[Seisyvose]

if a person decides to take up a darse e nizami course instead of university what job can one get and how is the scholar expected to earn money?

jazakallah

[AncewwewBus]

1) do uni afterwards and get a job
2) start up your own business or make good investments. Use the income from there to live, and teach for free! - imam abu hanifa was an international trader
3) become an imam
4)

if a person decides to take up a darse e nizami course instead of university what job can one get and how is the scholar expected to earn money?

jazakallah

[Seisyvose]

1) do uni afterwards and get a job
2) start up your own business or make good investments. Use the income from there to live, and teach for free! - imam abu hanifa was an international trader
3) become an imam
4)

thank you but would i be allowed to go to uni with a loan that charges interest?

[BenWired306]

Asslamu alaikum Davidovitch, StrengtheningMyDeen, and others,

This is a very interesting question. You appear to ask how one becomes a professional teacher of Islam? What is an "alim" but a professional teacher? And a professional teacher, especially in our times, is also a professional learner.

Traditionally, one became a scholar through study and then recognition by other scholars. It meant that you participated in a learning community and your place would be granted in recognition of your contribution to that community. You contribute by adding something that is of unique value to that community of students - the scholars. It was not so much a job as a way of life. You are what we call today, a life long learner.

If you are a doctor or an engineer or some other profession, then you undergo a period of rather intensive training and then you go and get a job, supposedly using what you learned. Your training is pretty much over when you enter the profession. Teaching is not like that.

To my mind, the best intention one could have is to contribute something to a community. You do not need to be a card-carrying "imam" to do that, and you may not want to be. It is your contribution that matters, not your badge or your hat.

Getting a job is excellent advice. Make it something you love. Then keep studying whatever attracts you and contribute something, no matter how small.

Salaam,

Abu Marwan

[Seisyvose]

Asslamu alaikum Davidovitch, StrengtheningMyDeen, and others,

This is a very interesting question. You appear to ask how one becomes a professional teacher of Islam? What is an "alim" but a professional teacher? And a professional teacher, especially in our times, is also a professional learner.

Traditionally, one became a scholar through study and then recognition by other scholars. It meant that you participated in a learning community and your place would be granted in recognition of your contribution to that community. You contribute by adding something that is of unique value to that community of students - the scholars. It was not so much a job as a way of life. You are what we call today, a life long learner.

If you are a doctor or an engineer or some other profession, then you undergo a period of rather intensive training and then you go and get a job, supposedly using what you learned. Your training is pretty much over when you enter the profession. Teaching is not like that.

To my mind, the best intention one could have is to contribute something to a community. You do not need to be a card-carrying "imam" to do that, and you may not want to be. It is your contribution that matters, not your badge or your hat.

Getting a job is excellent advice. Make it something you love. Then keep studying whatever attracts you and contribute something, no matter how small.

Salaam,

Abu Marwan

waalaikumusalam brother

i understand what you are saying but how would one earn by contributing to the community i know no one cant label themselves an imam because our life is not long enough to know everything about islam, i understand that money must not be the intention for the alim but the alim also has to feed his family and eran money so how would he be able to do that?

what i mean by alim is someone who has completed the darse e nizami course(full) and has ijazah in the sacred sciences and who is english speaking meaning someone young and who is born in the uk.

jazakallah

[Seisyvose]

Unless you are la madhabi, you are unlikly to be appointed as an imam unless you are affiated with the TJ. As an English speaking qualified scholar you can't stoop low to the level of la madhabi imam where they go behind others back and say all sorts to get position. I have seen this personally.
In the age of Ruyibida, you will do a favour upon us by being a scholar and being away from the hijb of masjed mutuwallis. I know of qualified scholars who simply do things as a favour and out of obligation but little thanks they get.
So most qualified farigs generally save up money and teach privately and then venture out in different career after getting a different secular qualification.

thank you brother many people have said that get a secular qualification afterwards, now this is where i get confused because after darse e nizami approx 7-8 years one may not have the time to take up a a secular course after this amount of time of study, and even if one does try to take a secular course how would one pay for it when student loans charge interest.

seriously i do think this is the reason why many young brothers and sisters dont take up religious education, even though its not about the money you have to be realistic that is what they say.

by the way what is la madhabi?

jazakallah

[Seisyvose]

Salafist

ok thankyou brother

[BenWired306]

Assalamu alaikum StrengtheningMyDeen,

To set out to earn your living through service to the community is a very high goal and one that more young Muslims ought to consider seriously. It is also very laudable to aspire to become a leader. To assume leadership is a huge responsibility and it requires long [preparation and apprenticeship. I understand what you mean by studying dars-e-nizami somewhere and getting qualified. There are many routes to this.

