General Discussion Undecided where to post - do it here. |
Reply to Thread New Thread |
![]() |
#2 |
|
There is such a think as humane
meat products.You just have to look realy hard for them.Another option is to find out if there is someone localy that you can go in on a cow with cooperatively.Superior meat and no guilt.There are alot of folks around here that have various animals like cows and sheep and chickens that,if you befriend them and offer to help out and help pay,are willing to raise animals on thier property for meat.You know exactly what went into the meat and exactly what health the animal was in at the time of slaughter and it actualy gets to live its life right up to the end in relative comfort and luxury. |
![]() |
![]() |
#3 |
|
|
![]() |
![]() |
#4 |
|
Okay...this is usualy way,way,way outside my usual posts.In point of fact I am not even sure if I
should post it...but then again...This video is about how animals that end up on our tables for consumption are treated befor they reach the supermarket.Im sure we have all heard the stories,but seeing it was...well...an eye opener. I will sum up this video for those who would prefer to not watch it but may have stomach enough to hear my pathetic attempt to describe what has to be seen to be believed.Stop reading now if you would rather just not know. This is a link to a video narated by one of the Bladwins,Im not sure which one,that was produced by PETA in a campaign to stop the commercial sale of meat.Meat animals,as Im sure we have all heard,live in the most deplorable conditions imaginable. In the case of chickens,many production meat birds starve to death in thier pens as a result of injuries that prevent them from reaching food.Others die from stress related ailments while kept in extremely over crowded pens and coops while awaiting transport to slaughter.They are kept in pens far too small,made to live in thier own excrement,brutaly beaten to death if they are found to be sick or injured.In the video,five gallon buckets stuffed full of dead chickens can be seen in the pens. When they are slaughtered,they are first brutaly hung up by thier feet and sent through a machine that cuts thier throats,but often inadaquately...so as a result,they are sent down the line to the hot water tank for feather removal.When chickens are plucked(I have done this myself) they are first dipped in scalding hot water to loosen the feathers.In the case of comercial production,many are still alive when they get dipped. Cattle in this video are particularly pathetic.Meat cattle are first castrated with a knife,have thier horns removed with bolt cutters and are branded...all without bennefit of anesthiesia.they are penned in a feed lot,where conditions are so cramped,they cant even move or lay down.By the time they go to slaughter,thier muscles have atrophied,they have developed infected wounds or cancerous lesions,despite which they still pass USDA certification.Many are so weak and debilitated,that they have to be dragged off the trucks with a winch when they reach the slaughter house,unable to move or stand on thier own. Dairy cows are much the same.They are kept in tightly regulated pens and milked several times a day.They are niether able to move or lay down and in many cases suffer injuries from being milked that result in them being culled from the heard and sent to slaughter.According to the video,most of the hamburger in the US is gained from dairy cows. Cows give milk for the same reason women do...to feed thier offspring.So as a result,the dairy cows are impregnated and when they give birth,thier young are taken to simmilar,smaller pens to be raised for veal.Unable to lay down or walk,by the time they go to auction many of these veal animals cant even stand on thier own because thier muscles have atrophied. Once again,these animals are hung up at the slaughter house,have thier throats cut and are blead out befor being skinned and gutted.Unfortunatly,many are still alive and awake by the time they reach the skinning room.This is true of both beef cows and veal. The part of the video about pigs was the toughest part for me.My brother and sister-in-law raised pigs,and I got to help hand raise some of them after thier breeding sow died giving birth.Pigs are an amazingly inteligent creature and have been said to be more inteligent than dogs.Having seen it,I believe it.They are also alot of fun. The pigs are kept in pens in which they cant turn around.They are fed and watered,and when the time comes,they give birth and are given just enough extra space to nurse thier young.The piglets are prematurely weaned and sent to mass pens in which they are so packed together that they are unable to move.Sick or wounded animals are...this turned my stomach...picked up by thier hind legs and slammed head first onto the concrete floor to kill them.Many of the animals above,chickens,turkeys,cows,pigs are driven to insanity from thier conditions.Haveing spent alot of time around farm animals I can believe that because for as dumb as we think they are,they realy arent.They just cant share thier thoughts on quantum mechanics with us.And the mamals especialy have very distinct personalities.I have seen these animals show effection in the same way your dog or cat would show effection.They just smell alittle stronger. Thats about where I had to stop watching.In the greatest effort I can muster to not pay anyone any disrespect,it is very clear to me that meat farming in the United States has taken more than a few pointers on "how to" from the Nazi concentration camps and then improved on the methods to make them even worse.If you have a stomach to watch it...here is the link. ![]() http://www.meat.org/?c=v0106 Bear in mind,I am not a big fan of PETA...but once in a while I can find something to agree with even with someone I usualy disagree with. |
