Justice Taqi Usmani on freedom of thought. - DiscussWorldIssues - Socio-Economic Religion and Political Uncensored Debate

**MineOffedOvex** · 02-02-2012, 10:30 PM

..

**hhynmtrxcp** · 02-02-2012, 10:43 PM

aoa,

is that the end of the dialogue?or is there more?
very interesting!

**pobrierce** · 02-03-2012, 12:44 AM

Freedom of thought... My Foot...! That term is synonymous with shayaateen in todays context.

I like the way Mufti saheb approached the issue. The problem most of the people have a hidden inferiority complex that they accept western standards and their frame of references wholeheartedly. But when someone changes the perspective, its not accepted. It also occurs subconsciously because we are constantly being bombarded with information from biased media. During my jahaliyath I even used to think against the taliban. Only when i started spending time in sunniforum my 'frame of reference' changed. It was like I was sleep walking and someone smacked me on the head and woke me up.

**gSjQEEmq** · 02-03-2012, 01:04 AM

Assalamu alaykum

Discussion between research scholar of Amnesty International and Justice Taqi Usmani DB

Mufti sahib asked “The freedom of thought is indeed very good. But, is it without any restrictions to keep it within some limits”?

The research scholar replied that “he failed to understand my intention".

Mufti sahib explained to him his intention by saying:
“Is the conception of freedom of thought so absolute that man should express himself before others and preach to others and exhort them to follow whatever occurs to him? For example, I feel inclined to think that the capitalists have amassed great wealth, so poor classes should have the freedom to commit dacoity and rob the capitalists of their wealth and there should be none to stop them from this? I should also propagate this thought of mine among the common people, because the capitalists have amassed this wealth by sucking the blood of the poorer classes. Now tell me if you would support this type of freedom of thought”

In reply he told that “he would not support such unbridled freedom of thought”.

Mufti sahib told him that when the conception of freedom of thought is not absolute, then should you not like that some restrictions should be placed on it”?

He replied in the affirmative, adding by way of an example, that the freedom of thought should not allow the commission of violence and tyranny to others.

Mufti sahib said: this is your view. Others should also have freedom to personal views about the imposition of restriction on the freedom of thought according to their views.

There is no reason why only your views about the restrictions on the freedom of thought should be accepted and those of others rejected. The whole issue boils to this question: What should be these restrictions and who should finally approve or disapprove them? Mufti sahib requested him " let me know some universally acceptable standard or yardstick for the adoption of the desirable restriction".

His answer to this question was: "We have never given serious thought to this issue".

Mufti sahib said: "It is pity that you belong to such a renowned International Organization and have come out to carry out a survey on the topic of freedom of thought, but you have not decided as to what should be the limits, scope and jurisdiction of this so called freedom".

Jazak Allah khair very nice post.

**MineOffedOvex** · 02-03-2012, 11:09 AM

aoa,

is that the end of the dialogue?or is there more?
very interesting!

Assalamu alaykum

Mufti sahib said

The gentleman promised to convey to his organisation my views and furnish to me the relevant literature on the subject. He then took leave of me and thanked me coolly.

I have been waiting for his literature or replies to my question on this day.

I feel quite sure that he can furnish to me either replies to my questions nor any universally acceptable literature on this topic till the day of judgement. This is because every person will fix a standard of his own choice. There is no one in this world who can propose a standard which is universally applicable. I can assert this without fear of any repudiation that there is no standard or criterion other than the criterion of the divine revelations which alone can impose necessary and eternal limits on these ambiuous thoughts and conceptions. Man has no guidance other than the divine guidance.

**hhynmtrxcp** · 03-27-2012, 12:51 AM

here is another attempt to tackle the subject.
what do you think SFers?
an interesting comment on the article (the first one) needs a good answer

**hhynmtrxcp** · 04-10-2012, 02:17 AM

had the researcher returned with a document he probably would have brought this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Univers...f_Human_Rights

anyone to take the challenge of pointing out the incorrectness of this using Islam?

**hhynmtrxcp** · 04-10-2012, 02:18 AM

Assalamu alaykum

Mufti sahib said

The gentleman promised to convey to his organisation my views and furnish to me the relevant literature on the subject. He then took leave of me and thanked me coolly.

I have been waiting for his literature or replies to my question on this day.

