[seatlyled]

As salaamu aleykum, I was wondering if anyone could provide me with information about Ibadi Islam, particularly the details of their salat. From what I can tell, here are some interesting practices:

-EDIT: I originally stated that the Ibadis reject stoning to death for married zanis and advocate 100 lashes (per 24:2) for married and unmarried adulterers, based on what I had read from another website, however, it seem that they do indeed stone married adulterers and lash unmarried ones, in accordance with the Sunnah. You can download a free book about them here:

http://www.lulu.com/browse/book_view...684&fBuyItem=3

It is published by the Government of Oman The Center for Admonition and Islamic Research in the Ministry of Justice, Awqaf and Islamic Affairs and entitled "Ibadhism — A Moderate Sect of Islam" by Sheikh Ali Yahya Muammar. The scholar states that Ibadhis are often confused with the Khawarij, who did not advocate stoning, however, he claims Ibadhis are different.

-They pray with their arms at their sides, and as far as I have been able to tell, do not raise them at all, even for the opening takbir.

-No ameen after al-Fatihah.

-During silent prayers (Dhuhr, Asr, and the ones during Maghrib and Isha), they only recite al-Fatihah.

-They say "hayya ala khairil amal" during adhan and don't say, "As-salat khairun minan naum," during the fajr adhan.

-They consider Musnad Ar-Rabii ibn Habib to be the most sahih collection of hadiths, written in the second century A.H. You can download it from http://istiqama.net/.

Some aqeedah:

http://www.angelfire.com/ok5/ibadhiyah/ibadhisunni.html

Some more: http://www.islamfact.com/books-htm/a...ismstudies.htm

If anyone knows anything else about them, I would love to know. Thanks a lot. As salaamu aleykum.

[RobsShow]

Wa 'alaykum salam

Are they shias?

[viagsjicguara]

They are neither Sunni nor Shia, they have their own political views, however, they don't believe in nikah muta, infallibility, etc. You can read more about them on the website I posted.

[stadiaKab]

They are said to be a sect of khariji

http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.a...ID=145&CATE=24

[Qauunet]

They are Khawwarijj, even if they are a moderate sect of them. The polemical defense of their not being Khawwarijj is of no value since they DO consider us as kaafir duna, the only difference is that they aren't going to be as extreme where its not viable (as compared to other Kharijji sects). But in many things they are similar to Ahlus Sunnah and when it comes to ahadith, than they narrate them from the Sahaba (ra) also.

[gueremaisse]

As salaamu aleykum, I was wondering if anyone could provide me with information about Ibadi Islam, particularly the details of their salat.

I used to have several good internet sources on ibadis, but my computer tragically melted and I had to reformat it. I'm trying to find all my bookmarks again, slowly but surely..

As for their salat, they leave their hands at their sides like Malikis.

I've posted a scholarly (orientalist?) article on them. The html book you provided a link to is available in pdf if you look around.

There's also this on the Ibadi school of law:
http://www.muslimheritage.com/topics...&ArticleID=483

[gfkasjhfg]

Brother, I'm a bit dubious about the comparison of Ibadi and Sunni positions on one of those links you sent, which seems to have been compiled by an ibadi. Some of the sunni positions he puts down seem grossly anthropomorphic to me.

[TCjwwhcY]

As salaamu aleykum, I was wondering if anyone could provide me with information about Ibadi Islam, particularly the details of their salat. From what I can tell, here are some interesting practices:

-EDIT: I originally stated that the Ibadis reject stoning to death for married zanis and advocate 100 lashes (per 24:2) for married and unmarried adulterers, based on what I had read from another website, however, it seem that they do indeed stone married adulterers and lash unmarried ones, in accordance with the Sunnah. You can download a free book about them here:

http://www.lulu.com/browse/book_view...684&fBuyItem=3

It is published by the Government of Oman The Center for Admonition and Islamic Research in the Ministry of Justice, Awqaf and Islamic Affairs and entitled "Ibadhism — A Moderate Sect of Islam" by Sheikh Ali Yahya Muammar. The scholar states that Ibadhis are often confused with the Khawarij, who did not advocate stoning, however, he claims Ibadhis are different.

