[Michaelnewerb]

Also keep in mind, that even in the US the government there can force you to give up your property if the government has a different plan for it.

Try standing up to uncle Sam when uncle Sam wants your house to built a highway or to make a park or something, you can't say no. Either you accept their monetary offer for your property or you are kicked out! When uncle Sam wants it, he gets it. So, in a way it can be said to be like in the US, but in a little more chaotic manner.

Also keep in mind, there are many false claims to properties on this island. If the title was not done by a recongnized company, doubt the titles.

In the US we have a little law called "Eminent Domain" that prohibits the arbitrary taking of land without due process, notice, hearings and compensation

"A little like the US" Nawalh says:

A "little comparison" I say

Generally, when the government wants to take your property by eminent domain, you can expect to encounter some or all of the following procedures in approximately the following order:

Initial contact by government agency to express interest in the property and/or scheduling date for appraisal of the property;

Appraisal of the property, including improvements, by agency retained appraiser;

Offer to purchase the property is made to the owner, together with summary of appraisal upon which offer to purchase is made;

Notice of public hearing to adopt "resolution of necessity" to acquire property by eminent domain;

Public hearing is held to adopt "resolution of necessity" to acquire the property by eminent domain;

Eminent domain case is filed in court and served on property owner;


Deposit by agency of the probable amount of just compensation is paid into court and request by agency for early possession of the property;

Discovery (i.e., depositions and document production) takes place in eminent domain action, and both the property owner and government hire appraisers to determine "fair market value" of the subject property;

The property owner and government exchange their respective appraisers' reports;

Final settlement offers and demands are exchanged;

If settlement cannot be reached, trial of the eminent domain action takes place before a jury whose job it is to determine "fair market value" of the subject property;

Jury returns verdict and judgment is entered;

Government pays judgment within 30 days following entry of judgment and title to subject property is transferred to the government by the court.
In addition, at some point during the process (usually early on), the property owner and/or tenants should be contacted by a relocation agent retained by the government. The purpose of the relocation agent is to provide assistance to residents and business owners to relocate their residence or business.


In the US bulldozers do not show up with the Army and shoot at people while their property is destroyed

If you want to try a comparison, look to Israel's handling of Palestinian settlements, not the US

I would not be even mentioning the US in this insane development, but your silly comparison deserves rebuttal and reason

[soonahonsefalh]

Cabarete, Friday, July 30, 2004 - Television and eye-witness reports from Cabarete today tell of an unnanounced raid by the Dominican military against long time residents of the Cabarete area in a strip between the Cabarete-Sosua Highway and the North Atlantic from Costa Azul to the new Kite Beach hotel. Witnesses say that the military arrived with caterpillars and bulldozers around noon today to evict what was termed "illegal residents" and proceeded to destroy all properties in the zone without warning. Many residents confronted the soldiers with their legal land and property titles but were rebuffed and their homes destoyed anyway. Some people returned from work only to find that their homes or business had been destroyed with all of their possesions still inside. Around 2:00pm witnesses say the crowd of displaced homeowners confronted the army and the army responded by firing on the growing crowd of homeless people. It is presumed that the shots were fired into the air and that no one was injured but that can not be confirmed at this time. The mayor of Cabarete is quote as saying that he was not informed of any pending action and described this action as a "big crime" that will "severely harm tourism" in the area as no one will be willing to buy property in the area if their legally granted titles do not protect their investment from wanton destruction and appropriation by military authorities. Neither the mayor nor anyone else has any information on who was behind the order to remove the structures, which included at least three business, two owned by foreigners, and most of which were substantially constructed 2-3 story concrete buildings, not simple wood and tin shacks. The property destruction and the ensuing protests closed the main north coast highway, route 5, at Costa Azul for several hours this afternoon. The road is open at the moment but down to one lane in the area due to crowds of displaced people scavenging for their belongings among the ruins of their former homes. Many of the residents were quite poor, and those displaced and now without a place to sleep tonight include women, very young children, elderly, and the infirm.

If this is so and they were not squatters, then I sympathise with them completely.
I still don't think it gives them the right to throw stones at people passing by.
I wonder if we'll ever know for sure what went on and who's right and who's wrong in the land dispute.
I can imagine owning a piece of investment property for years and finally deciding to develop it and find that I can't because there are squatters there and it costs me a fortune in court costs and lost years battling these people, then finally getting a court injunction that sent forces in to physically remove them, on the other hand, I can also visualize some mafioso scam artist who has bribed all the right people to wrongfully take over a property that does not belong to him.
I just don't know.
Hope nobody gets hurt.

[Essefsbyday]

If your title was insured by Stewart they should pay you and then they should go after the people for damages whom were the cause.