![]() |
![]() |
#5 |
|
No pun
intended, but... food for thought! ![]() Thanks for the post. One of the great mysteries is how life implies death; and how milking (again, no pun intended) anything "good" out of the whole drama seems to imply creating something "bad". But certainly, there are more and less graceful, or harmonious, ways to participate in the ironies and cycles of nature. Unlike, say, traditional Native American cultures, we are extremely out of touch with this major aspect of existence. A big picture approach can be used to optimize the harmony we have with the rest of nature. Yes, everything we are and do is part of nature; but the question is whether we are acting in harmony, or in a selfish, human-centric, self-defeating, "cancerous" manner. All those practices taint the food we eat. I think I'll go eat a free range, organic buffalo burger now. ![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#6 |
|
That's pretty bad. I wonder if
its across the board treatment or if those are some of the worst offenders? Do you know? I'd read recently that some companies have strict policies about humane treatment that wouldn't allow that type of thing. Maybe I'm nisunderstanding what they consider humane? Doc, While I am not familar with all traditional native american customs the few I do know something about are very strongly in touch with the cycles of nature and their place in it. Could you please go into a bit of detail on that? |
![]() |
![]() |
#7 |
|
For example, I have in mind
the close, intimate, respectful, solemn relationship hunters had with their prey (note the closeness with the word "pray", BTW); and the rituals that developed around that in different tribes. The role of the buffalo as sacred in ancient American history is illustrative. It wasn't, random, indiscriminate killing for the purpose of mazimizing profits. There was an awareness of what you are doing, how it is profoundly important, and how it fits in. |
![]() |
![]() |
#9 |
|
No problem. Seems I came
across as saying the exact opposite of what I was trying to, due to a subtle double negative. I started the sentence with "unlike", then said "native cultues", and followed with another negative ("out of touch"). It was an optical illusion, and not the greatest writing on my part. It's better to phrase things using positives, kids! |
![]() |
![]() |
#10 |
|
I think these conditions were
representative of the worst offenders in the industry,but even cutting the misery and brutality by half wouldnt pay these animals the respect they deserve.I think Doc and I are fairly close to being on the same page in terms of being in touch with nature and our role in it.I have known for a long time that native American culture in many tribes prescribes a very solemn and spiritual relationship between the hunter and the hunted.In many cases its not uncommon for the hunter to mourn his prey and pay great respect to its spirit and give thanks for the opportunity to eat and feed his tribe. In a sort of excentric and funky way,Ted Nugent subscribes to this line of thinking.I dont know if you have much knowledge of his life style,but he and his wife eat only meat that they have harvested themselves.They hunt it,clean it,skin it,butcher it and eat it.They have a very simmilar philosophy toward animals.They regard thier kills as gifts from God and go to fairly extensive lengths to insure that each kill is as humane as possible.They also do a HUGE amout of conservation work...but thats not impoirtant right now...Funny thing...for thier ages,Ted and his wife look realy great...and thier thirty one year old daughter looks like she probably gets carded every time she orders a drink.The first time I saw her I thought she was sixteen.The whold family enjoys a level of health and energy that most Americans have only read about,largely due to an extremely healthy life style...including thier food.Although I find him excentric and alittle over the top,I have a great deal of admiration for he and his wife.They have very strong convictions and they strive to live up to them in the most decent way they know how. His wife is so damn hot too...good food hasnt hurt her one bit... |
![]() |
![]() |
#11 |
|
I wasn't arguing the point and
agree that the conditions were deplorable. In both instances I was looking for clarification. In Doc's case, the way it was originally written it was easily misunderstood to say the native americans did not revere life and I know that to be wrong in the instances I am familar with. He clarified and we are in agreement. |
![]() |
![]() |
#12 |
|
|
![]() |
Reply to Thread New Thread |
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests) | |
|