[vasyasvc]

I have been re-reading this thread. Nobody ever paused to define "believe."

In my own case, I don't have "belief" so much as operating theory. That is, my ideas about reality seem to match my observations. Since I might be mistaken -- and I know I could be mistaken -- I don't think belief, per se, is part of my equation.

Jonathan Lobl

[JessicaLin]

No an atheist can not believe in god.

a·the·ist [ey-thee-ist]–noun

a person who denies or disbelieves the existence of a supreme being or beings.



To jonathanlobl.

We have a definition of belief...

be·lief [bi-leef]
–noun 1.something believed; an opinion or conviction: a belief that the earth is flat. 2.confidence in the truth or existence of something not immediately susceptible to rigorous proof: a statement unworthy of belief.

3.confidence; faith; trust: a child's belief in his parents.

4.a religious tenet or tenets; religious creed or faith: the Christian belief.

But I am curious does your 'operating theory' through your personal observations of the nature of reality/universe/whatever agree with the scientific methodology? ie.. do you see or 'know' things that would not be testable?

[PaulCameron]

... my ideas about reality seem to match my observations. Since I might be mistaken -- and I know I could be mistaken -- I don't think belief, per se, is part of my equation.

Jonathan Lobl

Hi Jonathan,

Good to see you. My philosophy is consistent with your statement above. My 'beliefs' are based upon what I see in nature and general everyday life. But, as I am capable of misinterpreting things I see I alway hold to the understanding that I could be wrong.

Peace & Love!

[weaddercaps]

No an atheist can not believe in god.


To jonathanlobl.


But I am curious does your 'operating theory' through your personal observations of the nature of reality/universe/whatever agree with the scientific methodology? ie.. do you see or 'know' things that would not be testable?

Since you asked -- I'm a reiki master. Past a certain point, reiki is not about technique, symbols, or "energy." There is a shift in the perception of reality. Real reiki is about piercing the vale of illusion and coming to terms with the unity behind all things. There is nothing testable here. Scientific methodology is not applicable.

I do not believe in a personal god. Even the idea of a personal god just seems silly to me on the face of things. My sense of underlying unity/one-ness? It's a working theory. I have my sense of things and I have my observations. I can make new observations. My sense of things can change. I have been mistaken in the past. I may be mistaken now.

It is good to be Agnostic. There is room for growth, development and change.

Jonatan Lobl

[myspacecoo]

Thank you, Jim Bob.

I'm a Pantheist. My favorite definition is, "God is One."

Jonathan Lobl

So does that mean that you see the supernatural in all natural things? Do you pray to them? Have you ever witnessed a supernatural event coming from nature? Do you believe in an afterlife?

[putza]

Hi Maxx,

Are those questions directed to me or to Jonathan?

As for me, I believe in Nature. Nothing operates outside its bounds, so no, there is no supernatural.

Peace & Love!

[GoblinGaga]

Hello Maxx:

I don't know what you mean by "supernatural." There is Unity. There is Duality. The Unity gives rise to Duality. Unity and Duality are indivisible.

I don't know what you mean by prayer. Focused intent? Maybe. It depends on how you define your terms. Requests for a favor? No. Prayer as I understand the word is not part of my life. Neither is worship.

Does that help?

Jonathan Lobl

[viawbambutt]

This thread has grown cold. The original question was -- "Can an Atheist believe in God?"

I would like to expand apon this question.



"Does it matter, if an Atheist -- or anybody else -- believes in God or not?"

Maybe God exists. Maybe God does not exist. Does it matter?

[Maydayvar]

This thread has grown cold. The original question was -- "Can an Atheist believe in God?"

I would like to expand apon this question.

"Does it matter, if an Atheist -- or anybody else -- believes in God or not?"

Maybe God exists. Maybe God does not exist. Does it matter?

For some I am sure it matters at least psychologically. For myself, no, it doesn't matter. I think that this is because I would still be the same person one way or another and would probably still think and act exactly as I do now.

[rasiasertew]

since the parameters changed,what would it matter what anyone believes,execpt to the individual?

so long as none are harmed,it shouldn't.

[Savviers]

since the parameters changed,what would it matter what anyone believes,execpt to the individual?

so long as none are harmed,it shouldn't.

The question raised here has nothing to do with belief. Does it matter, one way or another, if God exists -- or does not exist? Seriously, does it make a difference?

[blankostaroe]

The question raised here has nothing to do with belief. Does it matter, one way or another, if God exists -- or does not exist? Seriously, does it make a difference?

I guess it depends on what attributes one gives their god(s).

[layevymed]

I guess it depends on what attributes one gives their god(s).

I think attributes also misses the point. Any, all or none -- does it matter -- at all -- if God does or does not exist?

I'm trying to get to the invisible question behind the quetion. It is no longer -- "Does God exist?" The new question is -- "Does it matter if God exists?"

[Impariclainna]

I think attributes also misses the point. Any, all or none -- does it matter -- at all -- if God does or does not exist?

I'm trying to get to the invisible question behind the quetion. It is no longer -- "Does God exist?" The new question is -- "Does it matter if God exists?"

Hehehe. All I can do is repeat what I said above.

So, if you believe that your god answers your prayers then I would say it matters. However, if you believe that your god is a non-intervening god then it wouldn't matter.

For me it doesn't matter but then I don't believe there are any anyhow so even what I think doesn't matter.

I have always liked my little saying: Everything matters but nothing matters. That is, short term (my life span), everything matters; long term (millions of years) nothing matters.

[ddwayspd]

Hehehe. All I can do is repeat what I said above.

So, if you believe that your god answers your prayers then I would say it matters. However, if you believe that your god is a non-intervening god then it wouldn't matter.

For me it doesn't matter but then I don't believe there are any anyhow so even what I think doesn't matter.

I have always liked my little saying: Everything matters but nothing matters. That is, short term (my life span), everything matters; long term (millions of years) nothing matters.

Hmmmm. That does have the ring of truth to it.

[Pznrrmaf]

Hmmmm. That does have the ring of truth to it.

But we shouldn't put a big "T" on truth because it is nothing more than my opinion, and I have lots of those.

Yeah, I know, a Sage hold to no opinions, or so it is said. But then I have never claimed Sagehood so this too doesn't matter.

[E4qC1qQ5]

But we shouldn't put a big "T" on truth because it is nothing more than my opinion, and I have lots of those.

Yeah, I know, a Sage hold to no opinions, or so it is said. But then I have never claimed Sagehood so this too doesn't matter.

A man with enough wisdom, to know he isn't a sage?

[sniskelsowwef]

A man with enough wisdom, to know he isn't a sage?

I don't know if that could be well argued.

It is also hard to attain the state of knowing that you don't know.

[FEti0TUI]

I don't know if that could be well argued.

It is also hard to attain the state of knowing that you don't know.

I think we might already be there -- maybe.

[Necedofer]

I think we might already be there -- maybe.

Yeah, I do try. Funny though, I do have my opinions and understandings. I oftentimes express these in such a manner so that others feel an obligation to disagree with me and tell me that I am wrong.

How can my, or anyone else's, opinions and understandings be wrong? They are what they are. Sure, they might be inconsistent with physical reality but they are still what they are - opinions and understandings.

I am an Atheist as far as belief in divinities goes. This is an opinion based on my understandings. Does this mean that there are no civinities? Does this mean that no one else can believe in them? I think not.