[Junrlaeh]

I think you are young and naive, sitting in your arm chair it is easy to tell others to make the right sacrifices for 'your' cause. You might even be naive enough to put yourself and your family in danger. One of the reasons the traditional Muslim ulama prevented people from rebelling against rulers is because they did not want a country to turn into a warzone. Maybe you think a warzone is not that bad. I am talking about being stuck in your house for weeks and months not being able to step out to get some food or water, bombs and bullets flying everywhere killing your children and maybe even you.

clearly many of those people in syria DO want it to be a warzone and it is their homeland so with all due respect your view clearly isnt shared by teh syrian people.

yes people will die, but inshallah they will die as shaheeds for a very important cause. we cant leave people like assad in charge, many of his ilk are gone now and before they were choking the ummah and inshAllah Assad will go soon. clearly the syrian people believe in this

[Nubtoubrem]

Isn't this the guy who thinks Shia are our brothers and that those rising against Assad the dog are puppets of Dajjal? And he ...takes many hadith to be symbolic when they are clearly literal and no one has considered them to be symbolic before him?...

I too have noticed that sadly this is the case.

...

Anyone who observes the the patterns of development in mid-east politics cannot miss that the Muslims are being divided between the Sunnis on the one hand and everyone else on the other hand.

The Sunnis have no real friends amongst the non-Muslims and there is a block made up of the Rafidites of Iran, Iraq and Shams (that includes the Alawite Baathists) which has a deep venom against true Islam and is a threat just like the Zionists are.

Sheikh Imran Nasr Hossein's analysis is skewed and misguides Muslims, stopping them from realizing pressing concerns. He has used guesswork to produce an inaccurate analysis that has resulted in him seeking the wrong friends and making the wrong enemies.

[Junrlaeh]

If I say to you you are wrong and in a Islamic state you would be killed. This is the threat of violence. It would be better if instead I said look you are wrong because xyz and I have these very convincing arguments as proof. It sounds more civillized, the way of violence means you do not have any proof and you are afraid so you want to kill the person.

noone was threatening violence akhi, just making a point taht what he has said is punishable in islamic law i.e. its a serious issue

[Nubtoubrem]

I think you are young and naive, sitting in your arm chair it is easy to tell others to make the right sacrifices for 'your' cause. You might even be naive enough to put yourself and your family in danger. One of the reasons the traditional Muslim ulama prevented people from rebelling against rulers is because they did not want a country to turn into a warzone. Maybe you think a warzone is not that bad. I am talking about being stuck in your house for weeks and months not being able to step out to get some food or water, bombs and bullets flying everywhere killing your children and maybe even you.

if the murder and absolute tyranny of the Bathist Nusayri Alawite murderers isn't a justification for Jihad, what is?


Fighting is enjoined upon you, while it is hard on you.

It could be that you dislike something, when it is good for you;

and it could be that you like something when it is bad for you.

Allah knows, and you do not know.


(Mufti Taqi Usmani (db) translation of Holy Quran Surah al-Baqara 2.216 which was revealed)

[Junrlaeh]

You call unarmed civilians going against an army with tanks, bombs and guns a jihad? It is a slaughter and the people who have started the rebellion are only aggravating the Tyrant. Only bloodshed will be acheived. Revolution and Rebellion are not the Muslim way. Real jihad fee sabillilah is when you fight in ranks against the kuffar with appropriate weapons. It is part of kufr politics to instigate revolutions and coup. Sun Tzu a Chinese strategist taught that battles can be won in without fighting, it sounds like Muslims need to learn strategy and they need leadership, not a leaderless mob of un armed revolutionaries.

if the murder and absolute tyranny of the Bathist Nusayri Alawite murderers isn't a justification for Jihad, what is?


Fighting is enjoined upon you, while it is hard on you.

It could be that you dislike something, when it is good for you;

and it could be that you like something when it is bad for you.

Allah knows, and you do not know.


