[CindyLavender]

Earlier my grandmother was reading me some sections from Muhammad al-Tijani's book 'Shi'ah Hum Ahl Al-Sunnah'. It wrote that Abu Bakr (ra) & Umar bin Khattab (ra) burned ahadith, which were supposedly about Ahle Bayt & a threat to their position. She went on to tell me Ali (ra) was pushed aside and mocked during the caliphate of the 3 earlier caliphs. I don't like to argue with her, so most of the time I listened. She brought up a point about why is it that we never hear of ahadith narrated by Ali (ra) & the rest of the family members. Actually I'm curious about that point. Why is that so? The book also spoke about how the sahabas 'teamed up' against the Ahle Bayt and appointed Mu'awiya (ra) in Sham & kept him around despite the fact that they were aware of the tension between Ali (ra) and Muawiya (ra). Although I tried to tell her that the sahaba (and especially Abu Bakr, Umar & Uthman (ra) had a special place next to Prophet Muhammad (saw) and our sources differ from Shi'a sources, she still gave me the hint that afterall, they were all the same & Ahle Bayt were haq (again, as if we deny the high rank of Ahle Bayt but anyway.) I searched a little on the case of Abu Bakr (ra) & Umar (ra) burning ahadith, but I didn't want to confuse myself too much with different links, so I would much appreciate it if you can shed light on this claim & what the true story is.

JazakumAllah khayr, thanks in advance.

[BILBONDER]

Earlier my grandmother was reading me some sections from Muhammad al-Tijani's book 'Shi'ah Hum Ahl Al-Sunnah'. It wrote that Abu Bakr (ra) & Umar bin Khattab (ra) burned ahadith, which were supposedly about Ahle Bayt & a threat to their position. She went on to tell me Ali (ra) was pushed aside and mocked during the caliphate of the 3 earlier caliphs. I don't like to argue with her, so most of the time I listened. She brought up a point about why is it that we never hear of ahadith narrated by Ali (ra) & the rest of the family members. Actually I'm curious about that point. Why is that so? The book also spoke about how the sahabas 'teamed up' against the Ahle Bayt and appointed Mu'awiya (ra) in Sham & kept him around despite the fact that they were aware of the tension between Ali (ra) and Muawiya (ra). Although I tried to tell her that the sahaba (and especially Abu Bakr, Umar & Uthman (ra) had a special place next to Prophet Muhammad (saw) and our sources differ from Shi'a sources, she still gave me the hint that afterall, they were all the same & Ahle Bayt were haq (again, as if we deny the high rank of Ahle Bayt but anyway.) I searched a little on the case of Abu Bakr (ra) & Umar (ra) burning ahadith, but I didn't want to confuse myself too much with different links, so I would much appreciate it if you can shed light on this claim & what the true story is.

JazakumAllah khayr, thanks in advance.

'Ali ibn abi Talib (ra) narrated around 590 Ahadiths (That's a HUGE amount he's one of the top ten narrators).

'Umar ibn al-Khattab (ra) narrated 527 Ahadiths.

'Uthman ibn 'Affan (ra) narrated 147 Ahadiths.

Abu Bakr (ra) narrated 142 Ahadiths.

As for al-Tijani (guy who wrote that book) he's an ignorant clown who's a big liar, thats him actually making a fool of himself and losing in debate against our scholars:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6F8dEzMq30

and here he is making a fool of himself and saying that Ataturk (Seculr Kaffir turkish leader) will be on the same level of 'Ali (ra) on the day of judgement:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9C2pX...eature=related

As for burning the Ahadith in praise of 'Ali (ra), well The companions barley wrote the Quran back then I didn't know there were books of Hadith they could burn? hehe

Maybe this is why 'Ali (ra) has loads of virtues in our books, we have entire chapters about his virtues, now let me show you how he was treated in the days of 'Umar (ra) for example:

