[effebrala]

the great debate.. or one of many.

i've actually been around the block a few times with this one, seen it from many different perspectives and ideologies. from the christian perspective, homosexuality is wrong because god had created man and all of his functions as a physical entity. i'm sure every one is familiar with the biblical passages that seem to state very strongly on gods supposed stance on the subject. i argued this for a very long time, i believed in it and it forced me to judge those people as 'wrong' or 'indecent' or at the very least, lost and confused. i always saw the law of christianity as being one of love, so even then i tried my best to walk the razor.

edgar cayce, as far as i know, did not seem to address the issue directly, though it may be in there. however, he was very clear on what our relationship to other people was supposed to be like and that is that every one was to be seen as an extension of yourself and god. the very sovereignty of their existence was the only basis for judging every one. in that every one was a part of god, they were to be treated like that. lovingly and without judgment. now these are my own words and my own concepts of what i have read and absorbed, others may correct me if i'm in error.

the ra material echo's cayce's material very closely from what i have seen. they both expand on the nature of existence, sin, justice, love, etc. in the very least, we are asexual as a spirit, we have no sex to speak of outside of these bodies. the nature of being a 'man' or a 'woman' is more in experiencing the common archetype traits that come from each one. they are polarities, but not opposites of our true spiritual nature. that, as well as the fact that we have spent many life times as either one seems to make the issue of homosexuality nothing more than a personal preference. i would have to dig through the ra study guide, but i believe it was addressed there and i think the conclusion that was drawn was simply that being spiritual beings in truth, it didn't really matter what preference you had, so long as you were doing so in truth.

the ra material goes on to explain that sexuality is more about exchanging energy than the biological counterpart of conception. it has to do with two people coming together to commune in lovemaking, each giving to the other, and in the end coming away refreshed with the new energy. again these are my words and concepts that i've come away with. reading through the material yourself will help you understand the concepts for yourself.

in the end i think homosexuality is a non issue, unless of course it's derived from something other than personal preference. if it's damaging or related to some sort of trauma, then that needs to be dealt with first so that the person is clear in the realization of their true motivations for their behavior.

i understand how you feel, i've felt that way too from time to time in my path. all i can say is meditate on it till you get a clearer understanding of what the issue is, you may discover why it seems to feel wrong. it may be for very different reasons than you think.

i hope this helps, and you have every right to agree or disagree.
may you walk in love and light.
errol.

[Sheefeadalfuh]

in the conversations with god books by neale donald walsch the message of god as being pure love - and further - that all is part of god - are brought to bear on this subject.

first, everything is literally part of god. so in truth there is no right or wrong - there is only love of others and love of self. this is a very liberating thought in terms of removing the many sexual taboos society burdens us with. just consider - god is in every bedroom and has experienced every experience.

as in all things, the only judgment is - does this act radiate the love of the creator? if the act is self-serving and controlling it is removing you further away from the nature of god. if the act is an act of exchange of loving energies it is bringing you closer to the nature of god.

so two people who share and radiate love are closer to god than someone else who judges them for it - regardless of all other circumstances and man-made societal taboos which are temporary and insignificant in the eyes of god.

elmer

[SiM7W2zi]

hi all,
i can't really give too much info, i'm at work and will make sure to check out my edgar cayce books for any info.

here's a link to a small blurb in the law of one outline with the proceeding quote:

http://www.divinecosmos.com/index.ph...=124&itemid=36

xii. homosexuality

ra: if an entity has had roughly 65% of its incarnations in the sexual/biological body complex of the opposite polarity to
its present body complex, this entity is vulnerable to infringement in your
urban areas and may become what you call homosexual. (b2, 35) the section also discusses energy transfers and i think would help anyone curious make sense of how the physical act of sex plays out on a spiritual level. definitely a discussion i think quite applicable to this topic.

[viiagrag]

homosexuality seems to be a big topic from the news to discussions at bars and especially school. in school they basically say it is genetic with a mix of personal enviroment and is kind of like a fetish. i tried yahooing edgar cayce to see if he had any thoughts about this subject i couldn't find it. although i do not judge people i am not a big fan of homosexuality. it just doesn't resonate with my heart anyone have any thoughts or opinions on this ?

hi, under. billybob here.

seems that once again i'm going back to the artesian well provided at llresearch.org. the following snippet is from "the law of one" book 2 session 31. checkout the full document as this barely touches the subject.

