew text describes the method of creation by El Shaddai, who, we suspect, is identical with ShangDi, and the similarity in name and role would suggest:

‘… by the word of the LORD were the heavens made; and all the host of them by the breath of His mouth. … For He spake, and it was done; He commanded, and it stood fast’ (Psalm 33:6, 9).

We have not yet explained the reason for the emperors’ bull sacrifice to ShangDi. Let us compare this Chinese sacrifice with the instruction given by God to the Hebrews:

‘Take thee a young calf for a sin offering, and a ram for a burnt offering, without blemish, and offer them before the LORD’ (Leviticus 9:2)—a practice which began in earliest times (Genesis 4:3,4; 8:20).

The origin of the Border Sacrifice would appear to be explained in the book, God’s Promise to the Chinese.8 The authors, Nelson, Broadberry, and Chock have analyzed the most ancient forms of the pictographic Chinese writing and found the foundational truths of Christianity. In these ideograms, which date from before the time of Moses—we have the entire story of creation, the temptation, and fall of man into sin, and God’s remedy for sin in the animal sacrifices, which pointed to the coming Savior, Jesus Christ. All the elements of the Genesis narrative are found recorded, and still in use, in the Chinese character-writing.

The associated box shows some startling realities about the written Chinese language, indicating that we are all related—and not so long ago. All people in the world, not just the Chinese, are descended from the inhabitants of Babel, the first civilization after the Flood. God first gave His promise of a coming saviour, the ‘Seed of the Woman,’ in Genesis (3:15). The foreshadowed sacrifice of the coming Lamb of God, Creator and Saviour, is as old as mankind.

Should a Chinese person tell you that Christianity is a ‘foreigner’s religion,’ you can explain that the Chinese in antiquity worshipped the same God as Christians do today. Like the Hebrews often did, the ancestors of today’s Chinese wandered off after false gods; the memory of who their original God was dimmed with time.9 The ancient Chinese script gives powerful evidence for the historical truth of Genesis.

http://www.answersingenesis.org/crea...0/i3/china.asp

[TorryJens]

Christianity is the fastest growthing religion in China!! Watch this!!

Christian make up less than probably 1% of Chinese population and if you say it is growing,it could be the growing population that make you think so.

When I talk to my Chinese colleagues about religion,they show contempt on our behaviour by saying that people who have any religions or devils believe is someone equivalent to olden days illiterate peasant living in feudal time having superstitious believe.

When I talk to my German colleagues, because their Western culture is inevitably intertwined with Chritianity ,they have no choice but to practice certain important rituals otherwise they would like to distance themselves away from their borned Chritianity religion !

Only our own Singkee peasants who like to worship anything foreign whether cultures or religions are crazy about this spritual believe or trend!Or put it simply they just look down on anything their own including their won parents and clanmen.

You can already see that Singkees have already changed their mother tongue,change their names and changed their religion to anything looks Western,now they are just one step short and that is change their skin to white!

[radikal]

In the west, there are many are converting to buddhist or becoming an atheist...they just realise the bible is all bullshit....just another fairytale book

[radikal]

Misconception

It is more about a message of Hope, one in which a parallel cannot be found in Buddhism or Taoism which emphases other aspects.

Therefore unlike your reasoning, my belief is that Christianity is not centred on the self but on an eternal external. It is very difficult to shake this unless you can prove that there is no God.

To conclude, it has nothing to do with self-confidence but everything to do with a loving God.