[Clielldub]

You run a Forum and I was a member of the Mourabitoun resistance group in Lebanon who has been fighting Israel and its allies since 1958.

may Allah bless you if you actually fought. but i wasnt even born back then. but even i supported Hamas, and so did every other group and supporter. but as Hamas started fighting other groups more and more and selling itself to iran, everyone is against them now (those who know whats going on).

and i just looked up your org, it is apparently baathist group you were part of? you are using their logo as you avatar. it is a motto of Jamal Abdel Nasser, it seems.

I know two Salafis in Hamas and know that there are plenty of them in Hamas itself so solve this one for me.

brother, can you please check if they are still in hamas?? because many of these other groups were formed, after people got tired of hamas and broke off. there are still salafi elements as well as anti-shia elements within hamas. but most have broken off are in process of doing so ongoing.

[pXss8cyx]

Ok let me just show you an example of your Iranian Khomeinists Shia pawns.

Doctor Salih Hussein Suleiman al-Raqb a Politician in Hamas and one of their representatives in Gaza, he wrote and published his book "al-Washi'a fi Kashf Kufriyat wa Shana'ee al-Shia " "الوشيعة في كشف كفريات وشنائع الشيعة".

Which is quoted by the Salafis in their biggest Forums:
http://www.dd-sunnah.net/forum/showthread.php?t=115467

and you can download it from his website here:
http://www.drsregeb.com/index.php?action=vb-k&nid=25

And here is Sheikh Nizar Rayyan one of Hamas's Qassam brigades leaders in Jabalya, see how he wipes the floor with the Shia in his sermons:
http://www.alburhan.com/listen_windo...3586&file_no=1

[avaiptutt]

Salam

yes, i do believe. to each our own. i oppose hamas for killing salafis and selling-out to shias. and i oppose salafis for killing innocent christians or extremism. i want the middlepath that the Prophet prescribed. i am not a perfectionist. i am not one of those people who only want the most PERFECT, and considers everything else as worthless. no, i dont mind some nationalism, i dont mind some deviancy. as LONG as it doesnt hurt others, and doesnt prevent others who ARE on the proper path. As long as hamas isnt killing muslims, or salafis arent killing muslims/innocents. and as long as they arent affiliating with anyone else who kills muslims. im fine with anyone. hezbollah/iran kills muslims, and from them hamas has killed muslims. so i oppose them. that is all, nothing against you. you condemn an extremist group for killing an innocent civilian yet you supportthe TTP?!?!?!?!

we do not see taliban, TTP and other sunni groups running to iran or shia. instead, they fight honorably (and fight against shia) what is honourable abt their killing of innocent people attending mosques?!?!?!

you really should STOP grouping the TTP and the taliban in one category. no one in pakistan believes this extremist TTP group has anything to do with the real taliban under the leadership of Mullah omar (db).

[Clielldub]

Ok let me just show you an example of your Iranian Khomeinists Shia pawns.

Doctor Salih Hussein Suleiman al-Raqb a Politician in Hamas and one of their representatives in Gaza, he wrote and published his book "al-Washi'a fi Kashf Kufriyat wa Shana'ee al-Shia " "الوشيعة في كشف كفريات وشنائع الشيعة".

Which is quoted by the Salafis in their biggest Forums:
http://www.dd-sunnah.net/forum/showthread.php?t=115467

and you can download it from his website here:
http://www.drsregeb.com/index.php?action=vb-k&nid=25

And here is Sheikh Nizar Rayyan one of Hamas's Qassam brigades leaders in Jabalya, see how he wipes the floor with the Shia in his sermons:
http://www.alburhan.com/listen_windo...3586&file_no=1

brother, you should read my earlier reply. there have always been salafist elements with hamas. i just mentioned that most of the rival groups were formed because theire members broke off from Hamas in the first place.

Salam

you condemn an extremist group for killing an innocent civilian yet you supportthe TTP?!?!?!?!


what is honourable abt their killing of innocent people attending mosques?!?!?!

you really should STOP grouping the TTP and the taliban in one category. no one in pakistan believes this extremist TTP group has anything to do with the real taliban under the leadership of Mullah omar (db).

i never stated that TTP and taliban are in the same category, except that they both fight the crusaders. TTP has denied attacks on most mosques it is accused of. the Pak govt is run by rafidhis, and it is a duty for every muslim to rise up against them. just as today muslims have risen up against them in syria. and TTP dont have any connectioon to kuffar/shia, infact they fight them.

