[WaysletlyLene]

the situation is same every where in wwhole muslim world whether its east or west and in religious or non-religious people. No one can get financially stable in his whole life these days due to econmical situation in this era , to the point where his parents wants him to be unless he takes loans or he has strong financial background etc. Exceptions are possible but for majority, this is the case

Sadly, our parents dont realize this and they dont even bother to think over it. Ulema cant do anything since people dont refer to them . They only refer to them when there is divorce or nikah or any other big incident. They dont refer to ulema for guidance but just to find an immediate solution to their big problem which has popped up all of a sudden.

On other hand sisters are soooooo demanding as well. They want 100% which is impossible. There are few who are very good but mostly, this is the case. So, for brothers who want to get married early, this causes a full stop. While, some brothers are looking for Angelina Julie in nikab, which eats their whole life up.

There is not much ulema can do regarding this unless they start giving khutbah regularly over this topic, which they dont. This problem has already been discussed but we coudnt come up to any solution . So i gues we will stay DEOBANDI and thus lazy

[geraint.faughn]

We should do our best effort to protect youth from sin but are they ready for marriage? Would you say that the average 18 year old Muslim boy/girl is ready for responsibilities of marriage? Or would throwing them into marriage force them to feel the weight of responsibility and stand up to it? I really dont know. Fine we marry them off and take care of one of their problems, then what happens the following morning? I dont know what outweighs what and how the fuqaha make that distinction, I cant comment on that. It could solve many problems or be the cause of collapse of family structure.

1400 years ago, an 18 year old man back then was able to command an entire army whereas an 18 year old man in this age can barely do his own laundry/manage his finances. A 16 year old, simply back in my grandparents age, a 16 year old girl could run an entire household. 16 year old girls now are still busy with Barbie and Brittney Spears. It does solve a major problem and could be means to save many people from sin. I just dont know how well it could be sustained.

Personally I think each case should be handled individually.

I think there there is much "hikam(ah)" in this post (sorry I know know it's a cheap pun but I couldn't help it).

But seriously, the how realistic is it to expect someone in their late teens to support a wife as well as study full time?

The other option is to quit studying and get a job in a call centre, factory etc. Although there's nothing wrong with this as it's a halal income, would it be a waste of talent for those who are capable of much more?

[WaysletlyLene]

I think there there is much "hikam(ah)" in this post (sorry I know know it's a cheap pun but I couldn't help it).

But seriously, the how realistic is it to expect someone in their late teens to support a wife as well as study full time?

The other option is to quit studying and get a job in a call centre, factory etc. Although there's nothing wrong with this as it's a halal income, would it be a waste of talent for those who are capable of much more?

ok, then marry them late while they remain no more virgin. right?

[Ornamiviant]

A person can only get married if they can fulfill the rights of a spouse. So if they can do so, they should get married.

I dont understand the point of these threads sometimes. If you have the money and can fulfill the rights, then go get married. If you cant, then work on being able to do so.

We get people complaining that they cant get married yet they dont even have a source of income from which to pri
ovide for the family (which is a right of the woman over the man). If such is the case, how is that the fault of the ulema? Or the fault of parents for that matter. If you cant afford a wife, thats your problem, not theirs.

[Ornamiviant]

ok, then marry them late while they remain no more virgin. right?

the reason why many of the youth cimmit zina is because of the fact that most muslims are non practicing and are influenced by the culture they live in, the same reason they listen to music, do drugs etc.

Now as has been explained by the bro, most people canr afford a wife whilst at uni yet you still advicate that they get married. Who is then supposed to take care of the wife financially then? Its her right and the his responsibility. Please outline the solution and we can see whether it is practical

[WaysletlyLene]

the reason why many of the youth cimmit zina is because of the fact that most muslims are non practicing and are influenced by the culture they live in, the same reason they listen to music, do drugs etc.

Now as has been explained by the bro, most people canr afford a wife whilst at uni yet you still advicate that they get married. Who is then supposed to take care of the wife financially then? Its her right and the his responsibility. Please outline the solution and we can see whether it is practical

there is no one step solution to this problem.

No matter how practicing u r, in the end u r human and there is a limit to what you can control urself, specially when u r in that univ. environment.