(Mufti Taqi Usmani (db) translation of Holy Quran Surah al-Baqara 2.216 which was revealed)

[crazuMovies]

You call unarmed civilians going against an army with tanks, bombs and guns a jihad? It is a slaughter and the people who have started the rebellion are only aggravating the Tyrant. Only bloodshed will be acheived. Revolution and Rebellion are not the Muslim way. Real jihad fee sabillilah is when you fight in ranks against the kuffar with appropriate weapons. It is part of kufr politics to instigate revolutions and coup. Sun Tzu a Chinese strategist taught that battles can be won in without fighting, it sounds like Muslims need to learn strategy and they need leadership, not a leaderless mob of un armed revolutionaries.

Brother, you speak alot of sense. But the people of Syria, directly or indirectly are suffering from this conflict. In light of this, may I ask, what would you see as the way forwards here to bring an end to the continued warfare, destruction and death?

On the matter of Imran Hussein, following his talks on economics and global affairs is one thing - which he is good at - although maybe not articulated in the best fashion. On matters regarding Islam and primary sources, Qur'an and Hadith etc, I would avoid giving any credence to his views having heard some in his talks in the past.

Allahu A'lam

[stadiaKab]

With regard to the marriage of Aisha (RA) to Rasul it is possible that the hadith could have got the ages wrong...people in the past did not know their exact birth dates or ages.

Yeah.., Aisha (RA) decided to narrate a hadith where she got her own age wrong... OK. And I would like to know the basis for your claim that people in the past did not know their own ages or birth dates since CLEARLY many arabs, especially of lineage) kept records of such things and not only the arabs, but people of other civilisations too

And Imran Hosein did not claim that perhaps she got her age wrong, but he said the hadith has to be FABRICATED purely because he did not like what the hadith stated. Oh, and Aisha's age is proven to be 9 in more ways than one... this hadith regarding her age(found in Bukhari, Muslim, etc) is not the only way we know she was 9 at the time of consummation

With regards to Jihad against the syrian regime, he called those who fight against Assad as terrorists. He did not say 'we shouldn't fight' or anything like that (although that is certainly implied) but he decided to call these people who are defending their own children, their own mothers and sisters as 'terrorists'. He should bring forth his proof if he does not want to be known as someone who slanders

[Junrlaeh]

Dates of birth are only important in modern times because we are required to have birth certificates etc. by the state. people in the past did not know their exact date of birth they lived by the seasons, there were no clocks times were give approximately. I am just trying to say that the age issue does not have to be something that causes people to become argumentative there might be room fro disagreement. I have no actual proof for this assertion...My grand father did not know his birth date, he was born in India in the early 1900, when required to fill in forms by the British he simply made a date up. Now I know the Arabs had good memories and were keen on memorizing lineage, so this may not be applicable to them, but they definitely did not write things down and keep records it was a oral tradition. I am not sure if dates of birth and such like were as important to the ancients as they are to us today. The age of Aisha (RA) may well be correctly worked out by scholars in other ways, I am no expert, I am just saying there might be room for legitimate difference of opinion.

I have already stated in the past on this message board that I disagree with Imran Husseins wierd interpretations of hadith. So I do not really have a bias towards him. I just think people should be given the benefit of the doubt. The word Terrorist means what? It can mean that these people are Terrorists because they are going up against a tyrant and creating conflict.

BTW did you know about this group:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allianc...outh_Movements

If not have a read and see how Washigton is attempting to ferment revolution across the Islamic world.

Yeah.., Aisha (RA) decided to narrate a hadith where she got her own age wrong... OK. And I would like to know the basis for your claim that people in the past did not know their own ages or birth dates since CLEARLY many arabs, especially of lineage) kept records of such things and not only the arabs, but people of other civilisations too

And Imran Hosein did not claim that perhaps she got her age wrong, but he said the hadith has to be FABRICATED purely because he did not like what the hadith stated. Oh, and Aisha's age is proven to be 9 in more ways than one... this hadith regarding her age(found in Bukhari, Muslim, etc) is not the only way we know she was 9 at the time of consummation

With regards to Jihad against the syrian regime, he called those who fight against Assad as terrorists. He did not say 'we shouldn't fight' or anything like that (although that is certainly implied) but he decided to call these people who are defending their own children, their own mothers and sisters as 'terrorists'. He should bring forth his proof if he does not want to be known as someone who slanders

[Nubtoubrem]

You call unarmed civilians going against an army with tanks, bombs and guns a jihad? ...... Sun Tzu a Chinese strategist taught that battles can be won in without fighting, it sounds like Muslims need to learn strategy and they need leadership, not a leaderless mob of un armed revolutionaries.

you have apparently have no idea what is going on in Syria brother and it is an insult to call the Free Syrian Army a 'leaderless mob'.

