[Meenepek]

Do you say Ya Allah send durood and Barakat on the pious aal e Rasool?

No, but I thought it meant the close Ahl e Bait of the Holy Prophet.

Hmm.. I am confused, but JazakAllah for the answers. I will ask a Scholar inshaAllah.

[jgztw2es]

aoa,

are you dead sure that just because you have syed in your name then you are from the Prophet (PBUH)'s family?i can name my children 'syed' who is gonna check?my family name is ansari but none of us thinks we are from the ansar. half of us put it with our names half of us dont.

You can put it in your children's name then you can Answer to Allah on the day of Qayamat.

If someone says he is, then you have no right to doubt him because your Dunia and Akhrat does not depend on him being a real syed or a Fake Syed.

brother taliban:
- it is wrong to feel proud of your lineage as it had nothing to do with you. it was Allah (SWT) who decided where to put you. a syed girl who feels awkward in a pathan house as their daughter in law because she feels they are of lower caste should be ashamed of herself. Pride is wrong when others are looked down. This pride has got nothing to do with Takabbur (that you look down on others). Don't you thank Allah that he gave you great parents, did not make you a beggar on the streets, made you a Muslim. Aren't you proud to be a muslim?

Hazrat Umar married the daughter of Hazrat Ali only because he wanted to create a strong connection with the family of Rasool Allah . I posted the hadith somewhere on the forum.

No, if a Syed girl feels awkward, there is nothing to be ashamed of because this awkwardness is taken into consideration by Shariat as stated by Fuqaha.

It's the same as the Govt did'n't allow Saudi Girls to be married to non saudis. They are allowed now but with strict conditions!

- durood is for the Prophet (PBUH) and his ummat. not just his family. your interpretation is very strange. What does وعلي ال محمد mean?

there are factors that shd be considered when choosing a family:
-mother tongue: believe it or not you will find it very hard to raise kids if both parents have diff mother tongues. but its not impossible.
-piety: you quoted the hadith. that is the basis.
-wealth: really?you dont have to be super rich you just need to have enough wealth to not come on the streets. thats the lowest rung on the ladder. any 'pious' girl will not be materialistic so to speak. are you aware of the setting behind Hazrat Ali (ra) and hazrat fatima's marriage?hence it is against taqwa to reject someone who is earning a decent living and is pious but you want your daughter to be with someone who drives a ferrari and may not know jack about basic islam. believe me this happens.
- lineage: absolute rubbish. this syed and ansari and sheikh stuff is absolutely bogus. people actually feel proud of being known by this! any practising muslim with fear of Allah will not look down upon others based on their lineage. give me proof from the Prophet (PBUH) and his companion's time. dont quote desai.
- occupation: tells you whether the income is halal or haram and whether the boy will be able to provide in the future. You just differ on the lineage matter because maybe You don't like it!

I won't quote desai or anyone. You can email your question to Islamqa.

when nikah becomes difficult because of self-imposed ideologies and difficulties then your society will see a rampant increase in zina and fahashi. good luck beating the syed drum when your son or daughter becomes involved in an illicit relationship because you cannot find a filthy rich syed family. There are many more things to worry about than lineage. Well actually I don't think there are many cases of Syed girl falling into Zina because they can't find syed families. Please don't be emotional here.

the Prophet (PBUH) destroyed all such notions of lineage and nationalism during his last sermon. which means we are not to be proud of our family, our nation, tribe etc. they are for identification and thats that. Yes they are for identification and thats that! Don't make it more than that!

[Redys]

You can put it in your children's name then you can Answer to Allah on the day of Qayamat.

If someone says he is, then you have no right to doubt him because your Dunia and Akhrat does not depend on him being a real syed or a Fake Syed.

but there are fake syeds no?and what about the dunya and akhirat of those people obsessed with only finding syeds for their children?what would you call a person who rejected proposal after proposal of pious individuals and then got their daughter married to a secular syed?it is this mentality which i am speaking against


Pride is wrong when others are looked down. This pride has got nothing to do with Takabbur (that you look down on others). Don't you thank Allah that he gave you great parents, did not make you a beggar on the streets, made you a Muslim. Aren't you proud to be a muslim?