I think that one example of a person who has followed a reasonable path to leadership is Hamza Yusuf. You can look at his career and see one way to make a contribution into a way of life. Yusuf Islam is another. Although he started with considerable personal resources, he did earn his leadership position through hard work and service - he did not buy it. Barak Obama also, though not a Muslim, worked his way into leadership through community service - this is unusual for American politicians but not completely unheard of. People recognize service and reward it.

And just as it is not possible to buy your way into leadership, it is not possible to demand it simply because you have completed a course of study or earned an ijazah. These are very useful experiences, but most of what you learn as a student is how to learn. After that, it is really your responsibility to continue to learn and to teach others.

You are right. You need to earn to feed your family, so while you are becoming a leader you will need to work doing something that leaves you the time you need to build your career. You could consider types of jobs that can help you acquire the skills you need to lead and there are many of these: counseling and social work, teaching, consultancy on just about anything - tax, insurance, financial planning, life coaching, health and safety... aim for this type of jobs and learn real skills that you can immediately transfer to your activities in the Muslim community.

Become known by becoming active. Participate in local politics, run for elective office, become a local counselor, ombudsman .... keep a blog, write to your local paper, write for your local paper.

There are so many possibilities and if your intention is sincere, then Allah will make a path for you.

Salaam,

Abu Marwan

[Crazykz]

salam brother,

are you planning to do alim course after your GCSEs (i'm assuming ur still in school), if yes then you would be 23 by the time you finish, apply to uni and do a 3 years degree and also teach in the evening at a local maktab or do private tutions or even you can set up an evening madrassa at your house while you're doing degree.

[Seisyvose]

salam brother,

are you planning to do alim course after your GCSEs (i'm assuming ur still in school), if yes then you would be 23 by the time you finish, apply to uni and do a 3 years degree and also teach in the evening at a local maktab or do private tutions or even you can set up an evening madrassa at your house while you're doing degree.

no brother i am not i finished college and am in the middle of a gap year.

[Crazykz]

that means u're about 18/19, u'll be 25/26 by the time you finish alim course, do 3/4 years degree after that and hopefully u'll have it finished by u're about 30. inshallah, the fee/loan situation will be sorted out by then

[CialisBestPrice]

no brother i am not i finished college and am in the middle of a gap year.

finish college first then do an alim course...

or just do a part time alim course along with college and uni.

[Seisyvose]

that means u're about 18/19, u'll be 25/26 by the time you finish alim course, do 3/4 years degree after that and hopefully u'll have it finished by u're about 30. inshallah, the fee/loan situation will be sorted out by then

if it is sorted out which i think is unlikely in this country because it lives and survives on interest then it is ok. but i need o earn money my parents are getting old and i have a large family younger than me so after darse e nizami i know i wouldnt get a suitable job although it is not about the money.

[VioletttaJosetta]

if it is sorted out which i think is unlikely in this country because it lives and survives on interest then it is ok. but i need o earn money my parents are getting old and i have a large family younger than me so after darse e nizami i know i wouldnt get a suitable job although it is not about the money.

Is Islam forcing you to become an Alim ? As far as I know , when an Islamic community has no Hafiz , no Alim in their midst, then it becomes Fard-e-Kifaya ( mandatory ) to produce sufficient number of Alim and Hafiz. Still , not Fard-e-ayn .

If your family condition and other economic factors are not favorable to your dream of become an Alim , then do what Islam has made mandatory for you. That is ,

1. get some skills to earn enough halal income for you and your family
2. looking after the parents

After finishing the fard-e-ayn responsibilities , you may think about doing what is not mandatory , but important for the Islamic society.
So, know your priority first.

[NutChusty]

Brother i think u should take a job or start some bussiness as earn in a halal way as such businessmen have promised to be with the prophets,matyrs n the pious.

As far as ur thirst for knowledge, u can go to the scholars to quench ur thirst but beware of the barelvi scholars, they just freak ur mind out..They concentrate more on Ladoo rather than deen..

[BenWired306]

Teaching is a calling, a vocation, but it depends on first becoming an expert learner, and it is that drive to learn and to discover that defines a real teacher. Some people are simply driven to it by their innate curiosity, by their piety, or by their quest for service.

Others are attracted to it because it is a position of authority and power over others. They seek social status and prestige. They want people to look up to them, to admire them, and to be grateful to them. These are not called.

I think this is an important question: how does one support onself and become an "alim"? The question is focused on the end point and not on the journey. But there is no real end point, so it must be a question about a path.

Earning a living and being a student of Islam are not mutually exclusive. One goal can support the other.

Salaam,

Abu Marwan

[Paul Bunyan]

aoa,
is dars e nizami equivalent to a BA degree?
i heard sheikh abu hajira say on his blog that the qualification offered by his madrassah in SA is indeed equivalent to a BA. but i do not know if he was talking about dars e nizami specifically