-They pray with their arms at their sides, and as far as I have been able to tell, do not raise them at all, even for the opening takbir.

-No ameen after al-Fatihah.

-During silent prayers (Dhuhr, Asr, and the ones during Maghrib and Isha), they only recite al-Fatihah.

-They say "hayya ala khairil amal" during adhan and don't say, "As-salat khairun minan naum," during the fajr adhan.

-They consider Musnad Ar-Rabii ibn Habib to be the most sahih collection of hadiths, written in the second century A.H. You can download it from http://istiqama.net/.

Some aqeedah:

http://www.angelfire.com/ok5/ibadhiyah/ibadhisunni.html

Some more: http://www.islamfact.com/books-htm/a...ismstudies.htm

If anyone knows anything else about them, I would love to know. Thanks a lot. As salaamu aleykum.

Ibadi what? Never heard of them.

Hadhrat Umar did say that he feared one day people will neglect the ruling of stoning the adulterer as they won't find it in the Qur'an. Praying arms at the side are fine for one thing, but not saying Takbir don't they know why the Takbir was established in the first place (eg. the munafiq used to place idols if I recall under their arm pits while they were praying and the Takbir was finally established). No Ameen? Perhaps they take the silent route?

[DonnyKong]

Thanks a lot Ma'ruf, I've also scoured JSTOR for them. :P

I've attached their hadith collection called "al-Jami'i al-Sahih," also known as Musnad al-Rabi bin Habib. The original version composed by him is not in use anymore, and the one that we have today was rearranged by Abu Ya'qub Yusuf bin Ibrahim al-Warijlani and is entitled Tartib al-Musnad:

http://www.islamfact.com/books-htm/ibadi/39.htm

It has a little over 1,000 hadiths, some which are really familiar and in Sahih collection (i.e. al-Ikhlas is 1/3 of the Qur'an, etc.) and some which I've never heard before. I posted two other official documents. Much more (in Arabic) is available on http://www.ibadhiyah.net/ and http://www.istiqama.net/. There's fatwas on Itsiqama about various aspects of fiqh from their Grand Mufti Sheikh Ahmed bin Hamed Al-Khalili. Here is one on combining prayers that has been translated:

Question:

Recently, it has been common among people to pray Jam'e [i.e. to join Zuhr and Asr prayers in the time of one prayer; and Maghrib and Esha'a in the time of one prayer] to the extent that some people think that a traveler should pray Jam'e at all times and that he should not separate between Zuhr and Asr; and also between Maghrib and Esha. Also people pray Jam'e although they remain in the mosque until the next prayer. Please clarify this matter.

Answer:

Alhamdulellah kama howa laho ahl wasalato wa salam ala sayedena Mohammed wa ala aalehe wa sahbehe.

It is sadly regretted that this habit of praying Jam'e between two prayers in the time of one prayer for travelers has spread among people that some may think that a traveler can not pray without joining Zuhr and Asr; and Also Maghrib and Esha'a; which is not true.

Prophet Mohammed PBUH joined Zuhr and Asr; and Maghrib and Esha'a, only in Gazwat Tabook [The Battle of Tabook] and in Haj in Arafaat. I cannot find a justification for those staying in one place for months and years, and still praying Jam'e all the time with no reason.

The Jam'e between 2 prayers in a mosque may cause one of the following:

1. People may stay in the mosque until the next prayer comes and they will leave the mosque after azzan. This is against the teaching of Prophet Mohammed PBUH; and therefore must be avoided.

2. Once some people pray Jam'e, they stay in the mosque talking with each other about personal, social and materialistic issues apart from worship, and this is against the teaching of the Holy Quraan and the Prophet.

