[enurneAcourdy]

Salam

so a number of salafi organizations in germany have been the target of german police raids. their crime was not supporting terrorism but dawa, literally. they were handing out qurans (translations) to non-muslims

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/europe...850781568.html

[ValintinoV]

May Allah help them and accept their efforts and bestow them with sabr and Isteqaamat..Ameen

[XKAgustin]

Is proselytizing banned in Germany? What legals grounds did they have for the raids?

[Karensmith]

read the link brother dawud shared on the thread 'your opinions on this?'
gives more details as to what exactly the salafis were doing there.

[Overlord]

Is proselytizing banned in Germany? What legals grounds did they have for the raids?

Exactly what I wanted to know.

[JanetMorris]

Salam

so a number of salafi organizations in germany have been the target of german police raids. their crime was not supporting terrorism but dawa, literally. they were handing out qurans (translations) to non-muslims

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/europe...850781568.html

According to my understanding and discussions (2 weeks ago in Germany) this is not the full story and some Muslims are at fault.

Many muslims (Salafees, Masha'Allah) had this as a very good initiative but then there were other Salafees who crossed the line and for the first time there was a major confrontation between Police & Muslims in the history of Germany.

http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/a...ech-rally.html

Don't trust my version as I don't know German and can't research original sources... Just letting you know that Al-Jazeera isn't accurately reporting events.

[BadbarmrapBef]

This is what Lamadhabist dawah is about chaos!! The saudi influence dawah is always counterproductive and harms others. Lamadhabist stupids are nothing more the pawn in the scheme of anti muslim tactics. I would like to see similar steps being adopted in UK by targetting Darusalam Publicaiton and their likes. There is no place for them here!!

i can't stand it when some muslims stand united with kafirs to bring down a certain Muslim group...you really think the kafirs will stop at the salafis? they don't care about which group you belong to...they want to get rid of islamic teaching all together

[Assauraarguck]

This is what Lamadhabist dawah is about chaos!! The saudi influence dawah is always counterproductive and harms others. Lamadhabist stupids are nothing more the pawn in the scheme of anti muslim tactics. I would like to see similar steps being adopted in UK by targetting Darusalam Publicaiton and their likes. There is no place for them here!!

astagfirullah. may Allah guide us all!!!

[vigraxtru]

This is what Lamadhabist dawah is about chaos!! The saudi influence dawah is always counterproductive and harms others. Lamadhabist stupids are nothing more the pawn in the scheme of anti muslim tactics. I would like to see similar steps being adopted in UK by targetting Darusalam Publicaiton and their likes. There is no place for them here!!

hadhrat imam ghazali said there are muslims who do more harm to islam and muslims than even shaytaan

read july 7th london bombings ,by nafeez mosadeeq,about al muhajiroon,bakri,.. mohammed siddique khan etc..all salafis

[Assauraarguck]

hadhrat imam ghazali said there are muslims who do more harm to islam and muslims than even shaytaan

read july 7th london bombings ,by nafeez mosadeeq,about al muhajiroon,bakri,.. mohammed siddique khan etc..all salafis

thats not true. those people who you mentioned are heavily refuted by the salafi community.

wallahi some of you make me feel sad :-(

[BadbarmrapBef]

thats not true. those people who you mentioned are heavily refuted by the salafi community.

wallahi some of you make me feel sad :-(

what you see and feel on this forum is how sufis feel when they are all painted with one brush...salafis will point out the worst people who call themselves sufis like nazim haqqani..and certain barelwis and they insist this is sufism

on this forum its the opposite...they are bunching all salafis as one although there are different groups within salafis that all refute one another...just as there are in the sufis....but there are a lot of people here from indo/pak...who know salafis as the type of people who curse imam Abu Hanifah RH and call taqleed shirk etc

[Assauraarguck]

what you see and feel on this forum is how sufis feel when they are all painted with one brush...salafis will point out the worst people who call themselves sufis like nazim haqqani..and certain barelwis and they insist this is sufism

on this forum its the opposite...they are bunching all salafis as one although there are different groups within salafis that all refute one another...just as there are in the sufis....but there are a lot of people here from indo/pak...who know salafis as the type of people who curse imam Abu Hanifah RH and call taqleed shirk etc

sister I know this and I always make a distinction between deobandi tassawuf which is basically using dhickr to clean the soul (which I dont practice but dont really have a massive objection to and certainly shouldnt be a cuase for fitnah at a time when teh kuffar plot against us and we are facing catastrophic circumstances), and teh likes of haqqani and the barelwis. I am against any salafi doing this and will always correct them although the salafi community is maturing and becoming more tolerant from my experience alhamdulillah.

