[CHEAPCIALISFORYOU]

Prompted by a very clever post of Paul, I thought to start this new thread. I would love to learn more from you about our faith. When you read spiritual material please be mindful of lesser known details and present it as questions here.


There is an Orthodox saint who resembles Saint Paul. Who is he?

Hints available upon request.

[thierabess]

I need a hint.

[anatmob]

I need a hint.

Ok because you and Leah are some of the bestest friends I will give you a very good hint.

The fact that he looks like St. Paul was actually revealed in a vision to the Archbishop of Alexandria, Alexander, who would see him the next day and who would consecrate him the Bishop of Constantia, Cyprus.

But do not mistake this saint for another saint bishop of Constantia because he was not from Cyprus originally. The saint of our question was born in Paphlagonia and grew up in Constantinople. And actually left Constantinople after a dream where he was told that he will lead the flock of Christ and the saint thought to escape from Constantinople and go incognito, but Archbishop of Alexandria recognized him - because of the vision he had- that this saint was to be the next bishop of Constantia because he was a vessel of the Holy Spirit.

[MasTaBlau]

My first guess was St John Chrysostom. My second guess is, St John Chrysostom. I couldn't come up with a third guess, but if I try really hard, it might be, St John Chrysostom. Of course, I'm probably entirely wrong, so I'll go work on my fourth guess.

Mary

[Salliter]

I would guess St. Niphon, December 23. Although according to my Synaxarion he was bishop in Egypt, not Cyprus.

[9V42h1eT]

Adrian, yes, you are right. Saint Niphon has an amazing resemblance to St. Paul.

I am sorry about the discrepancy, but Cyprus is what I found on line. A book that I have about St.Niphon does not mention Cyprus, or Egypt...And because I have seen it in English with such title: St. Niphon, Bishop of Cyprus, I did not think to double check it with my book. However the book I have is reticent about such details. Maybe some other friend from here knows more about it, please?

Mary, I also would have picked St. Chrysostom.

A summary of St. Niphon's life.

[popandopulus]

Regarding resemblance of St Niphon to Apostle Paul, are you referring to physical appearance? Because several icons I have of St Niphon all show him with grey or white hair, and with a mid-length beard, longer than St Paul's.

[ZIDouglas]

Regarding resemblance of St Niphon to Apostle Paul, are you referring to physical appearance? Because several icons I have of St Niphon all show him with grey or white hair, and with a mid-length beard, longer than St Paul's.

What I read dear Olga is this:
That night in his dream he [Archbishop of Alexandria, St. Alexander] saw a man with a beautiful countenance , who said to him: "Whom are you thinking of making bishop of Constantiana?"

"I do not know; that's why I'm begging God to enlighten me."

"God heard your prayer and will reveal to you His elect, who up to now lived in obscurity. Tomorrow, therefore, get ready to go to church with your clergy. Whoever you see that resembles me in appearance, except for the bladness, consecrate him bishop over the fold of Christ, even if he doesn't want to."

The next day the patriarch, ready in every respect, went to church. His gaze was nailed on the icon of the Apostle Paul - because it was he who had appeared to him - [...]

From the moment the archbishop saw him [Saint Niphon], he fixed his gaze on him, and then he would look first at the icon of the Apostle and then at him. This comparison left him amazed. He turned and whispered in the ear of his archdeacon: "Athanasius [this is Saint Athanasius the Great who was an archdeacon at that time!], do you see what an astonishing resemblance that man has to St. Paul?"

"Truly Master, he does resemble him. And it seems to me that he is worthy of shepherding Christ's sheep, because I see the angels of God accompanying him, and on his head he has a crown of precious stones." pp.130-131

From the book Stories, Sermons, and Prayers of St. Nephon an Ascetic Bishop. (Light and Life Publishing ISBN 0937032670)

[wJswn5l3]

Dear Olga,

Also I have a question and maybe you can help me. It is not trivia just something I can't recall. What is the name of the saint, please, who was very handsome and prayed to God to make his face look like a dog's face so he could avoid temptation and putting others to temptation with his handsomeness? If I have the name maybe I can google him, but also if you know, do you recommend any reading material about him?