3. In an attempt to pray Jam'e between two prayers, people while trying to gather and form a line may cause disturbance to other prayers which is strictly forbidden in Islam.

4. Also, in a crowded mosque, the line of those prayers trying to pray the next prayer may not be continued all the way, as other prayers may Remain in their positions or pray sunnah or nafilah . This discontinuity in the line is strongly not acceptable in the teaching of Prophet Mohammed PBUH; and will harm the validity of the prayer itself.

5. There might be 2 groups of people praying in the same time within the same mosque, one is praying Zuhr for example and the other praying Asr. This might lead to chaos, disturbance and un-clarity among prayers inside the mosque. This is not acceptable at all as given in the teaching of Prophet Mohammed PBUH.

6. Even though if a person prayed Asr or Esha'a while traveling, and He arrived home or with a group at the time of the that prayer, this person should pray with that group the prayer he already prayed, but as Nafilah as given in the teaching of Prophet Mohammed PBUH.

Finally, based on the above facts, I urge everyone to avoid praying Jam'e unless there is a necessity; and also to educate other people and families about this fatwa so that people are well-educated about such issues related to their religion.

Wa Allah waleyo atawfiq wa sala Allah wa salam ala sayedena Mohammed wa ala aalehe wa sahbehe ajmaeen.

As salaamu aleykum.

[beatrisio]

Another site on Ibadi tafsir:

http://www.islamfact.com/books-htm/t...baditafsir.htm

This is by Shaykh Dr. Kahlan bin Nahban Al-Kharusi, the Jurisprudential Advisor in the Office for the Issuance of Fatwas, also an Amman Message signer.

[HaseBeceDeemy]

Thanks a lot Ma'ruf, I've also scoured JSTOR for them. :P

Ahhh JSTOR, that most useful holder of islamic resources : ) I have an article from there on al Layth in FRENCH that i'm still trying to find someone to translate.

[Qahtwugc]

Ma'ruf, post it up, I speak French. I don't have anything to do tonight, so do it quick before I change my mind.

[Boripiomi]

Akramak Allah!!

If it's too long or difficult, don't stress yourself about it.. I'm just curious to know what it says. : )

[Friend_Joe]

“Al-Layth Ibn Sa'ad, the Master and Patron of Egypt, As Seen Through Some Classical Islamic Documents”

The article begins with a brief biography of Imam Layth and says that he was born in Qalqashanda, Egypt in 94 (713). This is the most accepted opinion, with others citing he was born in 92, but with less certainty. It further goes on to say that he was the cousin of a local emir named Ibn Rifa'a, however, details on his life are sketchy. His history picks up in 113 (731) when he made his first hajj to Makkah with Ibn Lahi'a, who would become a judge in Egypt, where after he exhibited religious and scientific desires. Going on with a few more miscellaneous biographical details, it says after this (the article does not elaborate as to how), he was blessed with wisdom in jurisprudential matters and became skilled in Qu'ranic recitation. While he was quite rich due to inheritance and other connections, his life was completely balanced. It seems that much of the information that we know about it comes from Abd Allah Ibn Salih (137/754-223/838), his secretary.

The article then goes into a short history of Layth's connections with local Egyptian politicians and religious authorities. Although it does not go into the details of why, it recounts the classic quotes of Layth's superiority to Malik. Firstly, one from Khatib al-Baghdadi in his "Tarikh" in which he quotes Ibn Bukayr (154/770-231/845) and Sa'id Ibn Abi Ayyub (718-782) as saying, "Lau anna Malikan wa-l-Laytha ijtama’a la-kana Mulikun 'inda l-Laythi abkama."--If Layth and Malik were to suddenly meet, the latter would be dumbfounded (silenced). Also, it recounts the classic Shafi'i quotes, "al-Laythu afqahu min Malikin illa anna ashabahu lam yaqumu bihi,"-- Layth is a greater scholar than Malik, but his followers are not very committed to him (rough translation). Also, "al-Laythu atba’u li-l-athari min Malikin,"--Layth is closer to the sunnah than Malik. Finally, one from Ibn Bukayr, "al-Laythu afqahu min Malikin wu-lakin kanat al-huzwatu li-Malikin,"--Layth is superior to Malik in jurisprudence, but he is the favorite.

