[replicaypu]

Where is the Book of Abraham if is reveled by Allah SWt where is it ?

I just told you. It is lost. It wasn't preserved. Now answer my questions:

Are you saying that there is mistake in the verse that? That there is a mistake in the Qur'an? Or that the Qur'an wasn't perfectly preserved?

[Klissineopar]

I just told you. It is lost. It wasn't preserved. Now answer my questions:

Are you saying that there is mistake in the verse that? That there is a mistake in the Qur'an? Or that the Qur'an wasn't perfectly preserved?

Brother Younes,


If I am telling you where is the Abraham's book and if you reply to me is lost.

What do you mean by lost ? why we have the Thora, Gospel and the Quran which were reveled by Allah SWT.

About the Quran there are a lot of thing which are strange to me, I have not finish my studies on it .........................

[replicaypu]

About the Quran there are a lot of thing which are strange to me, I have not finish my studies on it .........................

Do you believe that everything that is said in the Qur'an to be true? Do you believe that there are mistakes? Do you believe it all of it to be the Word of God, or do you believe that some parts were written by men? Do you think that it was perfectly preserved?

[Klissineopar]

Not all prophet came with law. But some selected ones came with law or Shariah. Jesus did not bring down a new complete set of shariah. He followed the shariah revealed to Musa (AS). The revealtion like Injil revealed to Isah (AS) does not necessarily mean a complete new set of law. It is as simple as that. They were are all messanger as they are renewing the same message of Islam (concept of pristine concept). You are using english translation and as such proving once again the weakness of the English lanuage as a whole.

Brother


You said in the previous post N° 23:


1) Rasul are equipped with set of code/ law.


Now you are saying :


2) Not all prophet came with law



What is right the 1 or 2

[Klissineopar]

You may have missunderstood my earlier comment or perhaps I did not phrase it correctly.
2. Not all prophet come down with Shariah (code law).
All prophets are nabi but not all nabi are rasul

Anyway, I see no point in continuing this course. Please learn shariah at the feet of a reputable seassoned qualified scholar. Untill then i see no use carrying on.
If you have any doubt please post your question to www.sunnipath.com, www.askimam.org

Brother Nomadic,


Thank you for the link, I will post my question.


I will explain you tommorow inshallah in more details the difference between prophets end messengers.


I have to go to sleep I had a long day at work.


Assalam aleykoum brother. and good night.

[en-druzhba]

Please read the essential belief of muslim and read the small section 'Messenger of Allah'
http://www.central-mosque.com/aqeeda...ialbeliefs.htm


Please try not to teach us the difference as we already have scholar who do this and do not accept unscholastic opinion based on literal reading.
There are brothers who clarified the issue Abrahim message in simple terms and yet you insist on your view by side tracking the subject. It is disingenous to adopt a stance based on ones relative unschastic reasoning. So far the only thing you have relied on is literal reading of Quranic translation. Islam is a scholastic relegion and as such your assumption holds no water. So far I have tried to explain best of my ability and it seems this is not sufficient.
Should you wish to challange the scholar, you are free to do so and no doubt your confusion will be made clear. Unless and untill you have studied shariah at the feet of a reputable scholar, we will not entertain anyone in complex and fundamentle matters of deen in a similar manner an A level student does not lecture the Professor in basics of mathematics.
This has been a wast of time with no benefit for me. So my last comment on this topic inshallah.
PEACE
Allahualalm

[n2Oddw8P]

^

This is what happens when the Hadith Rejecters get into their "study" of the Quran. They do not realize for example, that the Injil given to 'Isa (Alayhi Salaam) can in no way be the "New Testament" with us today, so based on this false premise, all sorts of baseless misgivings enter their mind.

[Klissineopar]

^

This is what happens when the Hadith Rejecters get into their "study" of the Quran. They do not realize for example, that the Injil given to 'Isa (Alayhi Salaam) can in no way be the "New Testament" with us today, so based on this false premise, all sorts of baseless misgivings enter their mind.

