[Adeniinteme]

assalamu alaykum

i was wondering, how does the hanafi community deal with contemporary issues? Do the mujtahideen give a fatwa that everyone sticks to or is there flexibility on modern issues? For example would any hanafi scholars permit shaking hands with women?

Also what is the ruling on student loans with interest as they are going to raise the costs of uni to 9000 per year next year so if its haraam, noone can pay that apart from dodi al fayyad

[accotMask17]

assalamu alaykum

i was wondering, how does the hanafi community deal with contemporary issues? Do the mujtahideen give a fatwa that everyone sticks to or is there flexibility on modern issues? For example would any hanafi scholars permit shaking hands with women?

Also what is the ruling on student loans with interest as they are going to raise the costs of uni to 9000 per year next year so if its haraam, noone can pay that apart from dodi al fayyad

Student loan based on usury is a trap. Check this thread.

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http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...ed-in-the-West
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[accotMask17]

Also what is the ruling on student loans with interest as they are going to raise the costs of uni to 9000 per year next year so if its haraam, noone can pay that apart from dodi al fayyad

In some EU countries , university education is cheap. For example, Germany. But, you may need to some months to learn German which is not a difficult language.

Another option is to study in USA. If you can manage a scholarship , you can study in a good university in USA. Some state universities in USA are also cheap.

[Adeniinteme]

subhanallah i wouldnt have time to learn german, uni starts really soon and i have family and couldnt learn german to a standard where i could understand university level classes.

Also, are u basically saying that no muslim should attend uni (as no muslim cud find nine grand per year)?

Also moving to another country is not a small easy thing when i have family, my mum needs me here too. I dont realisticly think 2million muslims will migrate out of the uk for uni

[accotMask17]

subhanallah i wouldnt have time to learn german, uni starts really soon and i have family and couldnt learn german to a standard where i could understand university level classes.

Also, are u basically saying that no muslim should attend uni (as no muslim cud find nine grand per year)?

Also moving to another country is not a small easy thing when i have family, my mum needs me here too. I dont realisticly think 2million muslims will migrate out of the uk for uni

Is university education mandatory for a Muslim ? If you can afford it in a halal way , go ahead. If not, will u use haram means to get something optonal ?

[ditpiler]

Student loan based on usury is a trap. Check this thread.

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http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...ed-in-the-West
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pawlak you have interesting posts, btw, did you follow the Bohemian Grove meeting this summer? Do you know who attended?

This debt thing is interesting, enslaving entire nation. Debt, credit - no credit cant buy anything. Unfortunately, many Muslims absolutely just do not care about interest based student loans. They feel it is a necessity.

[LasTins]

when i was at uni paying 3k, i use to get a govt grant for 2700k and pay 300 out of my own pocket to avoid haraam.. are they still offering these grants to help? and how much do they offer? with it being 9k.. do they offer near 9k? or are you still thousands off? if this is the case then i too agree, u shudnt go uni, it doesnt weakne u by the fourth year and affects u no matter how much u say it doesnt.

[Adeniinteme]

Is university education mandatory for a Muslim ? If you can afford it in a halal way , go ahead. If not, will u use haram means to get something optonal ?

i agree, this is the conundrem isnt it.

Its very hard to earn a decent living with a degree. Many muslims sponge off benefits now which is also haraam and worse because its continuous haraam for ur whole life. Unless all muslims will be taxi drivers?

And the grant will still be around £3000 and the fee's alone are £9000 plus living expenses so its pretty much haraam or no degree. Allahu musta'aan. Very tricky predicament. I feel very uncortable making riba halal but doesnt the shariah have principles that allow for necessity?

[DonnyKong]

This debt thing is interesting, enslaving entire nation. Debt, credit - no credit cant buy anything. Unfortunately, many Muslims absolutely just do not care about interest based student loans. They feel it is a necessity.

This don't care attitude seem to have affected even some of the practising brothers in the West.
One reason may be that the danger of interest ( Riba ) is not highlighted during the Jummah khutba

One of my relatives were married to a Muslim doctor who belongs to Tablig Jamat. After marriage , we discovered that he took interest based student loans to finance his medical study.

I am very shocked. He has been active in TJ even when he was in the medical school in the UK. Then , why nobody told him to stop taklng interest based loans ? May be , he did not discuss it with anyone and thought that its OK to take interest based loan , since no explicit discussion on riba can be heard in the mosques !!!

Now I am told that he had,somehow, negotiated with the bank to keep the interest frozen !! Is that really possible ?

Anyway, now this doctor goes to Makkah every year for Umrah while his loan from the bank is still not paid back !!

Welcome to the age of reformed Islam !!!

[DonnyKong]

Very tricky predicament. I feel very uncortable making riba halal but doesnt the shariah have principles that allow for necessity?

This has made me recall an anecdote . While I was in the UK , one south Asian told me that in one community , they have a saying like this " Its OK to buy the first house with the interest based loan from the bank. But , the second house is not allowed as it is not necessity !!"

You see , there are many definitions of "necessity " !! May be , you should rent a scholar who will fine tune the definition of "necessity " which is most suitable for you !!!!!!!

Then make a Faustian bargain

Its so easy to jump into the abyss of hell !

[Adeniinteme]

This don't care attitude seem to have affected even some of the practising brothers in the West.
One reason may be that the danger of interest ( Riba ) is not highlighted during the Jummah khutba

One of my relatives were married to a Muslim doctor who belongs to Tablig Jamat. After marriage , we discovered that he took interest based student loans to finance his medical study.