###

questioner: we have what seems to be an increasing number of entities incarnate here now who have what is called a homosexual orientation. could you explain and expand upon that concept?

ra: i am ra. entities of this condition experience a great deal of distortion due to the fact that they have experienced many incarnations as biological male and as biological female. this would not suggest what you call homosexuality in an active phase were it not for the difficult vibratory condition of your planetary sphere. there is what you may call great aura infringement among your crowded urban areas in your more populous countries, as you call portions of your planetary surface. under these conditions the confusions will occur.

questioner: why does density of population create these confusions?

ra: i am ra. the bisexual reproductive urge has as its goal, not only the simple reproductive function, but more especially the desire to serve others being awakened by this activity.

in an over-crowded situation where each mind/body/spirit complex is under constant bombardment from other-selves it is understandable that those who are especially sensitive would not feel the desire to be of service to otherselves. this would also increase the probability of a lack of desire or a blockage of the red ray reproductive energy.

in an uncrowded atmosphere this same entity would, through the stimulus of feeling the solitude about it, then have much more desire to seek out someone to whom it may be of service thus regularizing the sexual reproductive function.

questioner: roughly how many previous incarnations would a male entity in this incarnation have had to have had in the past as a female to have a highly homosexual orientation in this incarnation?

ra: i am ra. if an entity has had roughly 65% of its incarnations in the sexual/biological body complex, the opposite polarity to its present body complex, this entity is vulnerable to infringement of your urban areas and may perhaps become of what you call an homosexual nature.

snip

bestest, billiebobbie ... ( just kidding )

p.s. the accidental (?) introduction of estrogen-like chemical complexes into the environment is causing sexual confusion in the biological wiring and timing of developing entities -- such virtually unavoidable chemical micro timebombs has caused a procreative downside for many sensitive species in the animal kingdom all the way from insects to mankind. watch them there plastic containers and beware of deadly, handy-dandy microwaving!

[plaiskegizils]

the following snippet is from "the law of one" book 2 session 31.

the sentence that immediately follows the lines you quoted is interesting, too:

"it is to be noted at this juncture that although it is much more difficult, it is possible in this type of association for an entity to be of great service to another in fidelity and sincere green ray love of a nonsexual nature thus adjusting or lessening the distortions of its sexual impairment."

[SarSerceSaice]

wanderers ask jim and me concerning their homosexuality or bisexuality from time to time, especially since those of ra are not particularly understanding about the issue.
the ra feel that it comes about because of overcrowding and aura infringement on a gross level. this gives homosexuality- or bisexuality a sense of being wrong or at least lesser states than heterosexuality.
in this instance, i disagree with the brothers and sisters of sorrow. i feel that sexuality is sexuality. the person to whom we are attracted may be male or female, but the attraction mechanism is the same. if you are bisexual or homosexual in nature, i encourage you to honor that sexuality and feel good about it, and make the choices that will place you in faithful, committed, ethical and loving relationships in which sex is shared as a part of a much more complete sharing of the intimacy of the self, just as i would encourage you to do if you are a heterosexual being. (a wanderer’s handbook, ch 9. p. 268)

questioner: what is the function of homosexuality?

it is a difficulty of your language that we have trouble overcoming in that homosexuality is not understood as a type of sexuality, but is considered to be, in your language, a type of emotionally strong word.

those who are homosexual have had a personality difficulty, which drives them in a sexual way towards their own charge, much like a positive charge being attracted to a positive charge. this is due to confusion between incarnations, the previous incarnation being of one sex, this incarnation being of another.

but the function of homosexuality is the function of any type of sexuality: it is to enable a person to form an intense enough relationship that he may learn how to serve and how to love; to love others more than himself, or shall we say, to love others more than his personality, but as much as the creator. (carla channeling, july 18, 1976)

my own personal feelings on homosexuality is that it is just another form of sexuality. love can be shared equally between same sex relationships and opposite sex relationships. there is no wrong. the abuse of sexuality is the real issue. this truth resonates deeply with my heart.

to my: gay/lesbian/bisexual/straight/positive/negative/black/white/orange/purple/tall/short/plump/skinny/round/square/ friends on this forum. i love you all.