Assalam aleykoum brother


Why Allah SWT says that :

nglish Yusuf Ali: [4:47]
O ye People of the Book! believe in what We have (now) revealed, confirming what was (already) with you, before We change the face and fame of some (of you) beyond all recognition, and turn them hindwards, or curse them as We cursed the Sabbath-breakers, for the decision of Allah Must be carried out.

[Klissineopar]

Assalam Aleykoum sisters and brothers,




There is something I do not understand, why muslims they claim :

- That Allah SWT Abrogate the Thora

- That Allah SWT Abrogate the Gospel



But in many verses Allah SWT confirm them, how its possible.

[texprofi]

Assalam Aleykoum sisters and brothers,




There is something I do not understand, why muslims they claim :

- That Allah SWT Abrogate the Thora

- That Allah SWT Abrogate the Gospel



But in many verses Allah SWT confirm them, how its possible.

Dear brother,
Allah Taala has terminated their (earlier revelations') rulings in terms of abiding, i.e following, and whereever He mentioned them (earlier revelations) in Quran He meant to hold firm Belief (Faith/Iman) that those were revealed by Him. Therefore, all Muslims believe that Towrah, Injeel etc were revealed, but later the laws were abolished. Another point, Allah Taala has informed that this Quran - the final Revelation, testifies the earlier revelations, like Towrah and Injeel etc (one example Sura Al Imran, Verse: 03).
This discussion is long, and pls see Commentary of Quran.
InshaAllah if you read a Tafseer (Explanation) of the Quran with sincere heart, you will comprehend the meaning of Quran. Please read Mufti Afzal Elias's (this scholar is from South Africa) Quran Made Easy - sorry may be not the exact name.
Please note, the Translation of Quran does NOT tell you the complete meaning always, because the language of the Holy Quran is on the premise of Highest level Arabic Literature and many ornamental techniques are there. Even an Native Arab would not understand the meaning without Explanation of most of the verses only by reading those.
May Allah Taala provide you and us His Guidance!

[Klissineopar]

Dear brother,
Allah Taala has terminated their (earlier revelations') rulings in terms of abiding, i.e following, and whereever He mentioned them (earlier revelations) in Quran He meant to hold firm Belief (Faith/Iman) that those were revealed by Him. Therefore, all Muslims believe that Towrah, Injeel etc were revealed, but later the laws were abolished. Another point, Allah Taala has informed that this Quran - the final Revelation, testifies the earlier revelations, like Towrah and Injeel etc (one example Sura Al Imran, Verse: 03).
This discussion is long, and pls see Commentary of Quran.
InshaAllah if you read a Tafseer (Explanation) of the Quran with sincere heart, you will comprehend the meaning of Quran. Please read Mufti Afzal Elias's (this scholar is from South Africa) Quran Made Easy - sorry may be not the exact name.
Please note, the Translation of Quran does NOT tell you the complete meaning always, because the language of the Holy Quran is on the premise of Highest level Arabic Literature and many ornamental techniques are there. Even an Native Arab would not understand the meaning without Explanation of most of the verses only by reading those.
May Allah Taala provide you and us His Guidance!

Sister needIman,


Why Allah SWT is always is giving a revelation :

1) Thora

2) The gospel

3) The Quran


Why Allah SWT abrogate the previous Book ( Thora by the Gospel, Thora and Gospel By Thora ) How Allah SWT can make such mistakes, its like Allah SWt doesnt not know what he is doing.


Can you tell me Whay Allah SWt is asking the prophete Mohamed to ask Jews about the religion ?


Transliteration: [17:101]
Ve le kad ateyna musa tis'a ayatim beyyinatin fes'el benı israıle iz caehüm fe kale lehu fir'avnü innı le ezunnüke ya musa meshura

English Yusuf Ali: [17:101]
To Moses We did give Nine Clear Signs: As the Children of Israel: ( ASSAL OUM = ASK THEM ) when he came to them, Pharaoh said to him: "O Moses! I consider thee, indeed, to have been worked upon by sorcery!


If the prophete Mohamed SWT came with the last revelation abrogating the previous why is asking them because he had the Quran with him ?

[Klissineopar]

Sisters and brothers,



The Prophete Mohamed SWS came with nothing new, the Quran is only the remembrance of the differente Prophetes and messengers.