No, if a Syed girl feels awkward, there is nothing to be ashamed of because this awkwardness is taken into consideration by Shariat as stated by Fuqaha.

brother i read the fatwa posted on this thread. there is nothing wrong with marrying a syed and finding it meritorious (as shown by Hazrat umar's example). that however does not prove syeds should not marry into other families.
what is wrong is when a syed girl or her family would refuse to marry into a good pious family with a decent income because they are lower in rank.
how is that not takabbur?i'll give you a detailed example. a non-syed family who are pious will have a religious environment and they enjoin good and forbid evil. their women observe purdah. their income is halal. yet the syed girl feels 'awkward'. why? because they are of lower rank?she thinks they are of less worth than her?being a syed automatically means she is better?
if she or her wali has this thinking then syed or not. they are jahil. this awkwardness is takabbur and this awkwardness is again, what i am speaking against.
i am proud to be a muslim but islam doesnt allow me to look down upon non-muslims. islam is not my right it is a gift from Allah. the more humble i am in gratefulness the better. similarly if im a syed i shd feel honoured. it is my identification. thats that. those who are not syed may be better muslims and have better taqwa. if i look down upon them it is a shortcoming of my own emaan


It's the same as the Govt did'n't allow Saudi Girls to be married to non saudis. They are allowed now but with strict conditions!

maybe they did it because of language difference. have u thought about that?language is a very very big barrier which mufti desai did not mention in his fatwa

What does وعلي ال محمد mean?
i will study more into this and will elt u know.
however i dont see the relevance of this on this thread. being a syed doesnt make a person a better muslim.


You just differ on the lineage matter because maybe You don't like it!
correct. and i think lineage is irrelevant when it comes to choosing a good marriage partner.impractical and harbinger of fitna
I won't quote desai or anyone. You can email your question to Islamqa.
i dont like that site that much just so u knw


There are many more things to worry about than lineage. Well actually I don't think there are many cases of Syed girl falling into Zina because they can't find syed families. Please don't be emotional here.
well why do the have to find syed families thats all im asking? ive quoted my opinion above. tell me how im wrong


Yes they are for identification and thats that! Don't make it more than that!
identification becomes a problem once u start to feel proud and haughty because of it. while deciding for marriage the question of being a syed (or not being one) should not be made an issue.

read in bold please. thanks

[Stetbrate]

Salam Aleykum,

Hmmm, Sayyeds marrying non-Sayyeds is Haram you say? Let me give you the most famous examples, Didn't the Prophet SAWS give two of his "Sayyed" daughters to thu al-Noorayn 'Uthman ibn 'Affan (ra)? 'Uthman was not a Sayyed yet he married two Sayyed women...
Didn't 'Ali ibn abi Talib (ra) give his "Sayyed" daughter Umm Kulthoum bin Fatima to the Caliph Ameer al-Mumineen 'Umar ibn al-Khattab (ra)? 'Umar was not a Sayyed yet he married 'Ali's daughter.

So this cultural mumbo-jumbo comes directly from the subcontinent, because some people deceived others by telling them that they were "Sayyeds" then started acting like they were ABOVE everyone else, like a Pope.

enjoy,

[Kryfamid]

NOTE: regarding al-Ibrahimiyat or "Durood" when you say:

"Allahuma Salli 'ala Muhammad wa Aal Muhammad"

Some scholars explained "Aal" as: Nation, Followers and Family.

Most scholars said "Aal" just means: Family.

[eEwbYjOH]

Salam Aleykum,

Hmmm, Sayyeds marrying non-Sayyeds is Haram you say? Let me give you the most famous examples, Didn't the Prophet SAWS give two of his "Sayyed" daughters to thu al-Noorayn 'Uthman ibn 'Affan (ra)? 'Uthman was not a Sayyed yet he married two Sayyed women...
Didn't 'Ali ibn abi Talib (ra) give his "Sayyed" daughter Umm Kulthoum bin Fatima to the Caliph Ameer al-Mumineen 'Umar ibn al-Khattab (ra)? 'Umar was not a Sayyed yet he married 'Ali's daughter.

So this cultural mumbo-jumbo comes directly from the subcontinent, because some people deceived others by telling them that they were "Sayyeds" then started acting like they were ABOVE everyone else, like a Pope.

enjoy,

Totally wrong understanding and your cursing based on your own wrong understanding.