The issue is, even if you could include anjem choudrys ilk amongst the salafis, he only has about 100 followers, thats not even 0.1% of the salafis, and the other 99.9% reject him and hate him,. although i reject taht he is salafi in the first place.

I wish we were togetehr, facing the troubles this ummah is facing together as a community who at least value tawheed and the sunnah and the salaf dispite some differences, but that seems more and more impossible whenever I venture to this forum, you'd think salafis are responsible for global warming and eat babies for breakfast, it makes me sad to be honest

shaikh ibn uthaymeen recommends taqleed for the layman and praises imam abu hanifah as being from the salaf, as do the rest of the salafi ulama, so I cant be blamed for what some random in pakistan says as much as you cant be blamed for what some random piir in pakistan says

[wbeachcomber]

There are new salafi groups forming everyday around some cult personality. To excuse them based on "not all salafis....." is missing the point. Look what unites them you'll find reformism, rejection of authority, and ofcourse Ibn Taymiyya. They are recipe for new fools constantly emerging claiming to have found the real islam and wants to purify the 1.5 billion muslims into their fold and mentality. All salafis are different mutilations from the same source and in one-way or the oother they causing destruction of islam under protestant guise. And the Saudi salafis have various strands too fighting among each other always from liberal modernist to house of saud stooges to militant self bombers . Its not like House of Saud created some pure hanbali utopia as some internet salafis try to portray aand shift blame only with the indian ahle hadith.

[JanetMorris]

sister I know this and I always make a distinction between deobandi tassawuf which is basically using dhickr to clean the soul (which I dont practice but dont really have a massive objection to and certainly shouldnt be a cuase for fitnah at a time when teh kuffar plot against us and we are facing catastrophic circumstances), and teh likes of haqqani and the barelwis. I am against any salafi doing this and will always correct them although the salafi community is maturing and becoming more tolerant from my experience alhamdulillah.

The issue is, even if you could include anjem choudrys ilk amongst the salafis, he only has about 100 followers, thats not even 0.1% of the salafis, and the other 99.9% reject him and hate him,. although i reject taht he is salafi in the first place.

I wish we were togetehr, facing the troubles this ummah is facing together as a community who at least value tawheed and the sunnah and the salaf dispite some differences, but that seems more and more impossible whenever I venture to this forum, you'd think salafis are responsible for global warming and eat babies for breakfast, it makes me sad to be honest

shaikh ibn uthaymeen recommends taqleed for the layman and praises imam abu hanifah as being from the salaf, as do the rest of the salafi ulama, so I cant be blamed for what some random in pakistan says as much as you cant be blamed for what some random piir in pakistan says

Juhayman al-Otaybi


Was:

1. Rising star of Salafiyyah
2. Endorsed and known by top Ulamah including Shaykh Ibn Baz (RA)
3. His Dawah also started with trying to reform people's Aqeedah and practises.

[Karensmith]

There are new salafi groups forming everyday around some cult personality. To excuse them based on "not all salafis....." is missing the point. Look what unites them you'll find reformism, rejection of authority, and ofcourse Ibn Taymiyya. They are recipe for new fools constantly emerging claiming to have found the real islam and wants to purify the 1.5 billion muslims into their fold and mentality. All salafis are different mutilations from the same source and in one-way or the oother they causing destruction of islam under protestant guise. And the Saudi salafis have various strands too fighting among each other always from liberal modernist to house of saud stooges to militant self bombers . Its not like House of Saud created some pure hanbali utopia as some internet salafis try to portray aand shift blame only with the indian ahle hadith.