[Michaelnewerb]

Kris,

Is there a way to find out this is indeed FACT???. (that the 'government' has taken over the property?)

Sadly folks, THIS is the property we have been negotiating. There were no squatters onsite and the owner and/or his brother frequently visit the site. There was even running water and a running refrigerator! Why else would this have been demolished????

I am phoning the owner.

Thanks,
Susie

Susie

Unfortunately I am only an outraged visitor (US Citizen). I wish I could do something or obtain information, I really feel this is going to be a much bigger incidnet than people realize. the destruction of land and buildings, the army shooting at people who were in their own "homes," this is just so wrong

To have some justify it by saying "Squatters get what is coming to them" is sick, these were PEOPLE

[Essefsbyday]

Ken,

Was that last pic of the familiar ROAD HOUSE Property on the main road?

Thanks,
Susie

Yes Suzie that was the Roadhouse. I drove by today and saw some people outside but not Luis.

Scott

[Seasmillets]

Also keep in mind, that even in the US the government there can force you to give up your property if the government has a different plan for it.

Try standing up to uncle Sam when uncle Sam wants your house to built a highway or to make a park or something, you can't say no. Either you accept their monetary offer for your property or you are kicked out! When uncle Sam wants it, he gets it. So, in a way it can be said to be like in the US, but in a little more chaotic manner.

Also keep in mind, there are many false claims to properties on this island. If the title was not done by a recongnized company, doubt the titles.

I agree.

The difference is that in the US, lawyers and bureaucrats show up with "court" bulldozers instead of those manufactured by Caterpillar...

My good friend build a textile manufacturing plant in Costa Rica. He bought land, and took 2 years to begin construction. When he was ready to build, there was a virtual city built on the land. After much discussion with the squatters...where he even offered to buy them each a small plot of land, and give them the first opportunity at the jobs in the factory...he gave up. The bulldozers came in.

I think that unless there is actual evidence of clear title to the land-not anecdotes from a crying victim...I am told fraudulent land titles are a problem in DR...I will rerserve opinion on the actions of the authorities. There are 2 sides to every argument.

I find it interesting how people complain about laws not being enforced; but when they ARE enforced, the same people complain. It's a human characteristic, I suppose, not just a DR characteristic.

[E4qC1qQ5]

If the Dominican Constitution means nothing,do you think that a "Title" to a piece of land has any value? It just means that no one with more "Power" than the title holder wants that land!
I live above the Zoo in Santo Domingo.Have for 6 years.There was a large parcel of land that belonged to the Zoo,undeveloped,but still an asset to the Zoo.It was basically "jungle".About 5,or 10 (Hard to tell without going in)squaters had built their tin shacks there,grew their "Platanos,Juandiles,etc.A little over a year ago,I started seeing some articles in the SD papers stating how terrible that these people were squating on the Zoo's precious land!The zoo director agreed.I "sensed" that something was up! Sure enough,the "Bulldozers"arrived early on morning,and bulldozed first the houses,then the trees,then anything "green",then they flattened the hills,and filled in the valleys!This "destriction" went on for about 6 months,and then the "construcion" started.An "Urbanizacion',of about 20 houses,and 10 low rise apartment building.All built on "So-Called" Zoo land,now owned by Bisono!
So just remember,if someone has more "Power,read Political or military power,or more money than you do,and they really want your property,they WILL get it!
THe DR has huge books of "LAWS",and then there is "Real Life",where all those "Laws" are selectively enforced,or forgotten, to the advantage of those in power!
Don't get me wrong,those of us who "Survive" here use the system to our advantage,but one must never forgetthat;"Those Who Live By The Sword,can also,"Die" by the Sword "!
Cris Colon,CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCC CC

Cris,

This CERTAINLY places a huge damper and questions on our plans to settle in Cabarete, and initiate construction plans for our new business venture! If what you say is true, than I resubmit my question in a recent thread "Rising Real Estate Prices"
my reply "Land Reform" # 22 post. (if I knew how to link it, I would)

If legally titiled land with 3 story structures/businesses were victims of this onslaught, what rights do any of us have? Were there no attemps to verify documents prior to the destruction?

Please, I'm requesting some encouragement to move forward....

Thank you!
Susie

[appleiphoneees]

Timeless

If you will do a little research into land speculation in the DR you will find that what happened in Cabarete is but the tip of the iceberg.

if you have the right friends and connections in the military and Police in this country and provide them with the appropriate "incentives" you can get whatever you want, whenever you want it. All it takes is MONEY greasing the right palms.

The 'government" won't do anything to help you because they are powerless to do so in the face of the power that the military and police have over this society. Additionally, they're scared to death of retribution from those sources should they cross them.