[TheDoctor]

Brother stephane, whilst u have been evangelising all morning and replying here and there i am still waiting for my reply from yesterday which u asked me to wait for since u were tired then. Having now evidently gained ure strength this morning can u please furnish me with an honest reply? Thank u

By the way if Quran came with nothing new, and u accept the quran to be true word of God please show me where in the previous books it says the following verse "muhammadur rasoolullallah" Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah".

If you cant then you are liar against God...

[Klissineopar]

Brother stephane, whilst u have been evangelising all morning and replying here and there i am still waiting for my reply from yesterday which u asked me to wait for since u were tired then. Having now evidently gained ure strength this morning can u please furnish me with an honest reply? Thank u

Assalam aleykoum brother blackflagsarfaraz,


English Yusuf Ali: [2:153]
O ye who believe! seek help with patient perseverance and prayer; for Allah is with those who patiently persevere.

[Klissineopar]

Brother stephane, whilst u have been evangelising all morning and replying here and there i am still waiting for my reply from yesterday which u asked me to wait for since u were tired then. Having now evidently gained ure strength this morning can u please furnish me with an honest reply? Thank u

By the way if Quran came with nothing new, and u accept the quran to be true word of God please show me where in the previous books it says the following verse "muhammadur rasoolullallah" Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah".

If you cant then you are liar against God...

Brother blackflagsarfaraz,


Why do you want to find in the Thora and the gospel :


Mohamed SWS is the Messenger of Allah SWT


Every one Jews, christians, Muslims have they way to worship Allah SWT, why do you want them to follow the prophete Mohamed SWs because is not mentioned in their book ?


See the verse bellow :


English Yusuf Ali: [5:48]
To thee We sent the Scripture in truth, confirming the scripture that came before it, and guarding it in safety: so judge between them by what Allah hath revealed, and follow not their vain desires, diverging from the Truth that hath come to thee. To each among you have we prescribed a law and an open way. If Allah had so willed, He would have made you a single people, but (His plan is) to test you in what He hath given you: so strive as in a race in all virtues. The goal of you all is to Allah; it is He that will show you the truth of the matters in which ye dispute;


Allah SWT is telling you = To each among you have we prescribed a law.


Why Allah SWT said the Monasteries, churches, synagogues are places where we pray Allah SWS :


English Yusuf Ali: [22:40]
(They are) those who have been expelled from their homes in defiance of right,- (for no cause) except that they say, "our Lord is Allah". Did not Allah check one set of people by means of another, there would surely have been pulled down monasteries, churches, synagogues, and mosques, in which the name of Allah is commemorated in abundant measure. Allah will certainly aid those who aid his (cause);- for verily Allah is full of Strength, Exalted in Might, (able to enforce His Will).


If Allah SWT send a new prophete, are you going to trust him and follow him ?

You will say not because is not mentioned in the Quran !!!!!


But you want Jews and christians to follow the prophete Mohamed which is not mentioned in their books, how its possible ?


Thank you by saing I am a Liar, but the scholars who have been lying to us for centuries you do not tell them they are liars ?

[Klissineopar]

Sisters and brothers,




English Yusuf Ali: [3:113]
Not all of them are alike: Of the People of the Book are a portion that stand (For the right): They rehearse the Signs of Allah all night long, and they prostrate themselves in adoration.

English Yusuf Ali: [3:114]
They believe in Allah and the Last Day; they enjoin what is right, and forbid what is wrong; and they hasten (in emulation) in (all) good works: They are in the ranks of the righteous.

English Yusuf Ali: [3:115]
Of the good that they do, nothing will be rejected of them; for Allah knoweth well those that do right.

[InvertPrete]

the religion of stephen2.

[TheDoctor]

Brother blackflagsarfaraz,


Why do you want to find in the Thora and the gospel :


Mohamed SWS is the Messenger of Allah SWT


Every one Jews, christians, Muslims have they way to worship Allah SWT, why do you want them to follow the prophete Mohamed SWs because is not mentioned in their book ?