It goes on to say that of course it's difficult for the rulings of an Egyptian far removed from Madinah to be compared to a local like Malik, however, it must be noted that Malik himself had much praise for Layth and gratitude for the positions he advanced. Moreover, evidence points to the fact that they had regular correspondence, usually transported via Hajj pilgrims like Uthman Ibn Salih (d. 219), one of Layth's students. It says that these letters were preserved by Ibn Qayyim al-Jauziyya (d. 751) in his "Risala min al-Layth Ibn Sa'ad ila Malik Ibn Anas." (This can be found in his I'lam al-Muwaqqi'in 'an Rabb al-'Alamin (published in Cairo in 1325) and parts in Fuat Sezgin's Geschichre des arabischen Schrifrtums, Leiden, 1967). One of the letters is summarized:

-It begins with typical Islamic salutations and Layth's deep respect for the school of Madinah, praising it as the place where the Qur'an was revealed.
-It goes on to say that jurisprudential matters were raised in the letters with each side's arguments being addressed. While Layth says that it is true that Madinah is the home of the Muslims, many reliable companions also left this Holy City and dispersed throughout the region to Syria, Iraq, and Egypt with the same command that no innovation come into the religion. He furthermore states that Madinah is not a golden standard of the sunnah just by its existence and recounts that once Malik had to leave the study session of Rabi'a ibn Abi Abd al-Rahman (d. 136), one of the early jurists of Madinah, over a disagreement and how the two had even once addressed how to counter the opinions of Rabi’a.

In another letter he tells Malik that some works in his name that are being circulated in Egypt and inquired as to their authenticity: Fa-innaha kutubun intahat ilayna 'anka fa-ahbabtu an ablugha haqiqataha bi-nazarika fiha (all of this from Ibn Qayyim).

It goes on to talk a little about the Muwatta and lists another quote from Al-Khatib al-Baghdadi where Ibn Wahb states, "Kullu ma kana fi kutubi Malikin, wa-akhbarani man arda min ahli l-'ilmi fa-huwa al-Laythu Ibnu Sa'din," and "Kullu ma kana fi kutubi Malikin wa-akhbarani man athiqu bihi min ahli l-‘ilmi fa-huwa al-Laythu Ibnu Sa'din—basically saying that he regards Layth’s rulings to be the most sound.

I would try to find these letters, I think they could shed a lot of light on Malik and Layth's relationship and rulings.

Hope this helps.

As salaamu aleykum

[miel]

Thank you very much, jazak Allah kheir : )

I was curious about al Layth ever since i saw the comment of a person who said that he would have been lost because of hadith, if he had not met al Layth and Malik. It's a little bit difficult to find information. I was already familiar with the comments about his superiority to Malik attributed to al-Shafii...interesting... In al Bidayat al Mujtahid, ibn Rushd often notes al Layth's judgments, as he does with similar figures such as al Auzai and al Thawri, but on occasion quite critically for holding positions with weak evidence.

Thanks again for your help!

[easypokergonj]

Wow, JazakAllahkhair baa7ith! Every now and than someone makes useful posts here

[en-druzhba]

As salaamu 'alaykum

What do contemporary 'ulema say about praying behind them?

[AffipgyncDync]

As salaamu 'alaykum

What do contemporary 'ulema say about praying behind them?

My nearest masjid is led by Ibadis

I have no option but to pray there even though i dont believe in some of their beliefs

[fetesiceWaist]

Don't these people declare Hazrat Ali (ra) and Hazrat Uthman (ra) as kufaar? I'd be very cautious about them and their beliefs.