[GreesyBeeva]

Asalaam

To anyone critisising these brothers:

''The Salafists have raised concern with their drive to convert non-Muslims, a campaign that has involved handing out 25 million copies of the Quran in Germany, Austria and Switzerland''.

when we ourselves are siding against these brothers it shows where our loyalties stand.

Wasalaam

[JanetMorris]

Asalaam

To anyone critisising these brothers:

''The Salafists have raised concern with their drive to convert non-Muslims, a campaign that has involved handing out 25 million copies of the Quran in Germany, Austria and Switzerland''.

when we ourselves are siding against these brothers it shows where our loyalties stand.

Wasalaam

For the record. I have nothing but good wishes and duas for the Salafi Brothers in Germany who were part of the Qur'aan dawah program.

I would respect and support my Brothers (despite disagreement) and to even think about siding with Non-Muslims against Muslims is just absurd!

[Assauraarguck]

Juhayman al-Otaybi


Was:

1. Rising star of Salafiyyah
2. Endorsed and known by top Ulamah including Shaykh Ibn Baz (RA)
3. His Dawah also started with trying to reform people's Aqeedah and practises.

akhi you dont get it do you. There are thousands of examples of people from salafis, deobandis, barelwis, shia, even people who were present in the time of the prophet SAW who apostated, like on the night journey, people shouldnt be using this as an evidence, it doenst prove anything. I can pull out countless examples of things ebing done by deobandis but what does this prove and what benefit does it bring when I should be seeking to unite with my deobandi brothers as one body to repel the assault on islam and further our ummah in the current geopolitical situations. I should be seeking to create unity and understanding between both salafis and deobandis, wallahi last night i correct 3 salafi brothers that deobandis dont believe in wahdatul wujood and that they hold a position on aqeedah that is the same as ibn hajr and imam nawawi, why? because i want to see MORE cooperation, MORE goodwill, when i see brothers rejoicing at the site of brothers who are striviing in dawah, because the kuffar decided to end the efforts of dawah, and supposedly this proves that the salafis are in chaos, there is something serioulsy wrong and people cant see past the bias in their hearts, talk about tazkiyatun nafs, there are definitely somethings brothers need to remove from their hearts from this forum, and it is bringing death and destruction to the ummmah. I cant believe that some brothers feel taht salafis are the biggets threat to islam right now, that absolutely astounds me. I accept that some salafis are in need of correction, but how can I invite them to a united salafi deobandi front when all i can show them is a forum where salafis are regularly blasted, linked with riddaa, and labelled as worser enemies than barelwis, qadiyanis, shia and kuffar?

I ask Allah to show us all the right approach in dealing with our brothers and sisters in islam

[JanetMorris]

akhi you dont get it do you. There are thousands of examples of people from salafis, deobandis, barelwis, shia, even people who were present in the time of the prophet SAW who apostated, like on the night journey, people shouldnt be using this as an evidence, it doenst prove anything. I can pull out countless examples of things ebing done by deobandis but what does this prove and what benefit does it bring when I should be seeking to unite with my deobandi brothers as one body to repel the assault on islam and further our ummah in the current geopolitical situations. I should be seeking to create unity and understanding between both salafis and deobandis, wallahi last night i correct 3 salafi brothers that deobandis dont believe in wahdatul wujood and that they hold a position on aqeedah that is the same as ibn hajr and imam nawawi, why? because i want to see MORE cooperation, MORE goodwill, when i see brothers rejoicing at the site of brothers who are striviing in dawah, because the kuffar decided to end the efforts of dawah, and supposedly this proves that the salafis are in chaos, there is something serioulsy wrong and people cant see past the bias in their hearts, talk about tazkiyatun nafs, there are definitely somethings brothers need to remove from their hearts from this forum, and it is bringing death and destruction to the ummmah. I cant believe that some brothers feel taht salafis are the biggets threat to islam right now, that absolutely astounds me. I accept that some salafis are in need of correction, but how can I invite them to a united salafi deobandi front when all i can show them is a forum where salafis are regularly blasted, linked with riddaa, and labelled as worser enemies than barelwis, qadiyanis, shia and kuffar?