I feel quite sure that he can furnish to me either replies to my questions nor any universally acceptable literature on this topic till the day of judgement. This is because every person will fix a standard of his own choice. There is no one in this world who can propose a standard which is universally applicable. I can assert this without fear of any repudiation that there is no standard or criterion other than the criterion of the divine revelations which alone can impose necessary and eternal limits on these ambiuous thoughts and conceptions. Man has no guidance other than the divine guidance.

brilliant words

**20170425yuanyuan** · 09-25-2018, 09:24 AM

**20170425yuanyuan** · 09-25-2018, 09:25 AM

**zzyytt** · 10-08-2018, 06:27 AM

02-02-2012, 10:30 PM	#1
MineOffedOvex Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 446 Senior Member	Justice Taqi Usmani on freedom of thought. .. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

02-02-2012, 10:43 PM	#2
hhynmtrxcp Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 444 Senior Member	aoa, is that the end of the dialogue?or is there more? very interesting! Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

02-03-2012, 12:44 AM	#3
pobrierce Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 572 Senior Member	Freedom of thought... My Foot...! That term is synonymous with shayaateen in todays context. I like the way Mufti saheb approached the issue. The problem most of the people have a hidden inferiority complex that they accept western standards and their frame of references wholeheartedly. But when someone changes the perspective, its not accepted. It also occurs subconsciously because we are constantly being bombarded with information from biased media. During my jahaliyath I even used to think against the taliban. Only when i started spending time in sunniforum my 'frame of reference' changed. It was like I was sleep walking and someone smacked me on the head and woke me up. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

02-03-2012, 01:04 AM	#4
gSjQEEmq Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 451 Senior Member	Assalamu alaykum Discussion between research scholar of Amnesty International and Justice Taqi Usmani DB Mufti sahib asked “The freedom of thought is indeed very good. But, is it without any restrictions to keep it within some limits”? The research scholar replied that “he failed to understand my intention". Mufti sahib explained to him his intention by saying: “Is the conception of freedom of thought so absolute that man should express himself before others and preach to others and exhort them to follow whatever occurs to him? For example, I feel inclined to think that the capitalists have amassed great wealth, so poor classes should have the freedom to commit dacoity and rob the capitalists of their wealth and there should be none to stop them from this? I should also propagate this thought of mine among the common people, because the capitalists have amassed this wealth by sucking the blood of the poorer classes. Now tell me if you would support this type of freedom of thought” In reply he told that “he would not support such unbridled freedom of thought”. Mufti sahib told him that when the conception of freedom of thought is not absolute, then should you not like that some restrictions should be placed on it”? He replied in the affirmative, adding by way of an example, that the freedom of thought should not allow the commission of violence and tyranny to others. Mufti sahib said: this is your view. Others should also have freedom to personal views about the imposition of restriction on the freedom of thought according to their views. There is no reason why only your views about the restrictions on the freedom of thought should be accepted and those of others rejected. The whole issue boils to this question: What should be these restrictions and who should finally approve or disapprove them? Mufti sahib requested him " let me know some universally acceptable standard or yardstick for the adoption of the desirable restriction". His answer to this question was: "We have never given serious thought to this issue". Mufti sahib said: "It is pity that you belong to such a renowned International Organization and have come out to carry out a survey on the topic of freedom of thought, but you have not decided as to what should be the limits, scope and jurisdiction of this so called freedom". Jazak Allah khair very nice post. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

02-03-2012, 11:09 AM	#5
MineOffedOvex Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 446 Senior Member	aoa, is that the end of the dialogue?or is there more? very interesting! Assalamu alaykum Mufti sahib said The gentleman promised to convey to his organisation my views and furnish to me the relevant literature on the subject. He then took leave of me and thanked me coolly. I have been waiting for his literature or replies to my question on this day. I feel quite sure that he can furnish to me either replies to my questions nor any universally acceptable literature on this topic till the day of judgement. This is because every person will fix a standard of his own choice. There is no one in this world who can propose a standard which is universally applicable. I can assert this without fear of any repudiation that there is no standard or criterion other than the criterion of the divine revelations which alone can impose necessary and eternal limits on these ambiuous thoughts and conceptions. Man has no guidance other than the divine guidance. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

03-27-2012, 12:51 AM	#6
hhynmtrxcp Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 444 Senior Member	here is another attempt to tackle the subject. what do you think SFers? an interesting comment on the article (the first one) needs a good answer Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

04-10-2012, 02:17 AM	#7
hhynmtrxcp Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 444 Senior Member	had the researcher returned with a document he probably would have brought this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Univers...f_Human_Rights anyone to take the challenge of pointing out the incorrectness of this using Islam? Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

04-10-2012, 02:18 AM	#8
hhynmtrxcp Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 444 Senior Member	Assalamu alaykum Mufti sahib said The gentleman promised to convey to his organisation my views and furnish to me the relevant literature on the subject. He then took leave of me and thanked me coolly. I have been waiting for his literature or replies to my question on this day. I feel quite sure that he can furnish to me either replies to my questions nor any universally acceptable literature on this topic till the day of judgement. This is because every person will fix a standard of his own choice. There is no one in this world who can propose a standard which is universally applicable. I can assert this without fear of any repudiation that there is no standard or criterion other than the criterion of the divine revelations which alone can impose necessary and eternal limits on these ambiuous thoughts and conceptions. Man has no guidance other than the divine guidance. brilliant words Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

09-25-2018, 09:24 AM	#9
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09-25-2018, 09:25 AM	#10
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10-08-2018, 06:27 AM	#11
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