'Ali ibn abi Talib (ra) narrates: al-'Abbas, Fatima, Zaid and myself have all gathered in the prophet's SAWS house, al-'Abbas asked the Prophet SAWS: "O Prophet of Allah, I have become a man of old age and my bones and health have become weak, so if you can provide me with such and such and some food then do so." He SAWS said: "I will." then Fatima may Allah be pleased with her said: "O Prophet of Allah, you know of my relation to you, so if you see that you can provide me with the same things you provided your uncle then do so." and he did what she said, then Zaid ibn Harithah asked: "O Prophet of Allah, in the past you had given me a piece of land where I could live and then you took it away from me, so if you see that you can return it then do so." and he did, I ('Ali) said: "Me O prophet of Allah, if you see fit to make me in charge of our right from the Khums which is in the book of Allah so that I may divide it in your life and no one would dispute it with me after you." so he did, Then he SAWS turned towards al-'Abbas and said: "O abu al-Fadl, will you not ask of me the same thing as your nephew?" and he replied: "No O prophet of Allah, my need is only what I have asked." So the Prophet SAWS made me in charge of it and I divided it during his life and then Abu Bakr may Allah be pleased with him made me in charge of it during his days and I divided it during his life and after him 'Umar may Allah be pleased with him made me in charge of it and I divided it, then in the last year of his rule he obtained a great amount of wealth and he saved us our share and sent after me and told me: "This is your money so take it and divide it the way you used to." so I ('Ali) replied to him and said: "O chief of believers! we do not need such an amount this year and the Muslims are in need of this money so offer it to them for this year."


sources: Musnad Ahmad, Musannaf ibn abi Shaybah, Sunan al-Beihaqi.

Grading: SAHIH.

[drexigordiche]

JazakAllah Khair brother TripolySunni.

I would like to add one beautiful narration:

Imam Jafar Sadiq, from his Father, Muhammad bin Ali al-Baqir, from Abdullah ibn Ja'afar bin Abi Talib that he said: "Abu Bakr al Siddeeq may Allah be pleased with him, became our Caliph and he was the best of the Caliphs of Allah, he was most merciful and most caring towards us."

Hadith grading: Sahih

Earlier my grandmother was reading me some sections from Muhammad al-Tijani's book 'Shi'ah Hum Ahl Al-Sunnah'. It wrote that Abu Bakr (ra) & Umar bin Khattab (ra) burned ahadith, which were supposedly about Ahle Bayt & a threat to their position. She went on to tell me Ali (ra) was pushed aside and mocked during the caliphate of the 3 earlier caliphs. I don't like to argue with her, so most of the time I listened. She brought up a point about why is it that we never hear of ahadith narrated by Ali (ra) & the rest of the family members. Actually I'm curious about that point. Why is that so? The book also spoke about how the sahabas 'teamed up' against the Ahle Bayt and appointed Mu'awiya (ra) in Sham & kept him around despite the fact that they were aware of the tension between Ali (ra) and Muawiya (ra). Although I tried to tell her that the sahaba (and especially Abu Bakr, Umar & Uthman (ra) had a special place next to Prophet Muhammad (saw) and our sources differ from Shi'a sources, she still gave me the hint that afterall, they were all the same & Ahle Bayt were haq (again, as if we deny the high rank of Ahle Bayt but anyway.) I searched a little on the case of Abu Bakr (ra) & Umar (ra) burning ahadith, but I didn't want to confuse myself too much with different links, so I would much appreciate it if you can shed light on this claim & what the true story is.

JazakumAllah khayr, thanks in advance.

WalAlaikum Salam,

Why is your grandmother reading the book of a Liar and ignorant person?

[pharmablogger]

WalAlaikum Salam,

Why is your grandmother reading the book of a Liar and ignorant person? The OP sister comes from a mixed Sunni-Shia Iraqi background.

Concerning the issue of the Ahadith, this shows how near-sigthted the Twelvers are with respect to matters. Even if we concede that there are not many Ahadith from 'Ali (Radhia Allahu Anhu) in our books [an obvious lie], anyone wading into matters of Qur'anic recitations, or Fiqh, or Tassawuf, will know the preeminent position of 'Ali (Radhia Allahu Anhu) in these fields, and that there was never a pushing aside of any Muslim on any matter of Islam, as divulging Islamic knowledge that one has and is sure about is obligatory (unlike in Twelver Shiaism where it may be hidden), as is the responsibility of the one who hears it to accept it as such (again unlike Twelver Shiaism, where the narratives of the Companions as a whole are rejected, leaving us basically with no eyewitness accounts about anything coming from the Prophet (S.A.W.)).