The Free Syrian Army are fighting a guerrilla war against a very evil foe, they are gaining increasing support from outside sources.

Indeed they are increasing in strength every day InshaAllah and their struggle is nothing less than a struggle between those who love Allah and the enemies of Allah.

Saudi officials are preparing to pay the salaries of the Free Syria Army as a means of encouraging mass defections from the military and increasing pressure on the Assad regime....

The move, which has been discussed between Riyadh and senior officials in the US and Arab world, is believed to be gaining momentum as a recent flush of weapons sent to rebel forces by Saudi Arabia and Qatar starts to make an impact on battlefields in Syria.

Officials in the Saudi capital embraced the idea when it was put to them by Arab officials in May, according to sources in three Arab states, around the same time that weapons started to flow across the southern Turkish border into the hands of Free Syria Army leaders.

Turkey has also allowed the establishment of a command centre in Istanbul which is co-ordinating supply lines in consultation with FSA leaders inside Syria...
(source the Guardian)

[Abaanto]

you have apparently have no idea what is going on in Syria brother and it is an insult to call the Free Syrian Army a 'leaderless mob'.

The Free Syrian Army are fighting a guerrilla war against a very evil foe, they are gaining increasing support from outside sources.

Indeed they are increasing in strength every day InshaAllah and their struggle is nothing less than a struggle between those who love Allah and the enemies of Allah.

(source the Guardian)

The "Free Syrian Army" was coined by the those who formented and are supporting the insurrection.
The main supporters are the rulers of Qatar and Saudi, who are the main allies of the CIA in the region outside of Israel.
Do the muslims have a legitimate right to fight an oppressive rule ? Of course. But that right has been legitimate for 40 years.
This rule has been going on for 40 years and more.
Only an ignorant person cannot see that for 40 years they never backed a Free Syrian Army, so why over the last year has it been such an issue.
Where were all anti - Assad rhetoric before the last year, by these phoney supporters of the plan of the CIA ?
Only dumb people see things in black and white, us and them, muslims v oppressors.
Where were these people when the muslims were being oppressed for 40 years or more ? Nowhere.
These are the same people who supported the demise of Ghaddafi. Then afterwards it dawns on the dumb that NATO killed thousands of people in the process
Look at Libya now. A complete mess, descending into more mess, more violence, more lawlessness, more fighting, more civil fighting, more oppression.
Why will Syria be any different. It wont. It will end a mess. And then all these phoney supporters will disappear with their tail between their legs.
Just as they supported the Ghaddafi overthrow, and are now completely silent on the aftermath.

[Abaanto]

You call unarmed civilians going against an army with tanks, bombs and guns a jihad? It is a slaughter and the people who have started the rebellion are only aggravating the Tyrant. Only bloodshed will be acheived. Revolution and Rebellion are not the Muslim way. Real jihad fee sabillilah is when you fight in ranks against the kuffar with appropriate weapons. It is part of kufr politics to instigate revolutions and coup. Sun Tzu a Chinese strategist taught that battles can be won in without fighting, it sounds like Muslims need to learn strategy and they need leadership, not a leaderless mob of un armed revolutionaries.

Exactly. these people dont mind supporting the kufar, when the kufar cloak the narrative within a "muslim v dictator" dichotomy.

[Andrew1978]

So do you two believe that the Palestinians should also give up and move out since they are worse armed than the Free Syrian Army and they go against the combined mights of the Zionist cancer and the US?

Al-Asaad and his followers aren't Muslims to begin with (they are Nusayris) so it isn't even a dichotomy of the Muslim oppressed versus the Muslim oppressor, but Islam against kufr.

[Abaanto]

why dont the zionist and the US support the Free Palestine Army ? Surely they are MORE oppressed and for longer ? They are muslims too arent they ? Why dont Turkey and Saudi and Qatar supply the same support to the Palestinians ?