[pXss8cyx]

exactly, thats what THEY said to the media for their excuses/propaganda. but i dont look just at the media, i look at what the other mujahideen factions are saying. what is Jamaat Ansar al-sunnah fi Bait al-Maqdis saying, what Jamaat tawhid wal Jihad is saying, what Jaysh al-islam is saying, what Jund Ansar Allah i saying...... just last year or the year before it. Jund Ansar Alalh declared gaza an "islamic emirate". and what happened right after that?? Hamas stormed in and killed the entire mosque including the leader. http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy&h...470f6d7470bb69



first of all brother, i never said they are worshipping khomeini. neither did i say that sex-changes are PROOF for one being a worshipper of kheomeini. now you are just resorting to making things up.
iran allows sex-changes, and so does the west. does that mean im saying iran is christian or secularist?? no. the topic of SAUDI wasnt even mentioned by me. so how can you ASSUME, that because i was criticizing Hamas i am somehow OKAY with Saudi??

I say the propaganda is the one made by those other untrustworthy groups who god only knows where they crawled out from. As for Jund-Ansarullah whose leader Abdullatif Musa had suspicious relations. Well He declared an islamic emirate in gaza (With him as the Ameer) and he had armed men around him then he attacked Hamas severely in his Sermon and called for the armed Hamas forces to hand over their weapons and join him,. then he said: "We will fight all those who fight us." They then posted on their official website that they only follow Abdullatif Musa as the Caliph and Ameer of Gaza. this same group had attacked an Israeli position a few weeks earlier... with horses so the young Men were shot and killed before they reached the fence.
Link:http://www.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/3...66B7B63C6A.htm

As for the sexchange argument, you used it to show me how Hamas is a follower of Iran... it's not a good argument that's all I am saying.

... I am sick of this, This is my last reply to anything.

[Clielldub]

brother tripolysunni, i respect you opinions. you know why? because you are speaking from your experience from BACK THEN. whereas im speaking from my experience/knowledge from NOW. there is a huge difference. when you were around they were a good force, so you continue to see them in that light. but so did Jesus/Isa (AM) until many of his own followers betrayed him, and so did Hussein until his own followers betrayed him.

you have NOT been betrayed. but those who are still in gaza, they have been betrayed. so they have eneded up in revolt against hamas. that is all there is to it. its not my knowledge against yours. your knowledge is right, but so is mine. Hamas went from good to bad. brother, just pray that they STOP affiliating with shia/iran, rather then making an excuse that there is some sort of justification for it. we can end our discussion on this note. take care.

I say the propaganda is the one made by those other untrustworthy groups who god only knows where they crawled out from. As for Jund-Ansarullah whose leader Abdullatif Musa had suspicious relations. Well He declared an islamic emirate in gaza (With him as the Ameer) and he had armed men around him then he attacked Hamas severely in his Sermon and called for the armed Hamas forces to hand over their weapons and join him,. then he said: "We will fight all those who fight us." They then posted on their official website that they only follow Abdullatif Musa as the Caliph and Ameer of Gaza. this same group had attacked an Israeli position a few weeks earlier... with horses so the young Men were shot and killed before they reached the fence.
Link:http://www.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/3...66B7B63C6A.htm

As for the sexchange argument, you used it to show me how Hamas is a follower of Iran... it's not a good argument that's all I am saying.

... I am sick of this, This is my last reply to anything.

i dont like most of these groups either, neither did i like how Jund Ansar Allah declared their state. but it was just a natural response to the hypocracies (not rly being islamic) and unholy alliances (with iran/hezbollah) of hamas. but what Hamas did was unforgivable. if someone on THIS very forum were to criticize you or even curse you. would you rly want to kill him?? i know you wont. Then why would hamas?? two reasons, one is they didnt want to lose influence/power, and the other is to satisfy their safavid partners. but because of this, we will only see more and more gorups rivalling or breaking-off from Hamas. unfortunately, this is also bad because salafi-extremism is increasing because of that.

on hand you have you have ghair-muqallid shia-friendly Hamas, and on the other you have ghair-muqallid increasingly-fascist salafis. and on the other foot there is Fatah, who are no better alternative either..... by the way, if you really want to see Hamas' opinion regarding shia or iran. forget me, just hop on to their english forum and ask them about it. that should settle it. take care, brother.