[Peabelilt]

i see both sides of it...while ra seems to state that homosexuality is somewhat an impairment and seems to hint towards the act of homosexual sex being a disservice, ra also states in many places that green ray unconditional love is more to be valued than any principality.

'the truth appeareth paradox' - lao tzu

i believe carla is displaying an admirable level of compassion and non-judgement towards those of a homosexual orientation in doing so honoring the creator and the primal distortion of free will. however, i feel those of ra would have a much clearer understanding than any in 3rd density of the underlying metaphysical energy transfers taking place in the physical act of sex, making ra's comments on the topic quite weighty and worthy of much consideration.

[effebrala]

the hard part about this all is simply that the word itself, as ra stated, has become one of emotional weight rather than just a word to describe a behavior.

it's hard to view your fellow human beings in a loving light if the instant you hear a word, your emotional side gets kicked into high gear. even i find this hard to deal with from time to time. there is often a sense of nagging discomfort and uneasiness towards the person. despite this i have known a few gays and lesbians, even ones with even greater sexual distortions. once you get past the discomfort you begin to see that they are just people too. they are people to be loved and given the right circumstances you could be in their shoes.

in the right frame of mind, one begins to realize that some where out there there is a dimension (since they are all infinitely possible) where some version of yourself is most likely gay or lesbian. there may be a dimension where gay and lesbian distortions are the norm instead of the distortion. the more you think about it, the more it seems that the notion of right and wrong are nothing more than attributes to the system of the dimension we are in right at the moment. it is all an apparent illusion, or more aptly a catalyst for growth.

in the end, we must all look at the big picture. in the fourth dimension we will have a unique view into the lives of people around us, we will know all each others good and bad sides from a now very personal view. we will no longer be able to look at some one and say 'how could you!' because we will know how they could, also every pain and sorrow that may have lead up to a decision and the very gravity of every faucet of their being. we will know this and begin to integrate it into ourselves. helping one another will not be a choice, we will have to deal with every one's dark side to progress as a unified group until the integration takes us all the way back to the source.

i like to try and see myself in the other persons shoes. if i can do that, often times its easier to offer compassion for them, despite what wrongs (as illusions) they have done. good grief i can go on can't i?

heres to having compassion for every one you meet. love and light all.

[SarSerceSaice]

in my initial post to this topic, i did so because something did not sit right with me with the tone of the thread. there seems to be a common theme in society to use words-the bible-to separate, devalue, or to make less than. although there may be some truth to ra’s words, the fact that he offered little to the topic says a lot about the importance he placed on this issue.

however, i feel those of ra would have a much clearer understanding than any in 3rd density of the underlying metaphysical energy transfers taking place in the physical act of sex, making ra's comments on the topic quite weighty and worthy of much consideration. my heart will always weigh more heavily than any words, comments, or perceptions. in using my own discernment, i spoke my own truth as having a gay brother who has had to face a society who views him as sexually perverted, less than, and immoral. one can use ra’s words and interpret them in whatever way they perceive, however, i cannot support it if i know it may hurt some or devalue others on this forum and in society. when we do this, we are no better than those who use the bible for this very purpose.

it's hard to view your fellow human beings in a loving light if the instant you hear a word, your emotional side gets kicked into high gear. even i find this hard to deal with from time to time. i think this is the heart of the matter. do we treat others differently because we dont understand or we have been programmed to believe a certain way or do we percieve them as an equal, a part of the one creator. the latter resonates in truth, for me.

[Peabelilt]

i agree cynlor2012. id also state that i feel people who are gay are not the only ones faced with a lot of difficulties/judgements in society, nor are they the only ones who sin. i dont judge gay people, treat them differently or look down on them. i see them as myself. i see myself as a person struggling with many things, and all though homosexuality isnt one of them on an individual level, i dont see the act of homosexuality better or worse than the same types of problems i deal with right now on a day to day basis.

i dont really know how i could acknowledge the fact that i believe ra's words had merit in a more gentle way, but i still stand behind my comments.

we are all loved infinitely regardless and i agree there is no right or wrong, and love is not forceful of anything or judgemental.

however i also believe there is such a thing as a spiritual ideal. an archetypal element in our mind if you will. i believe this is something we should strive towards if one has consciously chosen the path of service to others. i believe this will always involve a certain degree of self sacrifice. it is dependent on the individual how far they choose to tread this path in any incarnate experience. life is not an easy thing, we are all faced with similar choices regardless of our specific set of circumstances/issues.

we all have extreme challenges facing us, whether a person is gay or not does not change this. as it was said there is so much good in the worst of us and so much evil in the best of us, its pretty pointless to sit here pointing fingers or judging.