Exactly. A narrative formed by the media for you, lapped up by you, and propogated by you. Nobody said "muslim oppressor". Learn to read before you comment. The dichotomy is for "black and white" thinkers. As you have proven with your own words.

Al Assad never was a "muslim" ruler; for 40 years; but somehow since the narrative was framed, he needs to go ?

[Andrew1978]

why dont the zionist and the US support the Free Palestine Army ? Surely they are MORE oppressed and for longer ? They are muslims too arent they ? Why dont Turkey and Saudi and Qatar supply the same support to the Palestinians ?

Exactly. A narrative formed by the media for you, lapped up by you, and propogated by you. Nobody said "muslim oppressor". Learn to read before you comment. The dichotomy is for "black and white" thinkers. As you have proven with your own words.

Al Assad never was a "muslim" ruler; for 40 years; but somehow since the narrative was framed, he needs to go ?

Then according to your conspiracy theories, the Free Syrian Army is some sort of puppet? In Egypt, that entire "revolution" was also something that the US wanted. Look how it turned out and Egypt and Muslim in Egypt are better for it. Al-Asaad is a proxy for Iran. Iran may be publicly at odds with the West that is why it appears that the US and its allies oppose al-Asaad. The US has yet to provide any real aid to the Muslims in Syria, whereas Iranian Revolutionary Guards and Hezbullaat have both been fighting alongside the Nusayris against the Muslims.

[Abaanto]

Then according to your conspiracy theories, the Free Syrian Army is some sort of puppet? In Egypt, that entire "revolution" was also something that the US wanted. Look how it turned out and Egypt and Muslim in Egypt are better for it. Al-Asaad is a proxy for Iran. Iran may be publicly at odds with the West that is why it appears that the US and its allies oppose al-Asaad. The US has yet to provide any real aid to the Muslims in Syria, whereas Iranian Revolutionary Guards and Hezbullaat have both been fighting alongside the Nusayris against the Muslims.

Theres no "conspiricy theory" - its in your face - unless the media forms your narrative. The US operates (in this situation) by proxy of Turkey, Qatar and Saudi. This is common knowledge now, so spare yourself the debate. It MUST be a puppet, or else the coup would have been supported for the last 40 years. i dont know why you keep ignoring history. Media narrative, like i said.

you couldnt answer about Syria, so you moved onto Palestine.
you couldnt answer about Palestine, now youve moved onto Egypt.
what country is next. Save me the hassle and just spit it out !

[Andrew1978]

Theres no "conspiricy theory" - its in your face - unless the media forms your narrative.

you couldnt answer about Syria, so you moved onto Palestine.
you couldnt answer about Palestine, now youve moved onto Egypt.
what country is next. Save me the hassle and just spit it out !

Wow, why are you so aggressive and angry?

It is a conspiracy theory. The "media narrative"? Are you serious? There is very little coverage of what exactly is happening in Syria. More people are killed than are reported. The media failed to report the Muslims that have been killed for refusing to say that Bashar is god. Muslims have been buried alive for refusing to say this. The media does not want to play this because if it reports such thing to the Muslim masses, it would become clear that it has long since become a religious war.

I don't watch the news, nor do I get my information on Syria from any Western source and not even al-Jazeerah. I get it from the ulama, the same ulama who condemn Israel and Asaad alike.

Also, if you haven't been following, Palestine has been receiving financial aid from other Muslim countries for decades. These monarchies are too cowardly to take Israel head-on since it has America as its ally but since Syria's only apparent ally is Iran, they don't mind being a little more assertive - yet they still haven't sent in their armies as they should have. Saudia was quick to send its armies into Bahrain to suppress the Shi'a uprising. Why is it not doing the same in Syria when the people of Saudia and the ulama within have been calling for action against Asaad?

Furthermore, if you believe that this is rebellion or revolution, then you are naive since rebellion against a Muslim ameer is prohibited, not fighting against an oppressive kaafir. His father also massacred Muslims in the 80s but due to lack of the current social media networks and camera phones, little was reported outside the Arab world and even within it. But with the technology that we have now, it is harder to hide a conspiracy theory than it would have been otherwise. For example, we knew about Americans and their involvement in Libya before they even announced it. There has been no report of American involvement in Syria. America will only say but do nothing because doing something in Syria will only benefit the Muslims and that would be harmful to its ally, the Zionist cancer.