[Grorointeri]

Warrior1,

You seem to be well versed in what is going on with the Mujahideen. Can you recommend me any sources so that I may find out what is going on?

[onlyfun_biziness]

I think a lot of stuff on the internet, including jihadi forums, is just hearsay and speculation without any concrete proof or fuller understanding, which is why one guy running such a website would have totally different opinions than another guy running a similar website. The video's posted can potentially be fake, the articles posted could also be fake, etc etc, you get my drift

[mobiphones]

I think a lot of stuff on the internet, including jihadi forums, is just hearsay and speculation without any concrete proof or fuller understanding, which is why one guy running such a website would have totally different opinions than another guy running a similar website. The video's posted can potentially be fake, the articles posted could also be fake, etc etc, you get my drift

This is the case - there are loads of disinformation out there coming from both sides - this is a key strategy to war - what used to be rumors floating from village to village in a small valley is now runmors floating from forum to forum spanning the entire globe. The thing Ive noticed is the most reliabe sources of information regarding the various groups and the various strategies employed by all these groups comes from the guys who are actually involved in the fight - the litteral "murabitun" - not the guys behind a keyboard - the other thing is loose lips sink ships - so if some moron wants to post his groups stratgy and movements and activities all over the internet so everyone thinks hes some rightous jihadi warrior - then that moron probably hasnt been entrusted with very much info to begin with. too many people talk too much - eat less, sleep less, talk less, isnt just a moto for sufis in their daily lives - it should be the moto for all those who fight Fisabiillah - and it is the moto for the true mujahideen out there.

[Heopretg2006]

I was utterly shocked yesterday when hearing the news of Vittorio Arrigoni being kidnapped, and even more so when I read he was found dead.
Whoever killed him is a dumb stupid crimian moron and should be severely punished by the Hamas government.

Vittorio Arrigoni wasn't the typical "western pacifist" who goes to war places feeling he's saving the world. He was very well known amongst all the pro-Palestine associations here in Italy and has been involved in countless actions of concrete solidariety, even the "Free Gaza" flotilla; remained in Gaza during the zionist attack, corresponding with newspapers and giving news of what happened there.

And on top on that, he's always been pro-resistance and - as far as I can say - one of the most "pro-Islamic" pro-Palestine activist.

In fact, it seems this bunch of stupid idiots kidnapped him due to his being "near to Hamas", and in order to have a few of their friends freed from prisons.

Almost everytime the zombie salafies come into a Jihad scenario they ruin everything.
May Allah guide them or put them in such a situation which prevent them to damage the true Jihad.

[CowextetleSix]

Really dumb actions by dumb people. But this is the state of our ummah. I don't see it getting better.


Wassalam.

[lagunaEl]

I was utterly shocked yesterday when hearing the news of Vittorio Arrigoni being kidnapped, and even more so when I read he was found dead.
Whoever killed him is a dumb stupid crimian moron and should be severely punished by the Hamas government.

Vittorio Arrigoni wasn't the typical "western pacifist" who goes to war places feeling he's saving the world. He was very well known amongst all the pro-Palestine associations here in Italy and has been involved in countless actions of concrete solidariety, even the "Free Gaza" flotilla; remained in Gaza during the zionist attack, corresponding with newspapers and giving news of what happened there.

And on top on that, he's always been pro-resistance and - as far as I can say - one of the most "pro-Islamic" pro-Palestine activist.

In fact, it seems this bunch of stupid idiots kidnapped him due to his being "near to Hamas", and in order to have a few of their friends freed from prisons.

Almost everytime the zombie salafies come into a Jihad scenario they ruin everything.
May Allah guide them or put them in such a situation which prevent them to damage the true Jihad.

I can't understand why the Salafis have to insist on opposing every other group when it comes to Islamic revolutions and politics.