[gardenerextraordinaire]

i am kenneths149 a gay catholic retired teacher, who suffers the self cruelity of self judgment and pain increased by the judgment of certain society, social values and family disapproval. i am celibate and will be so for this life as i am unable to deal with any intimate relationship. any judgmnent on the issue is useless and to no avail. it is of no importance the cause of this. it is of no value to a preconceived conception of any kind to understand the depth and meaning of loving another. read "rumi" the gresat arab writer who loved a young man as himself! sadly it is the abuse of this love that is the great danger and judgment of in our present culture. it is a homophobic culture. it fears variety, diversity ,the union of energy that is wholeness, integvrsation of energies. even ra in it's discourse avoids the concept of integration of energy both energies male and female.! is ra homophobic? it matters that love is labelled perjoretively by the majority. who sets the norm? even ra has a part to play! seemily impartial is not stand at all to further truth and light on homosexaulity.

[plaiskegizils]

however, i feel those of ra would have a much clearer understanding than any in 3rd density of the underlying metaphysical energy transfers taking place in the physical act of sex, making ra's comments on the topic quite weighty and worthy of much consideration.

i agree.

i don't read ra's comments as judgmental towards gays, or towards anyone. as they state, "there are no mistakes."

but the discussion of homosexuality was in the context of a series of conversations about the energy transfers associated with "our sexual reproductive complex of actions". in that context, the magical and magnetic nature of polarized male/female interaction is posited as a path to the creator:
the bisexual knowing of the creator by itself has the potential for two advantages.

firstly, in the green-ray activated being there is the potential for a direct and simple analog of what you may call joy, the spiritual or metaphysical nature which exists in intelligent energy. this is a great aid to comprehension of a truer nature of beingness. the other potential advantage of bisexual reproductive acts is the possibility of a sacramental understanding or connection, shall we say, with the gateway to intelligent infinity, for with appropriate preparation, work in what you may call magic may be done and experiences of intelligent infinity may be had. ra does not say that it is not possible for homosexual entities to walk this path, at least as far as green ray (and green ray unconditional love is, after all, the lesson/goal of this density), and they also point out that people who are attracted to the same sex are often especially sensitive.

but it does seem that from ra's view of the energy transfers involved it is more difficult for two males or two females to generate the magical energy necessary to do indigo- or violet-ray work, just as it is more difficult for two positive poles or two negative poles of a magnet to generate attractive energy towards each other.

[sigrekatonov]

i used to have a problem with homosexual people. i was actually straight homophobic, but even then would never express something like that to a gay person directly. i'm very sensitive to energy, and a while after i had accepted it on the intellectual level, i was at my checkout, i felt a real love, and looked up, there were two gay people there. i thought that the love between them is real and not really much else matters.

i wonder if gayness is a blockage in the root chakra. i.e. our physical sex drive. that's what i took from ra's comment.

now i get genuinly angry when people express homophobic stuff. although i'm straight.

[lovespellszz]

[quote=kenneths149;23952]aproximately 10 % of the population on earth is homosexual.
_________________________
is that common knowledge or was that number derived from any particular study? could you name your source? how did they accurately determine such a thing in places like india africa and china, where the majority of people live? i didnt know the census data was that accurate in those countries.

[SeftyJokipl]

i just wanted to say that since i was young, my feeling has always been that if two people want to come together to generate positive feelings of love in the universe it doesn't matter to me if they're gay or not. i'd rather be sitting on the subway next to a happy, positive spirit than a negative one trying to live a life that feels alien to him/her. he or she is more likely to give me (or anyone else) a smile or a helping hand if he/she is in a happy, satisfying relationship than if they aren't. imo, that's what's most important.

jmo.