I am very shocked. He has been active in TJ even when he was in the medical school in the UK. Then , why nobody told him to stop taklng interest based loans ? May be , he did not discuss it with anyone and thought that its OK to take interest based loan , since no explicit discussion on riba can be heard in the mosques !!!

Now I am told that he had,somehow, negotiated with the bank to keep the interest frozen !! Is that really possible ?

Anyway, now this doctor goes to Makkah every year for Umrah while his loan from the bank is still not paid back !!

Welcome to the age of reformed Islam !!!

bro firstly please dont publicise your brothers sins or talk about them online, your community should be ashamed of themselves for making this guys sins public and discussing them.

Secondly, i dont agree with your signature. The ottoman empire was not in short supply of socalled spirituality, it was in short supply of adherrence to the shariah. Hence the importance of this discussion

[Adeniinteme]

This has made me recall an anecdote . While I was in the UK , one south Asian told me that in one community , they have a saying like this " Its OK to buy the first house with the interest based loan from the bank. But , the second house is not allowed as it is not necessity !!"

You see , there are many definitions of "necessity " !! May be , you should rent a scholar who will fine tune the definition of "necessity " which is most suitable for you !!!!!!!

Then make a Faustian bargain

Its so easy to jump into the abyss of hell !

i agree. It opens up dangerous doors. Which is why a clear definition of each madhab is required for necessity plus a decent discussion on the whole issue, dont tale depriving a whole generation of muslim youth from an education lightly, i agree riba is not a small issue but neither is making hardships on people to this level where it affects their whole life so a proper discussion with shariah principles is required inshallah

[unatkot]

He has been active in TJ

you breath TJ

May be , he did not discuss it with anyone and thought that its OK to take interest based loan , since no explicit discussion on riba can be heard in the mosques !!!

11 Tasbeeh effected so much on the sifat of Husn dhan soo much that it run away from the window.

[adoreorerie]

What is the shar'ai ruling of an individual who had taken student loan during the jahiliyyah period of his life but over a period of time he gains taqwa with the taufeeq of Allah ta'ala and realizes the severity of being indulged in the sin of riba?

Assalaam'aaleykum!

[ditpiler]

finance related article here
http://www.alqalam.org.uk/

As far as I know there have been many views depending on the condition of the environment. However currently there is an accepted view no matter what Riba is not permissible. However there are scholars gives concession out of necesseties temporarily.
We should stay away from Riba based economy asap and ought to adopt the murabits approach as much as we can in dealing with financial matter. The dominant hanafi view is somewhere between the puritanical approach of murabit and the batil system. Not everyone can emulate the murabit. Some of the hanafi have started to adopt the murabit approach. I too am a supportive of murabit approach but appreciate the effort made by the likes of Mufti taqi to resolve the issue ina practical manner.
Allahualam

what would be the necessity?

[ditpiler]

If you stand in front of congregation especially in the more affluent masajid and say this dont take interest based student loans you will hear nothing but crickets chirping - ur voice will fall on deaf ears "oh he doesnt know the needs of the time"

[Squeernemergo]

Assalamu alaikum,

Nowadays ulema permit student loans as long as one is confident one will not end up paying actually paying interest.

[accotMask17]

Assalamu alaikum,

Nowadays ulema permit student loans as long as one is confident one will not end up paying actually paying interest.

Can you show any example of non-interest based student loan scheme in the West ?

The ugly truth is that those loans are clever ploys to enslave the students. More on this issue is here.
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http://www.mybudget360.com/serfdom-v...student-loans/
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[LasTins]

also on this subject, someone raised earlier that brothers live off benefits? i dont think that is haraam if it is genuine but they are actively looking for work and are trying there best? unless they are not taking work on purpose and staying on benefits just because they cant be bothered.

It does shock me being in bradford how many practicing brothers are claiming every beenfit under the sun and not working, and yet being bale to attend all namaz's in mosques etc. and go to madrasah etc. they are probably more learned than u and i but we dont have the time to do all the extras due to working full time. Surely this isnt allowed? to solely live off benefits? just because u earn more and get more such as frree house than you would do if you worked.. hence limiting work for 16 hours so beenfits dont stop?

[accotMask17]

also on this subject, someone raised earlier that brothers live off benefits? i dont think that is haraam if it is genuine but they are actively looking for work and are trying there best? unless they are not taking work on purpose and staying on benefits just because they cant be bothered.

It does shock me being in bradford how many practicing brothers are claiming every beenfit under the sun and not working, and yet being bale to attend all namaz's in mosques etc. and go to madrasah etc. they are probably more learned than u and i but we dont have the time to do all the extras due to working full time. Surely this isnt allowed? to solely live off benefits? just because u earn more and get more such as frree house than you would do if you worked.. hence limiting work for 16 hours so beenfits dont stop?

There is a hidden agenda behind those social benefits. More on this issue is in this thread.

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http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...urity-benefits

Alliance with the Lower Classes ~ In order to keep our valuable regulatory machinery in place and under our control, we must have the mass support of the numerous lower classes against our vigorous, but scarce middle-class rivals. The best method is to provide the lower classes with subsidies at the expense of the middle class. This creates a mutual hatred that prevents the middle class from appealing effectively to the lower classes for support.

Social security, free health care, unemployment benefits, and direct welfare payments, while doing nothing for us directly, create a dependent class whose support for our critical measures can easily be made part of a package deal.

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