My advise is don't buy a damn thing. Rent what you want and have an ironbound contract to protect your interests, pay the local police amd Colonel their due and live happily ever after.

Texas Bill

[E4qC1qQ5]

or will these still be there when I visit next, perhaps time to look for another vacation spot.




these were emailed to me.

Ken,

Was that last pic of the familiar ROAD HOUSE Property on the main road?

Thanks,
Susie

[Unrersvar]

Why would the mayor call the military's action "criminal"? Don't you think he would have some idea as to the legal status of the property, or is mayor a meaningless office in the DR? With all of its development and foreign residents, I would think Cabarete would be about the most orderly town in the country. - D

[h0ldem]

You are the voice of experience & reason, CCCCCCC, but I bet you have just sent some shivers up the spines of the newer folk, who maybe didn't realise this.......particularly those who have just bought land or property in that area.

[E4qC1qQ5]

It was, must have been a "squatters shack" thrown up the night before in the General's mind

I am willing to wager that some one was recently paid off to obtain this land before Hippo leaves office

Kris,

Is there a way to find out this is indeed FACT???. (that the 'government' has taken over the property?)

Sadly folks, THIS is the property we have been negotiating. There were no squatters onsite and the owner and/or his brother frequently visit the site. There was even running water and a running refrigerator! Why else would this have been demolished????

I am phoning the owner.

Thanks,
Susie

[E4qC1qQ5]

actually he is a multi-talented mouse, movies, tiles and a title company. Rumour has it he also may run as an independent in the US elections

Too bad he was a "LITTLE" late to have been elected in the DR!

[Creelaleps]

Also keep in mind, that even in the US the government there can force you to give up your property if the government has a different plan for it.

Try standing up to uncle Sam when uncle Sam wants your house to built a highway or to make a park or something, you can't say no. Either you accept their monetary offer for your property or you are kicked out! When uncle Sam wants it, he gets it. So, in a way it can be said to be like in the US, but in a little more chaotic manner.

Also keep in mind, there are many false claims to properties on this island. If the title was not done by a recongnized company, doubt the titles.

[AmericaAirline 111]

He he he, ooops, it's Stewart Title. You know what I meant!

Squeek squeek can I have some cheese please

[AmericaAirline 111]

Double WHAMMY!

Thanks, Kim and Paul...I will be happy to contact Stewart Little whilst I search for new TILE for my kitchen and bath!

Thanks, guys, I inevitably needed a good laugh!

Susie

actually he is a multi-talented mouse, movies, tiles and a title company. Rumour has it he also may run as an independent in the US elections

[soonahonsefalh]

It's awfully quiet! Did we imagine it?
Did no-one else bump ino the unrest, stone throwing, road blocking and general melee just outside Cabarete on the road to Sosua at lunchtime today 30.07.04??
Some very angry and enojado Dominicans creating a big scene on the main road just past the end of kite Beach.
It appears that the army have been around and chased all the squatters off the lands and out of their houses??
Hope that my tourists got through okay with their taxi to the airport, (I did a 'U' turn with all the other drivers)!
Strange that no-one else reported it?

Personally, I don't have too much sympathy for squatters. If you try to steal someone's land, you deserve to be kicked off, and throwing stones at innocent people driving by doesn't help.
Someone was just saying to me how unfair it was that the army just showed up without warning to kick them off and bulldoze down their houses.
It's quite clear that if they had warned them it would have turned into a battle and a lot of people would have been hurt.
Funny how people who commit crimes make so much noise when justice catches up to them.

[TCjwwhcY]

I'm with cobraboy. Seems to me we have taken a scrap of information and made it into a cause celebre.

Anyone contemplating buying property in the DR who is having second thoughts as a result of this thread would do well to discuss this matter with a competent Dominican lawyer before canceling those plans.

If somebody is really interested in this matter, why not post some questions in the Legal section so that Fabio Guzman can respond to them. That is the only section he monitors.

[h0ldem]

Now you know, Susie, why all the advice was to take it slow, move here first, renting, get to know the lie of the land, culture, language, word on the street etc etc. You've got to be here to get that local knowledge. The longer the better, before you buy. Thank goodness you didn't rush ahead. And how interesting to have it confirmed by someone independent that she saw no squatters on her trips to this property.
Hope you can get hold of the owner - we'll all be waiting to hear what he says.

[E4qC1qQ5]

I'm with cobraboy. Seems to me we have taken a scrap of information and made it into a cause celebre.

Anyone contemplating buying property in the DR who is having second thoughts as a result of this thread would do well to discuss this matter with a competent Dominican lawyer before canceling those plans.

If somebody is really interested in this matter, why not post some questions in the Legal section so that Fabio Guzman can respond to them. That is the only section he monitors.

My thoughts exactly.

Susie