I've heard that the Salafis have started their own political group in Egypt as well, and are opposing the Ikhwan. And all I think is why? Will they actually be able to do anything other than split the pro-Islam and pro-Shariah Muslims?

I'm no fan of the Ikhwan myself, but at least they have the numbers to make a change in Egypt. Why would anyone want to divide the Islamic agenda in a place like that?

[Heopretg2006]

I can't understand why the Salafis have to insist on opposing every other group when it comes to Islamic revolutions and politics.

I've heard that the Salafis have started their own political group in Egypt as well, and are opposing the Ikhwan. And all I think is why? Will they actually be able to do anything other than split the pro-Islam and pro-Shariah Muslims?

I'm no fan of the Ikhwan myself, but at least they have the numbers to make a change in Egypt. Why would anyone want to divide the Islamic agenda in a place like that?

Mostly it's about intolerance, a trademark of Salafis. They won't accept any slight difference with what they preach, they can't accept the existance of difference of opinion. That's mainly due to their simple-mindness and ignorance: when someone is very ignorant he will see the world as "black and white". And for them it's their way or no way.

But brother, forget about opposing other groups, they can't even stop opposing each othe, amongst multitudes of different Salafi groups and factions.

Only in Gaza there are other salafi group other than the one claiming responsability of this vile action.

I've read time ago that some years ago only in Egypt have been counted something like 700 Salafi groups (obviously each one of them considering himself "the Saved Sect"...

The more I have to deal with them the more I can't stand them.
It's true, they may seem "more similar" to us than modernists, innovators and so on, but once you deal with them you'll understand they're pure venom!

[YmolafBp]

what is this about hamas and the salafis? can someone explain please. why are hamas imprisoning the salafi group?

Let's say they were imprisoned unjustly. Is this the way to act? If they are acting like this no matter what the reason for imprisonment, then I feel it was right for them to have been imprisoned.

[pXss8cyx]

Let's say they were imprisoned unjustly. Is this the way to act? If they are acting like this no matter what the reason for imprisonment, then I feel it was right for them to have been imprisoned.

They're imprisoned Justly, Hamas declared a truce or a temporary cease-fire with Israel after the battles, but these guys they don't understand what a Truce means and why it is important in order for the people to regain their health and for the supplies to flow back in and in order for Hamas to regain their strength and formulate new strategies.

Hamas who are the legitimate government who was elected by the Muslims chose to have a truce, these guys will disobey and fire random rockets only to have Israel retaliate and destroy the entire Gaza strip, tighten the siege and block all paths. What Hamas does is that they don't kill them, they just arrest them and keep them in prison so that Israel wouldn't have an excuse and say "Hamas broke the truce thus they deserve to be bombarded" (Like in 2009 when Israel broke the truce). These extremists however cannot be arrested easily they will actually fire at the Hamas people and try to kill them so they have casualties usually when trying to stop these extremist groups... The extremists go even further by claiming that gaza is an emirate and that they choose the Ameer and that Hamas has to drop their weapons and follow the Ameer the Salafi extremists elected...it gets complicated.

[Snocioncilm]

Salam




you really should STOP grouping the TTP and the taliban in one category. no one in pakistan believes this extremist TTP group has anything to do with the real taliban under the leadership of Mullah omar (db).

..that is a little inaccurate brother.....that is all I will say...

[YmolafBp]

They're imprisoned Justly, Hamas declared a truce or a temporary cease-fire with Israel after the battles, but these guys they don't understand what a Truce means and why it is important in order for the people to regain their health and for the supplies to flow back in and in order for Hamas to regain their strength and formulate new strategies.

Hamas who are the legitimate government who was elected by the Muslims chose to have a truce, these guys will disobey and fire random rockets only to have Israel retaliate and destroy the entire Gaza strip, tighten the siege and block all paths. What Hamas does is that they don't kill them, they just arrest them and keep them in prison so that Israel wouldn't have an excuse and say "Hamas broke the truce thus they deserve to be bombarded" (Like in 2009 when Israel broke the truce). These extremists however cannot be arrested easily they will actually fire at the Hamas people and try to kill them so they have casualties usually when trying to stop these extremist groups... The extremists go even further by claiming that gaza is an emirate and that they choose the Ameer and that Hamas has to drop their weapons and follow the Ameer the Salafi extremists elected...it gets complicated.