Money isnt the only thing we live for. I have my cousins got married to each other. He used to make very little money while he got married while now he has his own business. this is the promise of ALLAH that when u do nikah. he will make u ghani.. but we have no brains in our heads.

women need t learn how to live as well. Its not all about buying new style clothes as they arrive in market and keeping theirselves up to date. its about peace and harmoney and Qana'at.

So, to summarize it all, MONEY is NOT the issue. All you need is a room to survive initially, if the boy n girl are sensible. If they are not, then there is no limit of foolishness.

[goctorsurger]

When Hazrath Tanvir sahib db came to Chicago he gave a very good jummah khutbah. In that talk he mentioned about marrying kids early. I remember this bayaan as if it was yesterday. Please listen to this very important discourse here:

http://shariahboard.org/audio/Mufti-...iday-100104.rm

[HondasMenFox]

Follow the path of the Salaf blindly...it will invariably lead you to success.

On Friday, a 45 year old female patient named S****** Begum came to my consulting room for diabetes. In the course of my history taking I asked her about stressors in life. She said that there were many. Last year her husband who is a businessman underwent bypass surgery. She arranged for the money with some difficulty and got the operation done. Some days later it turned out that her husband had been having an affair with a call girl since the past 5 years and had kept her in a flat in Virar. With great difficulty and a big ruckus she managed to separate the two. Her daughter who had been married for several years has come back home after a fight with her husband and now refuses to go back. Her younger son who goes to Junior College is having an affair with a Hindu girl and is sinking deeper and deeper into Hindu customs by the day.
So the father can afford a whore and flat in which to keep her but cannot pay for the upkeep of his son who could have been married early to a Muslima and thereby protected his eyesight. That is the position from which we talk and that is why we are in the dirt heap.
WS.

there is no one step solution to this problem.

No matter how practicing u r, in the end u r human and there is a limit to what you can control urself, specially when u r in that univ. environment.

Money isnt the only thing we live for. I have my cousins got married to each other. He used to make very little money while he got married while now he has his own business. this is the promise of ALLAH that when u do nikah. he will make u ghani.. but we have no brains in our heads.

women need t learn how to live as well. Its not all about buying new style clothes as they arrive in market and keeping theirselves up to date. its about peace and harmoney and Qana'at.

So, to summarize it all, MONEY is NOT the issue. All you need is a room to survive initially, if the boy n girl are sensible. If they are not, then there is no limit of foolishness.

[juptVatoSoito]

Follow the path of the Salaf blindly...it will invariably lead you to success.

On Friday, a 45 year old female patient named S****** Begum came to my consulting room for diabetes. In the course of my history taking I asked her about stressors in life. She said that there were many. Last year her husband who is a businessman underwent bypass surgery. She arranged for the money with some difficulty and got the operation done. Some days later it turned out that her husband had been having an affair with a call girl since the past 5 years and had kept her in a flat in Virar. With great difficulty and a big ruckus she managed to separate the two. Her daughter who had been married for several years has come back home after a fight with her husband and now refuses to go back. Her younger son who goes to Junior College is having an affair with a Hindu girl and is sinking deeper and deeper into Hindu customs by the day.
So the father can afford a * and flat in which to keep her but cannot pay for the upkeep of his son who could have been married early to a Muslima and thereby protected his eyesight. That is the position from which we talk and that is why we are in the dirt heap.
WS.

That isn't the typical way people live their lives though.

I too am an advocate of early marriage but only if your situation allows for it. Imagine the following scenario which I think is quite common in the UK:

You have a large family (parents and say 4-5 children) all living in a terraced or semi-detached house. The girls can get married, leave their parental home and live with her husband or in-laws (if its possible) but the boys in the family cannot afford to get married as they aren't earning enough to even pay rent, tax and bills let alone other necessities of life. You could say why not just continue living with your parents to share the costs? Good idea only that the boy has two other brothers so there is the hijab issue with his wife and them, not to mention over cramping which by necessity has an impact on their marital relations and intimacy.

So whereas early marriage is a good idea and I agree with it and recommend it to those who can, not many are in a position to make this happen.

[HondasMenFox]

That isn't the typical way people live their lives though.

I too am an advocate of early marriage but only if your situation allows for it. Imagine the following scenario which I think is quite common in the UK:

You have a large family (parents and say 4-5 children) all living in a terraced or semi-detached house. The girls can get married, leave their parental home and live with her husband or in-laws (if its possible) but the boys in the family cannot afford to get married as they aren't earning enough to even pay rent, tax and bills let alone other necessities of life. You could say why not just continue living with your parents to share the costs? Good idea only that the boy has two other brothers so there is the hijab issue with his wife and them, not to mention over cramping which by necessity has an impact on their marital relations and intimacy.