[gardenerextraordinaire]

i found the last posting in tune with the lesson of the heart to love. my failure to love has caused me great pain. for all the community of men i knew have died of aids. i no longer live in the " village ". i was assulted and moved out. my expereince as a celibate catholic has been painfull . i love st. francis because he loved the men who followed him in the truest sense of the heart not a gential expression of love. i love my brothers as much as possible knowing my predispositions. i am aware and sad. i keep my gential sexulaity well in charge. ( stress, urban life style, anti-depressants, prostrate medication and homophobia basicly offer chemical castration) . i am most disappointed and saddened by this life experience because i really don't know who i am as i have tried so much to hide and deny my sexuallity. being angry and chemically depressed has been wonderfull, no one can get in to love me. the endless need of the cavern of unfulfilled desires or the big hole of emptiness ( ejection of love ) can exist and frustrate all who truy to come near me. what a terible mess and yet i know it is a mess. i do need to walk in such a way that i am "aware " i am aware and it brings a deep compression and singulairity of consciousness. it is difficult yet i have chosen. as i mature the pain is more accute and the reality more clear compression , singluar thought direction not denial because i feel the sexual need as much as the desire for food. ... i don't really understand the karma i incuured other than the negative sense that i abused my sexuality or was abused by others. perhaps a combination of the two is the truth. the truth to set me free here is not easy. i cannot seem to look at it directly. i must use the shadow of saint francis to see the that loving as intensely as he did was okay and that it too carries with it the price the cost , the awareness. i don't know that that can be joyous . i am finding the paradox of some acceptance and some rejection. i want to respect myself and those who are around me , yet the rejection message is overwhelming. thus the strong activist position of the gay activist movements for equality and acceptance. i may become an activist especially against the public funding of catholic edcuation that fosters homophobia, discrimination and the murder of homosexuals. i am sorry if my thoughts are grim this morning. it is the reality i live in . the weather has been unusally warm here much in line with the planetary theories of david wilcock. i think the radiation of the whole planetary system is increasing the rate of awareness and thus karma is being accelerated with this new energy so this means it will be sad for a bit and then the growth though painful will result in a deeper underatnding of the concerns of truly loving another beyond genital sexual expression.

[IssuessBratte]

in attempting to address your issues, kenneth, i feel a certain sense of caution, because i don't want to come across as someone who thinks they understand what you are going through, because i don't.

the first thought is to attempt to draw some parallels between my perception of your experiences and my own. right off the bat this is difficult, because i am strictly heterosexual, although i have been 'guilty' of sexual excess in the past.

when my marriage to the mother of my four children ended several years ago, i determined at the time to not be bitter, and think and feel my way through any propensity to feel despair. it was a huge blow to the person i believed my self to be, and in order to live up to my promise to myself and my family to not be stunted emotionally by this experience, i had to re-examine everything i thought i was.

i discovered a great deal about my own preconceptions of how to live life; i became aware of much personal arrogance, rigidity and propensity to be in abridgement of the free will of my wife, and my kids. i realized i had tried to be the 'dictator' of my family, and as the man of the house believed i should have final say in how our children should be raised, and where and when my wife could work, etc.

now, much of this was a result of my own 'old world' upbringing (english) but it took the loss of the privilege of living with my boys and wife to learn that which i probably would have not learned any other way, in this lifetime. i came to be somewhat more evolved, spiritually, through this experience.

now, all this is not meant to draw a parallel to your life in particular, it's just to illustrate the fact that a greater good can come from the experience of major catalyst. i chose to not be a victim here, although it was hard; and feel a deep, real gratitude for the whole experience. i'm the better person for it.

anyway, after i was summarily turfed out, i got this little condo where i am now, and soon felt the crushing loneliness of coming home from work everyday to an empty house -- and this was entirely new to my experience. i had never lived alone before, and quite frankly hated it.

i soon discovered the solace of the neighbourhood pub, and regular social drinking became a way of life for the first time in my life. i was thankful for the company, and made many new friends. the drinking itself proved to loosen me up socially, as i had never been a good social mixer, and now i had lots of new friends who would all together raise a noisy, welcoming glass when i walked in the door.

now, i was a happy drunk, not a staggering drunk, not a loud or obnoxious drunk, but still a drunk. i was a popular drunk, and many sought out my confidence and friendship. i soon realized that i had come to associate drinking with fun, companionship, and women! i had been sexually 'deprived' for the last few years of my marriage, and let's say i felt a certain vindication.