I ask Allah to show us all the right approach in dealing with our brothers and sisters in islam

I get it very well, my Brother.

The point that you are forgetting that if this “Salafi Dawah” towards Tawheed was the be all and end all then in the heartland where this Dawah originated from i.e. Saudia, the situation would have vastly improved. The socio/political problems within Saudia clearly indicate that this pumping billions of Petro-Dollars into Dawah towards a cult (i.e. Salafiyya) hasn't worked, instead this money should have been better spent in Dawah towards "Islam".

Billions spent and it has created a lot of strife, agitation, backlash (some may even say blowback) amongst Muslims.

I will give you some personal examples (I have lived, worked and studied in Saudia). I went to Umrah and people feed seeds to the birds in Jannatul-Baqi and consider the issue as meritorious

As I was walking out there was a bag full of seeds and I picked it up (as it was in the way) to put it in the bin. A Saudi-Government appointed Mutawwa came to me and said, “Masha’Allah you are in the Sunnah, you have a Beard you should NOT involve in Bid’ah” and kept speaking to me for a while on the merits of Tawheed and adopting the Sunnah.

I asked him, “Are you done?”

He looked surprised and said, “Yes”

I said, “I picked it up because it in the path and I am going to put it in the bin so nobody trips over it. Your overzealous Dawah assumed the WORST in me and NEVER gave me a chance to even say anything”.

While in Saudia we would be out and about with work colleagues eating and the religious authorities would come (barge in) and INSIST ON GIVING Dawah booklets to these “mostly uninterested Non-Muslims” in the middle of their meal who witness the worst of Saudi society on a daily basis.

I don't have a problem with my Salafi Brothers & Sisters but I don't think they realise the impact (and hostility generated) by their "Salafi Dawah" towards other Muslims and their condescending attitude going from Masjid to Masjid and assuming that everyone is:

a) Deviant
b) Idiot
c) Ignoramus
d) lax towards their religion and faulty in their understanding of religion (including Scholars)

Salafi Dawah is towards existing Muslims!

[CoallyPax]

I get it very well, my Brother.

The point that you are forgetting that if this “Salafi Dawah” towards Tawheed was the be all and end all then in the heartland where this Dawah originated from i.e. Saudia, the situation would have vastly improved. The socio/political problems within Saudia clearly indicate that this pumping billions of Petro-Dollars into Dawah towards a cult (i.e. Salafiyya) hasn't worked, instead this money should have been better spent in Dawah towards "Islam".

Billions spent and it has created a lot of strife, agitation, backlash (some may even say blowback) amongst Muslims.

I will give you some personal examples (I have lived, worked and studied in Saudia). I went to Umrah and people feed seeds to the birds in Jannatul-Baqi and consider the issue as meritorious

As I was walking out there was a bag full of seeds and I picked it up (as it was in the way) to put it in the bin. A Saudi-Government appointed Mutawwa came to me and said, “Masha’Allah you are in the Sunnah, you have a Beard you should NOT involve in Bid’ah” and kept speaking to me for a while on the merits of Tawheed and adopting the Sunnah.

I asked him, “Are you done?”

He looked surprised and said, “Yes”

I said, “I picked it up because it in the path and I am going to put it in the bin so nobody trips over it. Your overzealous Dawah assumed the WORST in me and NEVER gave me a chance to even say anything”.

While in Saudia we would be out and about with work colleagues eating and the religious authorities would come (barge in) and INSIST ON GIVING Dawah booklets to these “mostly uninterested Non-Muslims” in the middle of their meal who witness the worst of Saudi society on a daily basis.

I don't have a problem with my Salafi Brothers & Sisters but I don't think they realise the impact (and hostility generated) by their "Salafi Dawah" towards other Muslims and their condescending attitude going from Masjid to Masjid and assuming that everyone is:

a) Deviant
b) Idiot
c) Ignoramus
d) lax towards their religion and faulty in their understanding of religion (including Scholars)

Salafi Dawah is towards existing Muslims!

No to sidetrack the issue, but the above can also be applied to the tableeghis e.g the behaviour of the guard in his 'sermonising' and particularly about dawah to existing Muslims.