Thank you.

nina

[giftbestcom]

Dear Olga,

Also I have a question and maybe you can help me. It is not trivia just something I can't recall. What is the name of the saint, please, who was very handsome and prayed to God to make his face look like a dog's face so he could avoid temptation and putting others to temptation with his handsomeness? If I have the name maybe I can google him, but also if you know, do you recommend any reading material about him?

Thank you.

nina

I know you asked Olga, but I'll jump in. You're thinking of St. Christopher "Cynocephalus". Some of the icons of St. Christopher show him with the head of a dog. Not all of the stories about him have him getting his face that way; some have him starting out with a dog's face.

Mike

[PriniMai]

I know you asked Olga, but I'll jump in. You're thinking of St. Christopher "Cynocephalus". Some of the icons of St. Christopher show him with the head of a dog. Not all of the stories about him have him getting his face that way; some have him starting out with a dog's face.

Mike

Of course you can jump in and it is a pleasure, and thank you for your help!

[Abraham]

Hello Nina

Differing time zones means my posts are somewhat delayed - so I'm used to others jumping in first (no offence at all, Mike!)

A wordy addition (as usual ....) to Mike's post:

The story of the strong man ferrying travellers over the river on his back is of much later origin (probably 12thC), considering St Christopher of Lycia was martyred in about AD 250 under Emperor Decius. All paintings and images of Christopher carrying the Christ-child date from the second millennium AD, and are all of Western origin. There is no iconography of this saint in this type of portrayal prior to this, rather, he is portrayed as a warrior, which fits with the earlier story of his life as a soldier. St Ambrose of Milan wrote of the many thousands of pagans who were converted to Christianity by St Christopher.

How St Christopher came about to be portrayed with a dog's head is an unfortunate misunderstanding on the part of the iconographer who first painted him: St Christopher came from a region in Thessaly (northern Greece) called Kynoskephalai. This place-name means "dog-headed". So poor St Christopher was painted with a dog's head, where the iconographer mistakenly thought the name "dog-headed" referred to what the saint looked like, not where he came from. Other iconographers, unaware of this error, simply copied this form of portrayal. (A bit like the icon of the Mother of God of the Three Hands, but that's another story ...)

I have also come across the story that St Christopher disfigured himself to detract from his handsomeness, lest any vanity cause him to stray from his life in Christ. This poses some problems in Orthodox thought and teaching, as self-mutilation, or the seeking of it, is generally regarded as wrong. However, irrespective of whether this story is true, it is not proper for an iconographer to portray such disfigurement in any saint. Icons are portrayals of a saint's spiritual reality, of a saint's perfected state in the eyes of God, and not of imperfections which illustrate mankind's fallen, imperfect state.

For example, a saint who wore spectacles during his earthly life should not be wearing them in icons. Examples include St John of Shanghai and San Francisco (1896-1966), Hieromartyr Benjamin of Petrograd (+1922), and St Luke the Surgeon of Simferopol (1876-1961). Another example is St Matrona of Moscow, another 20th C saint who was born blind. There are indeed many icons of her with her eyes closed (as they were in her earthly life, there are a number of photographs of her), however, the proper iconographic portrayal of her is with her eyes open. Though physically blind all her earthly life, by her life showed herself to be a model of spiritual illumination. Her physical eyes were useless, but her spiritual eyes were wide open. Thus she should be portrayed with her eyes open, to illustrate this spiritual reality

Depicting St Christopher with a dog's head, or with an otherwise disfigured face in an icon, therefore, is quite wrong.

[errolespopume]

Today, I was in the library browsing through old issues of the Orthodox Word when by "chance" I happened to find a full-length life of St. Niphon by St. Dimitri of Rostov. It was a very good hagiography. St. Niphon was a bishop in Cyprus according to St. Dimitri.