See the verse bellow :


English Yusuf Ali: [5:48]
To thee We sent the Scripture in truth, confirming the scripture that came before it, and guarding it in safety: so judge between them by what Allah hath revealed, and follow not their vain desires, diverging from the Truth that hath come to thee. To each among you have we prescribed a law and an open way. If Allah had so willed, He would have made you a single people, but (His plan is) to test you in what He hath given you: so strive as in a race in all virtues. The goal of you all is to Allah; it is He that will show you the truth of the matters in which ye dispute;


Allah SWT is telling you = To each among you have we prescribed a law.


Why Allah SWT said the Monasteries, churches, synagogues are places where we pray Allah SWS :


English Yusuf Ali: [22:40]
(They are) those who have been expelled from their homes in defiance of right,- (for no cause) except that they say, "our Lord is Allah". Did not Allah check one set of people by means of another, there would surely have been pulled down monasteries, churches, synagogues, and mosques, in which the name of Allah is commemorated in abundant measure. Allah will certainly aid those who aid his (cause);- for verily Allah is full of Strength, Exalted in Might, (able to enforce His Will).


If Allah SWT send a new prophete, are you going to trust him and follow him ?

You will say not because is not mentioned in the Quran !!!!!


But you want Jews and christians to follow the prophete Mohamed which is not mentioned in their books, how its possible ?


Thank you by saing I am a Liar, but the scholars who have been lying to us for centuries you do not tell them they are liars ?

Stephane you are either being insincere to yourself or being insincere to us Muslims on this forum.
I know you dont believe in hadeeth but I think you dont believe in Quran too.

You said the Qur'an brought nothing new, that wasnt in the books of the People of the Book. I said thats not true. Then i gave you an example "Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah" and I said go find that verse from the books of the Ahle e Kitaab. You know you cant. Therefore it proves the Quran has brought something new and it also proves that you are lying and dont know what you are talking about.

Ok take this new example you have given me:

Every one Jews, christians, Muslims have they way to worship Allah SWT, why do you want them to follow the prophete Mohamed SWs because is not mentioned in their book ?

Again if you truly believe in the Quran and you are a Muslim then explain this:

Those We have given the Book recognize him as they recognize their own sons. Yet a group of them knowingly conceal the truth. (Surat al-Baqara, 146)


"Say: if you love Allâh, follow me and He will love you and forgive you your wrong actions." (3:31)

"Believe in Allâh and His Messenger, the unlettered Prophet who believes in Allâh and His words. Follow him, perhaps you will be guided." (7:157)

"No, by your Lord, they will not believe until they ask you (O Muhammad) to judge between them in what they disagree about and then they shall find in themselves no impediment touching your verdict, but shall surrender in full submission." (4:64)

In the Name of Allah, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful

Say: "Oh, you who disbelieve!
I do not worship that which you worship,
Nor do you worship That Which I worship.
Nor will I worship that which you have been worshipping,
Neither will you worship That Which I worship.
To you your religion and to me mine."



1 Those who reject (Truth), among the People of the Book and among the Polytheists, were not going to depart (from their ways) until there should come to them Clear Evidence,-
2 An apostle from Allah, rehearsing scriptures kept pure and holy:
3 Wherein are laws (or decrees) right and straight.
4 Nor did the People of the Book make schisms, until after there came to them Clear Evidence.
5 And they have been commanded no more than this: To worship Allah, offering Him sincere devotion, being true (in faith); to establish regular prayer; and to practise regular charity; and that is the Religion Right and Straight.
6 Those who reject (Truth), among the People of the Book and among the Polytheists, will be in Hell-Fire, to dwell therein (for aye). They are the worst of creatures.

Truly, the religion with Allah is Islam, And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him [3:85].

[TodeImmabbedo]

can the mods please delete all of stephane2's posts as a lot of them are kufr and if not kufr then they are very clearly gross deviances and lies that may cause others to be lead astray.

i have done my duty as a muslim to advise you. now it is up to the mods to fulfill their responsibilities to the forum by acting on it.

[InvertPrete]

can the mods please delete all of stephane2's posts as a lot of them are kufr and if not kufr then they are very clearly gross deviances and lies that may cause others to be lead astray.

i second this.