[QRhnNSg9]

This is a very practical question. I have received some newly painted icons that were comissioned some months back. I have heard that we should treat them very carefully when the paint is still not quote dry - and recenly was told by a lay person that they should not be kissed for a year. Is this true?

[arrasleds]

If the icons have been painted with modern acrylic paints, there should be no problem at all with stability of the pigments, or with any top coats of varnish. Icons painted using egg tempera are often painted with olifa varnish, which never completely dries, leading to a gradual darkening of the varnish, particularly if exposed to the emanations of oil lamps and candles. Any icon, hand-painted or mounted print, framed behind glass, or not, should be handled with care and reverence.

However, an icon (egg-tempera or acrylic) being regarded as unsuitable for veneration for a year is truly stretching it. From what I know about olifa varnish, a delay no more than a month after the application of the final coat is all that is required before the icon can be handled and venerated.

An iconographer worth his salt would not "release" an icon (painted using whatever medium) to his patron unless the surface of the icon was stable. This is particularly relevant in cases where the icon is blessed according to Russian/Slavic tradition, where the icon is placed on the church altar, prayed over, and sprinkled with holy water, before being returned to the "owner" of the icon. (Greek practice of sanctifying an icon involves placing the icon on the altar for 40 days, without a separate blessing service). It is also common, if not standard, practice for the iconographer, on completion of his work, to offer a short prayer to the saint depicted on the icon, and to venerate the icon.

[blackjackiisre]

Hi Olga,

Thnak you for the reply. I was just wondering about the one year no kissing of icon period as the iconographer did not mention anything to me. I am not sure exactly what paints were used but I presume the paint used is acrylic. It does not at all look as if egg tempera was used.

[angeldimmon]

The "no veneration of the icon for a year" sounds a bit like the folk custom of "can't get married until a year has passed after a major bereavement", or, as our recent member Clare was told, that she "should use the name Photeini at all times, instead of Clare", even though Clare is the exact equivalent of Photeini. Such ideas are honourable in intent, but without any real foundation in Orthodox doctrine, practice or theology, and examples of what some affectionately call "yiayialogy" or "babalogy".

If you're truly concerned about the stability of the surface or pigments of the icons, simply ask the iconographer who painted them. As I said before, I would be very surprised if he would have released them to you if they were not ready to be venerated.

[BritneySpearsFun@@@]

Hi Olga,

I have written to her but she is in Georgia and she doesn't often reply that quickly. I guess I'll just have to wait and see what she says. There are a few more icons on the way, one of the Foreunner, another of St. John of Shanghai and in the future, icons of the Archangels Michael and Gabriel. The icons are for the icon corner in my apartment. The person who told me this is hardly a yiayia... (In fact, she is a convert herself - at this point in time, I think what my priest often says comes to mind... NEVER trust a convert!

[sasaderesada]

Hi Olga,

I have written to her but she is in Georgia and she doesn't often reply that quickly. I guess I'll just have to wait and see what she says. There are a few more icons on the way, one of the Foreunner, another of St. John of Shanghai and in the future, icons of the Archangels Michael and Gabriel. The icons are for the icon corner in my apartment. The person who told me this is hardly a yiayia... (In fact, she is a convert herself - at this point in time, I think what my priest often says comes to mind... NEVER trust a convert!

I am a convert and I am shocked that any priest would ever say such a thing as it must be contra to any of his beliefs and teachings to pass such generalist judgement on people. I know nothing about your icon question but I am saddened by this comment.

[Xxedxevh]

I am a convert and I am shocked that any priest would ever say such a thing as it must be contra to any of his beliefs and teachings to pass such generalist judgement on people. I know nothing about your icon question but I am saddened by this comment.

As a convert myself I would advise you to get over it. Converts often bring an untempered zeal and have not quite learned some important lessons in humility. I know this was certainly true in my case, God bless you if it is not true in yours. I am sure the priest was merely making a humorous overstatement, not a "generalist judgement". Better to give the benefit of the doubt and not take offense. When you take something that was not specifically given, that is called stealing. Or so it seems to this bear of little brain.

Herman the convert Pooh who is still learning.

[pprropeciaaa]

Dear Herman, I am over it and thank you, but it is also worth remembering that St Paul was a convert and many of the other Saints and the early mission of the Apostles and the Church resulted in Conversion by definition, and nobody is actually born Eastern Orthodox. I would also point out that lessons in humility are needed for all as saying you are Eastern Orthodox because of a birth tradtiion in your family and actually being Eastern Orthodox in spirit , to me , are different things. I see this every day in Romania which by population census definition is 86% Eastern Orthodox but where what people say and what people actually do are often not the same. Off my chest..

[iqxdvjgmat]

Hi Mark,

I am sorry that you have been offended. My priest was being humorous. He is himself a convert. As Herman has out it quite clearly, converts sometimes get over zealous. We've seen many of these hence the remark. What you have said about the cradle Orthodox is also valid. And so as my priest also says, we all come inti the Church as converts to the truth...

Nathaniel

[Njxatsbf]

Hi Mark,

I am sorry that you have been offended. My priest was being humorous. He is himself a convert. As Herman has out it quite clearly, converts sometimes get over zealous. We've seen many of these hence the remark. What you have said about the cradle Orthodox is also valid. And so as my priest also says, we all come inti the Church as converts to the truth...

Nathaniel

Hi Nathaniel, no offence taken and in the context of a converted priest it is indeed humorous

[astonmartinrx371]

Hi Mark,

I'm glad that this is cleared up. Our priest has many humorous things to say from time to time. He is bi-vocational and works as a head teacher in addition to serving the parish in Singapore. Many of us would not be in the Orthodox church without his ministry. Pray for him and us here.

[intorkercet]

Christ is Risen!
As an iconographer myself I can say that I never send finished icon to the client until it is fully dried and ready for blessing and veneration. I use egg tempera paint and when thoroughly dry, a linseed oil-based varnish, and it dries within a week or two depending on the weather. I used to use acrylic paints and varnishes and they dry much faster. I have never heard of waiting for a year to kiss either type of icon.

[FrereeDoulley]

When my daughter was married, my wife and I supplied the wedding icons and had them painted by V. Krassovsky in San Francisco. The wedding was also in SF. Vova was a bit late in starting the icons and when he delivered them (on the day before the wedding), they were dry to the touch but the varnish was obviously not fully cured. He would not have given them to me at this time except for the fact that the wedding was to be the next day and so they were needed. Even though they were not fully dry (as I said dry to the touch but not fully cured), the icons were blessed and carried in the wedding and venerated by the new couple and experienced absolutely no ill effects. I think this waiting for a year thing is maybe a one time thing referring to a very specific case that was then somehow generalized by a particular person into a general "rule".

Fr David

[MasdMnPa]

Alexandra, thanks for letting me know. It's good to hear from someone who is an iconographer. Nthing quite like first hand knowledge of all that is involved.

Fr. David, the icon of my patron saint, St. Bartholomew seems to be quite dry to the touch but the two other icons seem to be a bit 'sticky'. I am noit sure if this has anything to do with the humid climate of Malaysia.