[Tilmbeinymn]

Olga, yes, thank you. I know St. Christopher. Actually my parents had always an icon of him in their car. And I always thought that he looks so much like Christ and therefore so handsome.

But I remember to have read about another saint who was also really handsome also and this was a temptation, therefore he prayed to God to change his look so he stops being vain and does not tempt others. The problem is I do not know where I read that and who the saint it. Maybe it is the same saint and the incorrect tradition and I did not realize it was about the Saint Christopher, whose icon was in the car of my parents - since that icon was the classic one, St. Christopher holding baby Christ on his shoulder.

[art_fan_12]

Today, I was in the library browsing through old issues of the Orthodox Word when by "chance" I happened to find a full-length life of St. Niphon by St. Dimitri of Rostov. It was a very good hagiography. St. Niphon was a bishop in Cyprus according to St. Dimitri.

Thank you for confirming Adrian.

[strongjannabiz]

Pardon me for a dumb question...

How does anybody confirm what Paul looked like?

I've got no problems with "Looks like the icons of Paul"...
but how do we know that's what Paul actually looked like?

[markshome23]

It was common practice that detailed physical descriptions of saints (or prospective saints) were documented for future reference, which were invaluable in many ways, particularly for iconographers. There is even a quite detailed physical description of the Mother of God in one of the sermons to one of her feasts (?Dormition) by St Gregory Palamas (or was it St John Chrysostom? Must look it up.) A look at the icons of many saints shows a remarkable consistency of physical appearance for a given saint, even taking into account geographic and stylistic differences in icons. St Nicholas of Myra, St John Chrysostom, St Basil the Great, and Apostle Paul are good examples of these.

Apostle Paul is always shown with dark receding hair, and a short, not very full, tapered beard, and a rather severe facial expression. Ther are also subtle details in his icons that suggest he was a small, slightly-built man.

[konanoileaski]

Ther are also subtle details in his icons that suggest he was a small, slightly-built man I like to think he was a giant of a man. Even though the name Paul means small or little. My middle name Edward, means guardian or soldier. So I am a small guardian. Or a little protector.

Paul

[orison]

There is also iconographic and liturgical evidence that St John Chrysostom wasn't a tall, beefy fellow either, but there's no doubt regarding his great stature in theological terms.

[Trissinas]

I have read that St. Paul changed his name from Saul to Paul which was the Greek translation of Saul, because that was the official language in the countries he wanted to visit.

I don't think his name had anything to do with his appearance, which was apparently not very attractive. He had some sort of infirmity but we don't know what it was.

In the past lots of names originated either from the occupations of their owners, or because something about these people stood out. Nicknames became surnames over time.

I believe and hope that there will come a time when all ancient manuscripts from Syria, Iraq (Mesopotamia) and other Middle Eastern countries will be translated properly into English. At least those manuscripts that have survived wars and plundering.
It is hard to sift the truth from so many different versions of past events especially since many past historical events are now being either erased or distorted for various political reasons.

A love of knowledge is no longer something to strive for apparently. The love of God, of truth, of all those qualities that people once held sacred have now been replaced by ridiculous values that are slowly destroying our world. The role models our children have today are inane personalities that are displayed on our TV screens 24 hours a day.

I have the biography of Livingstone and just to read about his early years and the influences that made him into the man he was is awesome. These people lived hard lives compared to us but they accomplished miracles because they believed in God and in themselves.

One of the greatest losses to the world was the destruction of the Alexandria library by fire. What priceless knowledge have we lost as a result of this destruction? We know that the New Testament was written in Greek (except perhaps for St. Mathew and even here opinions differ). How could simple fishermen have written Greek? Apart from St. Luke of course who was a highly educated Greek, and for whom it is natural that he would write in his native tongue, why wasn't the rest of the New Testament written in Hebrew?

I realize that the Holy Spirit descended on the people of the early church on Pentecost and that this is probably the reason they could then understand and speak different languages, but, again, why wasn't the NT written in Hebrew?

I know I've strayed from the subject a little, but I wanted to understand why the name Saul became Paul.

Effie