not just with women, but with all the bar-based associations. i was popular, well liked, and felt much less lonely.

god, i was a lonely kid! i had felt a terrible ostracism as a child -- very, very different and strange. i was literally the smallest kid my age, sent to school with a bunch af canadian farm kids in an english school blazer by my folks, and had an english accent. all this on top of being 'from elsewhere', i feel, spiritually.

i was badly abused by some kids throughout grade school; in fact i realize now that i was very traumatized by it all.

anyway.

i still visit the bar, and realize that my fragile, wounded ego is still hurting. there is still some, to paraphrase ra, some 'experiencing all things desired' going on in my life, although with a continuation of learning of the futility of feeding the ego, i gradually replace these things with -- well, that which replaces these things!

having been acutely aware of the effect on my personality by my childhood experiences, i determine again not to be bitter, and have, by and large, not repressed my demons, but have given them free range in my life to catalyse me. this has been my excuse, and i'm sticking to it! (for now..)

sometimes not allowing your percieved dark side to find expression in your life can in effect represent catalyst ignored, resulting in a relentless build-up of pain and unrest. i'm not saying to drink yourself into oblivion -- i never drank to escape so much as to have it be a ticket into what i thought was missing in life (women, companionship, popularity and so on.)

sometimes we need to allow ourselves to embrace our shadows and let them come out to play -- and if our position or current paradigms in life is a percieved hindrance, or makes us feel not morally right, we may consider changing them to suit or arranging a balance of sorts so that various facets of our lives don't impinge negatively on each other.

acknowledge, embrace, thank and forgive your pre-dispositions; they represent the signposts on your personal road to becoming! allow them to manifest without guilt, and be damned what anyone else thinks.

and find how you can embrace yourself in the spirit of minding the free will of others...it's always possible!

love, mark

[IssuessBratte]

i've recently met a very young child, an unhappy child made to feel inferior and bad, left alone to try to make sense of the world while in the clutches of those who say, "you're stupid, you're a geek, nobody likes you, let's dunk you in the river and laugh while you cry".

a child who believes he is inferior, unable to gain acceptance by his peers, and who believes he is somehow stunted, terminally weird and deserving of the taunts and ridicule of other, bigger and more cool kids.

i encountered him lost and alone, left for an age alone under a bridge he had been thrown from, and gathered him in my arms, and held him close to my bosum and showed him a little, magical light i keep in my pocket; and in the light it cast, we could see together the faces of those who taunted him so, and were both surprised to see tears of unhappiness raining down the faces of the tormentors.

so i aimed the light a little lower, at the hearts of the bullies, and set my light to stun, and sent a beam of stunning love energy,...and forgiveness...into those hearts. the little child looked into my eyes, and smiled! and took the light from my hands, and held the beam steady, all by himself. as he did, his smile grew, as did he, and when he finally put the light into his pocket, he looked just like me.

and i smiled, and i felt a hand cup my face, and with a slight start, realized it was my own hand.

to err is human; to forgive, is to come back to present time.


divine! take care of yourself; be kind to you. others depend on that!

[gardenerextraordinaire]

dear mark, the courage , th ehonesty and directness of your sharing free me. thank you dear brother. i resonate with your truth and that more than anything comforts me deeply. it is like the warmth of a soft day a day covered in gentle fog the kind that england gets that makes for warmth and gentleness. such a gift mark . thank you sucha gift makes it worth the sorrow and pain. comfort in knowing i am not alone not lonely aware that i am part of true brotherhood of a family of beings thast care and treasure all experiences of all. choice pearls of wisdom more valuable that much fine gold. kenneths149

[MattJargin]

if we go with the notion commonly accepted in metaphysics that our circumstances of birth are not an accident and that we choose our families, genders, countries, and challenges to tackle within a certain lifetime, why is it that people who identify as homosexual would often incarnate in families in which the parents are fundamentalist christians and preach fire and brimstone? this happens so frequently. is there any evolutionary purpose in setting such a split into motion beforehand, as opposed to being born in a family accepting of a gay sexual orientation?

i am similarly curious about transsexuals. why not incarnate into the gender you feel most comfortable as, rather than as one you don't resonate with and spending your whole life feeling out of sync with it and trying brutal surgeries to try to change into the opposite gender?