So whereas early marriage is a good idea and I agree with it and recommend it to those who can, not many are in a position to make this happen.

Sahl ibn Sa’d (Allah be pleased with him) relates that a woman came to the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him and grant him peace) and offered herself to him [for marriage].
He said, “I do not have any need for women right now.”
A man said, “O Messenger of Allah, marry her to me!”
He asked, “Do you have anything [to give as dowry]?”
He replied, “I do not have anything.”
The Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him and grant him peace) said, “Give something to her, even if only an iron ring.”
He said, “I do not have anything.”
So the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him and grant him peace) asked, “Do you know any portion of the Qur’an?”
He said, “Such-and-such.”
He said, “I have married her to you for what you know of the Qur’an.”
(Sahih al-Bukhari, no: 5141)

[juptVatoSoito]

Sahl ibn Sa’d (Allah be pleased with him) relates that a woman came to the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him and grant him peace) and offered herself to him [for marriage].
He said, “I do not have any need for women right now.”
A man said, “O Messenger of Allah, marry her to me!”
He asked, “Do you have anything [to give as dowry]?”
He replied, “I do not have anything.”
The Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him and grant him peace) said, “Give something to her, even if only an iron ring.”
He said, “I do not have anything.”
So the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him and grant him peace) asked, “Do you know any portion of the Qur’an?”
He said, “Such-and-such.”
He said, “I have married her to you for what you know of the Qur’an.”
(Sahih al-Bukhari, no: 5141)

Brother, what are you trying to prove? Are you saying that if you have nothing you should get married? We already have women who complain that their husbands or prospective husbands don't earn enough money, do you think they will accept any such marriage proposal?

[WaysletlyLene]

Brother, what are you trying to prove? Are you saying that if you have nothing you should get married? We already have women who complain that their husbands or prospective husbands don't earn enough money, do you think they will accept any such marriage proposal?

Women never stop complaining. do they?

[juptVatoSoito]

@ Abu Tamin, for sharing the above hadith.

@ ilm_seeker , your point is a very valid and realistic one within many households, especially those in UK.



I guess it's a case of brother/sisters & their parents getting their priorities right?

Sometimes, it might not be a case of priorities but mainly one of parents not having enough money to support their children through marriage or their children themselves not being financially ready. Its just the way the system works in the UK (and the West in general and increasingly in other parts of the world), people spend their childhood and early adult years in compusary education or persue higher education in the hope that the extra qualifications can land them a good job so as to be able to live a comfortable life, which doesn't necessarily mean they're materialistic, but just don't wan't any financial worries.

However, what might be a good idea is that everyone starts saving up for marriage as soon as they start earning money from a young age as much as they can afford to as some people may need to contribute their entire pay slip for the running of the house.

[juptVatoSoito]

If women know the man they're going to marry (by choice) doesn't earn too much money then they shouldn't complain, otherwise if the husband is too lazy then they might have a legitimate argument.

[WaysletlyLene]

even if u save money since childhood u wont be able to acheive anything as prices keep on going up n up. money loses its vale every day. u will be chasing shadows for ur whole life.
try to get my point. its not abt money its abt love and affections and understanding. ppl can live in less money where there are love nd kindness but cant live in deceit , no mattter how much money u may provide them

Sometimes, it might not be a case of priorities but mainly one of parents not having enough money to support their children through marriage or their children themselves not being financially ready. Its just the way the system works in the UK (and the West in general and increasingly in other parts of the world), people spend their childhood and early adult years in compusary education or persue higher education in the hope that the extra qualifications can land them a good job so as to be able to live a comfortable life, which doesn't necessarily mean they're materialistic, but just don't wan't any financial worries.

However, what might be a good idea is that everyone starts saving up for marriage as soon as they start earning money from a young age as much as they can afford to as some people may need to contribute their entire pay slip for the running of the house.