[nerkvcbtre]

Totally wrong understanding and your cursing based on your own wrong understanding.

Huh? excuse me did I miss something? I only read the OP.

[Poowssnople]

So this cultural mumbo-jumbo comes directly from the subcontinent, because some people deceived others by telling them that they were "Sayyeds" then started acting like they were ABOVE everyone else, like a Pope.

I agree with you. I have personally seen many such families who think they are far superior and "special" just because they are syed. Even non-practicing Syeds think they are an exclusive group, especially when it comes to marriage.

Being reverts from a Shia sect, we look only at Deen for marriage but we got a reality check when we were trying to get married. We were/are looked down upon as impure lineage by our Syed beothers and sisters.....deen...aah..who cares! This is just my experience.

[geniusxs81]

Why is taking lineage into consideration while marrying off daughters made as something evil.

Is it WORST than refusing a proposal for MONEY or just because the boy is just BBA and not MBA?

That's worst!

[G8whlTAe]

Why is taking lineage into consideration while marrying off daughters made as something evil.

Is it WORST than refusing a proposal for MONEY or just because the boy is just BBA and not MBA?

That's worst!

I don't get it? So you think Sayyeds should only marry Sayyeds?

[pinawinekolad]

I don't get it? So you think Sayyeds should only marry Sayyeds?

Please read the posts made by me earlier in this thread.

[FourEsters]

Please read the posts made by me earlier in this thread.

Yes I just read them all at your request, more importantly you commented on my post and said that I don't understand something, can you tell me what I wrote which is wrong in my post? because The companions did not think in this way and I already gave you examples, I'll give more:

al-Hussein ibn 'Ali (ra) who was a Sayyed married Umm Ishaq bint Talha bin 'Ubeidullah (ra) and she was not a Sayyedah, they produced a daughter called Fatima bint al-Hussein and she was a Sayyedah and who did she marry? did she marry another Sayyed? Nope her parents married her to 'Abdullah al-Mutraf ibn 'Amro ibn 'Uthman ibn 'Affan (ra) who was an Umayyad and not a Sayyed.

And there are plenty of examples, so where is the evil in this act exactly?

[pipittujbk]

Yes I just read them all at your request, more importantly you commented on my post and said that I don't understand something, can you tell me what I wrote which is wrong in my post? because The companions did not think in this way and I already gave you examples, I'll give more:

al-Hussein ibn 'Ali (ra) who was a Sayyed married Umm Ishaq bint Talha bin 'Ubeidullah (ra) and she was not a Sayyedah, they produced a daughter called Fatima bint al-Hussein and she was a Sayyedah and who did she marry? did she marry another Sayyed? Nope her parents married her to 'Abdullah al-Mutraf ibn 'Amro ibn 'Uthman ibn 'Affan (ra) who was an Umayyad and not a Sayyed.

And there are plenty of examples, so where is the evil in this act exactly?

So where did I say it's haram or it's evil to marry to non syeds?

My sisters are married to non syeds. I'm married to Non syed.

Why did a divorce take place between Hazrat Zaid and Hazrat Zainab رضي الله عنهم اجمعين?

[SkatrySkith]

So where did I say it's haram or it's evil to marry to non syeds?

My sisters are married to non syeds. I'm married to Non syed.

Why did a divorce take place between Hazrat Zaid and Hazrat Zainab رضي الله عنهم اجمعين?

The Prophet SAWS adopted Zaid at the age of eight, he was called Zaid ibn Muhammad but when the verses were revealed, adoption of this kind was made unlawful and he went back to being called Zaid ibn Harithah, Allah instead recommended the Muslims to foster orphans:

The Prophet (pbuh) is also reported to have said: "I, and the one who looks after an orphan, will be like this in Paradise," showing his middle and index fingers and separating them. (Sahih Bukhari, Vol. 7, Hadith No. 224)

However the Arabs of the time had the habit of adopting and naming the child after their own names and giving the child inheritance and basically treating him like a member of the family, thus marrying your son's wife was not allowed and considered a bad thing, Allah changed this practice completely, he says in the Quran:

"Name them after their fathers, that is more just with Allah. If you do not know their fathers, regard them as your brothers in the religion, or those under your sponsorship. There is no fault in you if you make mistakes, but only in what your hearts intended. Allah is Forgiving and the Most Merciful" (33:5)

As for Zaid and Zeinab:

1-They had a lot of family problems and Zaid used to come to the prophet SAWS to complain about Zeinab.