[Abaanto]

Wow, why are you so aggressive and angry?

It is a conspiracy theory. The "media narrative"? Are you serious? There is very little coverage of what exactly is happening in Syria. More people are killed than are reported. The media failed to report the Muslims that have been killed for refusing to say that Bashar is god. Muslims have been buried alive for refusing to say this. The media does not want to play this because if it reports such thing to the Muslim masses, it would become clear that it has long since become a religious war.

I don't watch the news, nor do I get my information on Syria from any Western source and not even al-Jazeerah. I get it from the ulama, the same ulama who condemn Israel and Asaad alike.

Also, if you haven't been following, Palestine has been receiving financial aid from other Muslim countries for decades. These monarchies are too cowardly to take Israel head-on since it has America as its ally but since Syria's only apparent ally is Iran, they don't mind being a little more assertive - yet they still haven't sent in their armies as they should have. Saudia was quick to send its armies into Bahrain to suppress the Shi'a uprising. Why is it not doing the same in Syria when the people of Saudia and the ulama within have been calling for action against Asaad?

Furthermore, if you believe that this is rebellion or revolution, then you are naive since rebellion against a Muslim ameer is prohibited, not fighting against an oppressive kaafir. His father also massacred Muslims in the 80s but due to lack of the current social media networks and camera phones, little was reported outside the Arab world and even within it. But with the technology that we have now, it is harder to hide a conspiracy theory than it would have been otherwise. For example, we knew about Americans and their involvement in Libya before they even announced it. There has been no report of American involvement in Syria. America will only say but do nothing because doing something in Syria will only benefit the Muslims and that would be harmful to its ally, the Zionist cancer.

If you dont watch the news, how is it on the previous sentance you say the media this, the media that ? How do you know what the media reports if you dont watch the news ?
Which ulama are you getting the news from that is framing your narrative of what the media is reporting ?
Just one will do.

[Andrew1978]

If you dont watch the news, how is it on the previous sentance you say the media this, the media that ? How do you know what the media reports if you dont watch the news ?

This is from reading on various blogs about the conflict as well as seeing whether some horrific actions have been reported on the web. For example, when the videos about Asaad's army burying Muslims or killing them for not bowing and prostrating to Asaad or not declaring him to be god were shown on Youtube, there was no mention of them on the websites of any major Western media source that I could think of. Any more suspicions you have of fellow Muslims? You're already suspicious of the Free Syrian Army.

يا أيها الذين آمنوا اجتنبوا كثيراً من الظن أن بعض الظن إثم

[numinertyuesk]

why dont the zionist and the US support the Free Palestine Army ? Surely they are MORE oppressed and for longer ? They are muslims too arent they ? Why dont Turkey and Saudi and Qatar supply the same support to the Palestinians ?

Exactly. A narrative formed by the media for you, lapped up by you, and propogated by you. Nobody said "muslim oppressor". Learn to read before you comment. The dichotomy is for "black and white" thinkers. As you have proven with your own words.

Al Assad never was a "muslim" ruler; for 40 years; but somehow since the narrative was framed, he needs to go ?

Assalamualaikum,

I have made a sentence bolded in your writing.

This is due to the fact, they do try to support. But Palestine is blocked by their neighbour isreal from all sides, wether from air, the sea and from the ground. What I want to state is that these countries do try help by sending supplies, what happens is that they are blocked from entering. Sometimes it works for them secretly.

Just thats all I want to write, nothing against or for, and no arguement.

Also lets keep the argument in the safe boundary, and avoid being harsh.

[Abaanto]

This is from reading on various blogs about the conflict as well as seeing whether some horrific actions have been reported on the web. For example, when the videos about Asaad's army burying Muslims or killing them for not bowing and prostrating to Asaad or not declaring him to be god were shown on Youtube, there was no mention of them on the websites of any major Western media source that I could think of.

The ulama of You Tube. Oh that ulama ? Yes youtube is an independant, non affiliated, completley unbias media source.
There are non-muslims who know more about the this that some "muslims"