Of course, the Twelvers, in their bigotry, will simply tell us that since we have accepted this now we should accept all the Imams as per their categorization. But from this we only see a desperate attempt at taunting us, in such a way that they insult us when they feel that we do not follow 'Ali (R.A.A.), as well as insulting us when they feel that we do follow 'Ali (R.A.A.).

[pooncophy]

There are a few hadeeth in the Sunni books which allude that Abu Bakr has burned hadeeth OR that he prevented hadeeth from being written, but they are all da`eef (weak) per Sunni `ilm al-hadeeth.

عن عائشة أنَّها قالت: «جَمَع أبي الحديث عن رسول الله (ص) وكانت خمسمائة حديث، فبات ليلته يتقلّب كثيراً. قالت: فغمّني، فقلت: أتتقلّب لشكوى أو لشيء بَلَغك؟ فلمّا أصبح قال: أي بُنيّة، هَلُمِّي الاَحاديث التي عندك. فجئته بها، فدعا بنار فحرقها. فقلت: لِمَ أحرقتها؟ قال: خشيت أن أموت وهي عندي فيكون فيها أحاديث عن رجل قد ائتمنتُه ووثقتُ [به]، ولم يكن كما حدّثني فأكون نقلت ذلك»
From `Aa`ishah said: "My father collected the hadeeth from the Messenger of Allaah , which was five hundred hadeeth. He spent that night so sleeplessly and restlessly that I was sad for him." I said: "Are you moving restlessly due to an ailment or information that you received?" When it was morning, he said: My daughter, he asked me to fetch him the collection of Hadith that he had put with me. When I fetched them, he set fire to them. As I asked for the reason, he replied, 'I anticipated that I would die while I still have this collection among which there might be reports of a man that I deemed trustworthy while he was the opposite; therefore, I would be the narrator of such false reports.'
Source:

• al-Dhahabi, Tadhkirah al-Huffaadh (Beirut, Daar al-Ihyaa' al-Turaath, n.d) , vol. 1, pg. 5
  Grading:
• al-Dhahabi said "This hadeeth is no saheeh" (فهذا لا يصح)

ومن مراسيل ابن أبي مليكة ان الصديق جمع الناس بعد وفاة نبيهم فقال إنكم تحدثون عن رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم أحاديث تختلفون فيها والناس بعدكم أشد اختلافا فلا تحدثوا عن رسول الله شيئا فمن سألكم فقولوا بيننا وبينكم كتاب الله فاستحلوا حلاله وحرموا حرامه .
And from a mursal of Ibn Abee Maleeah that al-Sideeq gathered people after the death of their Prophet and said, 'You are reporting about the Messenger of Allah inconsistent narrations. People coming after you will be engaged in more intense discrepancy. Therefore, do not report anything about the Messenger of Allah, and if anyone asks you, you should refer to the Book of Allah as the arbitrator. You should thus deem lawful whatever is lawful therein and deem unlawful whatever is unlawful therein.
Source:

• al-Dhahabi, Tadhkirah al-Huffaadh (Beirut, Daar al-Ihyaa' al-Turaath, n.d) , vol. 1, pg. 2-3
  Grading:
• al-Dhahabi said "Mursal" (فهذا المرسل)

[pharmablogger]

One thing I forgot to mention is that for those (either Twelvers or Orientalists) who obsess about the written aspect (whether of the Quran or of Ahadith), it seems as if they totally discard the fact that Islam has been passed down to us mostly by oral means, with the writings as an aid. For such people it seems that only things that are written down are true and everything else is false, which is totally against what true Islam teaches.

[BILBONDER]

al-Salamu 'Aleykum,

Yes as the brother said the Hadith reached us through memorization especially those of virtue and there weren't much books of Hadith during the early days, as we said they barley wrote the Quran while every member of Islamic society would memorize the Hadith and whatever he could from the book of Allah.

So it really is not an issue, as for Hadith in written form some of the companions had a few papers that they wrote on I think 'Ali binabi Talib and Ibn 'Amr bin al-'Aas are such two.

peace.