It is recorded in "Jami'i al-Bayan" by al-Tabari 11/22 and "Tafseer al-Quran al-'Azeem" by ibn Katheer 3/489 and in al-Bukhari #4787 that Allah already told the Prophet SAWS that Zaid was going to divorce his wife Zeinab, the couple had problems and they couldn't continue their life together. Zaid used to even come to the prophet SAWS to complain about his wife as narrated by Anas in the Sahih:

"Zaid bin Haritha came to the Prophet complaining about his wife."

The Prophet's SAWS reaction would be: "O Zaid, be afraid of Allah and keep your wife."

2-Allah told the Prophet SAWS that he was going to grant him his adoptive son's Wife and he feared the People's reaction since back in those days this was considered a shameful act.

3-The Prophet SAWS kept telling Zaid to be patient and to keep his wife.

"And when you said to he whom Allah had favored and yourself have favored: 'Keep your wife and fear Allah' and you sought to hide in yourself what Allah was to reveal, fearing people; although Allah has a better right for you to fear Him." [33:37]

4-What Allah had willed had happened and the Prophet SAWS fulfilled Allah's orders when Zaid divorced his wife.

"And when Zayd had accomplished what he would of her (divorce), We gave her to you (Prophet Muhammad) in marriage, so that there is no fault in believers concerning (marriage to) the former spouse of their foster children if they divorced them. The decree of Allah must be done." [33:37]

[Sheestgag]

"Zaid bin Haritha came to the Prophet complaining about his wife."

Why? What were the problems and why?


2-Allah told the Prophet SAWS that he was going to grant him his adoptive son's daughter and he feared the People's reaction since back in those days this was considered a shameful act.
Daughter?

[VIAGRA-VIAGRA]

Khair, Let's leave the argument here.

Fuqaha have clearly stated about KUFW in their books.

Fuqaha are on our heads and eyes!

If someone wants to say that considering lineage in marriages is NON SENSE then it's their problem.

I just want to say that even if we take it as an evil, it is lesser evil than considering MONEY ...

[Qeiafib]

Why? What were the problems and why?




Daughter?

Sorry I meant wife not daughter, phew

[xsexymasterix]

Ussalamulaikum

I have absolutely nothing of benefit to add. But, had to say something (as how often do you see a thread about your own name)


I have never given my name to much thought as when I asked an Arab brother he asked me how I pronounced it and when I did so he told me it means "Mr".
Had I pronounced it with elongated "sa" "eid" it means happy.

In saying that I am a firm believer that names are important and often see the character of a person being a reflection of their name.

Walaikum salaam
just another Syed

[Qauunet]

those who take fuqaha's opinions even when the incorrectness and impracticality of their logic is glaring in their faces are the ones who need a reality check. one mufti gives one fatwa and the other one gives another. so instead of playing 'my mufti' why not use your common sense? i clearly mentioned how any person who rejects someone on the basis of lower ranked lineage is arrogant and i gave an example to show that. br tripoly sunni gave better proofs from the Companions' example. this further shows the hollowness of the fatwa from askimam.

[AntonayPina]

those who take fuqaha's opinions even when the incorrectness and impracticality of their logic is glaring in their faces are the ones who need a reality check. one mufti gives one fatwa and the other one gives another. so instead of playing 'my mufti' why not use your common sense? i clearly mentioned how any person who rejects someone on the basis of lower ranked lineage is arrogant and i gave an example to show that. br tripoly sunni gave better proofs from the Companions' example. this further shows the hollowness of the fatwa from askimam.

If we use common sense then we come to the same conclusion.

Well, bro tripoly did not give any better proof. I asked him for a particular reason as to why the marriage of Syedah Zainab رضي الله عنها and Hazrat Zaid رضي الله عنه failed but he brought forward nothing regarding the exact reason.

The only problem I see here is your failure to accept that lineage can be a valid reason in marriages not working. I can't understand how you can accept rejecting on basis of wealth,money,looks as valid reasons but rejecting on basis of lineage as Arrogant!