Assalamu aliakum,

I wasn't supporting the Salafis - in fact I was doing the opposite. Let me re-write/re-phrase what I wrote.

Let's say they [the Salafis] were imprisoned unjustly. Is this the way to act [by killing an innocent person, who on top was supporting the Palestinian cause]? If they [the Salafis] are acting like this [i.e. irrationally, by killing an innocent person and Palestinian sympathizer] no matter what the reason for imprisonment, then I feel it was right for them to have been imprisoned [because people who are acting so irrationally probably also got jailed for something equally irrational and stupid].

[lagunaEl]

Mostly it's about intolerance, a trademark of Salafis. They won't accept any slight difference with what they preach, they can't accept the existance of difference of opinion. That's mainly due to their simple-mindness and ignorance: when someone is very ignorant he will see the world as "black and white". And for them it's their way or no way.

But brother, forget about opposing other groups, they can't even stop opposing each othe, amongst multitudes of different Salafi groups and factions.

Only in Gaza there are other salafi group other than the one claiming responsability of this vile action.

I've read time ago that some years ago only in Egypt have been counted something like 700 Salafi groups (obviously each one of them considering himself "the Saved Sect"...

The more I have to deal with them the more I can't stand them.
It's true, they may seem "more similar" to us than modernists, innovators and so on, but once you deal with them you'll understand they're pure venom!

This is unfortunately very true in many cases.

I still don't say this about all Salafis, because I know and have met Salafi brothers who are not like this at all. Besides them, however, the mainstream Salafi ideology is definitely like this.

I think I can honestly say that 70-80% of what led me away from being completely sympathetic to Salafiyyah is the sayings of actions of Salafis themselves. My personal dealings with multiple Salafi groups (each opposed to each other and backbiting one another, of course), and what I saw on forums like SalafiTalk and IslamicAwakening really, really put a sour taste in my mouth.

[BUMbaronos]

I'm really surprised and shocked that you don't realize what game "Israel" is playing and that you have no problem with attacking muslims for things that they didn't do! Just tell me where is the proof for your claims???

Since when is a Youtube-Video, which is most likely made by Mossad, a proof against a muslim (weather he is salafi, ikhwani, sufi etc.)??

For your Info: The "evil" "salafi jihadi" groups in Ghaza have denied these claimes against them and have condemned this crime!!

And ask yourself one thing: "Who will benefit from this incident??" (If you know the answer, then you also know who did this crime!)

And I have another question: Are we here really on a Deobandi forum or is this forum becoming a Barelwi forum???

[Heopretg2006]

I'm really surprised and shocked that you don't see what game "Israel" is playing and that you have no problem with attacking muslims for things that they didn't do! Just tell me where is the proof for your claims???

Since when is a Youtube-Video, which is most likely made by Mossad, a proof against a muslim (weather he is salafi, ikhwani, sufi etc.)??

For your Info: The "evil" "salafi jihadi" groups in Ghaza have denied these claimes against them and have condemned this crime!!

And ask yourself one thing: "Who will benefit from this incident??" (If you know the answer, then you also know who did this crime!)

And I have another question: Are we here really on a Deobandi forum or is this forum becoming a Barelwi forum???

It's always easy to blame "jews and americans" but the "cui prodest" isn't automatically a proof.

The Hamas government would have had all the interests to claim any Mossad responsability, yet, they said that that Salafi group was guilty of it. They even arrested a few of its members; nay, the information about the place where Vittorio was found has been given by one of their (this Salafi faction) own members.

Another Salafi group (there is more then one just in Ghaza) said they weren't responsible of this action but they said that the action was justified..

As you can see, the point is that people believing such vile acts to be justified and permissible in Islam do exist and it isn't far-fetched to believe that sometimes they even practice what they do preach (even though usually the Salafis aren't famous for practicing what they preach, but that's another history).

Either we refute these actions, or we close our eyes and say "oh, don't worry, there isn't any problem, it's only CIA & Mossad behind it".

P.S.: Deobandis are not "Salafis", so why should we defend them no matter what?