[Ornamiviant]

even if u save money since childhood u wont be able to acheive anything as prices keep on going up n up. money loses its vale every day. u will be chasing shadows for ur whole life.
try to get my point. its not abt money its abt love and affections and understanding. ppl can live in less money where there are love nd kindness but cant live in deceit , no mattter how much money u may provide them

Dude, the whole point is that a 15 year old hasn't got the money to feed his wife, who's talking about love and affection? Can you feed her that? How do you cook it?

And the point remains that most Muslims within the UK don't have a clue about marriage, how are they supposed to look after each other and their rights?

End of the day, the fatwa is pretty simple:

http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.a...=3122&CATE=202

It deals with finance, rights and what to do when you fear falling into sin. Just follow the fatwa, it doesn't take a genius

[juptVatoSoito]

even if u save money since childhood u wont be able to acheive anything as prices keep on going up n up. money loses its vale every day. u will be chasing shadows for ur whole life.
try to get my point. its not abt money its abt love and affections and understanding. ppl can live in less money where there are love nd kindness but cant live in deceit , no mattter how much money u may provide them

I'm not trying to make marriage out to be a wallet burning life experience where people live in large houses, drive flashy cars and wear the latest fashions, I'm talking about people having enough money to make life livable without feeling their only hope now is to resort to harram forms of income or harram loans. Yes its possible to love someone so much that you stick with them even if they (and you) become dirt poor beggars on the road- but that type of love takes years to grow and couples in their twenties in many cases judging by the times we live in will very likely bolt-either running back to their parent's house (in the case of girls) or demanding a divorce.

If you're in a decent financial position (again, I'm not talking about being filthy rich) and your family circumstances are sound enough and you're a mature person then yes I'd say get married young.

[HondasMenFox]

Brother, what are you trying to prove? Are you saying that if you have nothing you should get married? We already have women who complain that their husbands or prospective husbands don't earn enough money, do you think they will accept any such marriage proposal?

brother. I am trying to prove nothing. What I did was share a beautiful hadith of Nabi(saws) with ikhwan here. They can take home any message that they want. My basic premise in this thread is different. I believe that people are approaching the matter from a very pragmatic, practical and worldly point of view. But this is a matter to be approached from the taqwa point of view and if we are to break through the shackles of societal customs and financial problems and disobedience and whatever seems to plague us endlessly, then the only way is to follow the way of the Salaf. Please take a look at the masnoon nikah khutba of Huzur(saws) and the three Qur'anic verses quoted in it by him. The first deals with taqwa, the second deals with taqwa and the third deals with.......taqwa. Hope the direction from which I am approaching the issue is clearer now.
Wa salam.

[HondasMenFox]

Dude, the whole point is that a 15 year old hasn't got the money to feed his wife,

Well...he could wait till 20 before marrying then. Or his father could work harder to feed them. Did the Prophet(saws) not say that food for one is enough for two?

who's talking about love and affection?

Sometimes we underestimate our women grossly.

Can you feed her that? How do you cook it?

You need to read the lives of the Azwaj-e-Mutahharaat brother. And the life of Fatima(ra) bint Muhammad(saws). They('Ali & Fatima) had hardly two morsels to eat and felt sad if they could not get a guest to share their meagre meal, while we start counting our wifes' morsels before she even comes in our nikaah. And I am not going to bore you with the hadith about the Sahabi who took another to his house as a guest while they had food which was only enough for husband-wife.......we know the end result......

And the point remains that most Muslims within the UK don't have a clue about marriage, how are they supposed to look after each other and their rights?

That has to be an exaggeration. What is so difficult about looking after another human and giving his rights...except some extra ones.

End of the day, the fatwa is pretty simple:

http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.a...=3122&CATE=202

Fatwas are alright. We are trying to get to the root of the matter here.

It deals with finance, rights and what to do when you fear falling into sin. Just follow the fatwa, it doesn't take a genius

Sounds like an accountancy class.



Shukran.

[Ornamiviant]

Bro, I want you to know I am not against early marriages; I'm just practical.

Take the following example; a guy, goes to university, lives with his parents and 2 or 3 siblings. Shares a room, probably with a brother. Has no job. Will not have a job anytime soon. Mum doesn't work and dad can barely afford things as it is.

The following are the problems in this scenario:

1. The guy can't get married and bring his wifey home to sleep in the same room as his brother, can he?
2. He doesn't have the money to rent out a house seperately

Probably have other problems that I can't think of right now and too tired to try

If you want this thread to be of any use, please advise what should be done in the following scenario and give practical solutions