[PharmACT]

Bishop Long's 'anointed' path to power at New Birth - CNN.com I didn't expect to see this on PS, but I just had to post it. There is no way in the world that a church with 25,000+ members, can't think for themselves. Way too often in black churches, the congregation let's the pastor get away with murder, because they're under the delusion that somehow, he or she can save them. Maybe it's time for sheep to learn to choose there own path.

Reminds me of the incident with the Haggert dude. Usually when someone goes out of their way to condemn something, they might be guilty of it.

[yQvpyNt3]

I didn't expect to see this on PS, but I just had to post it. There is no way in the world that a church with 25,000+ members, can't think for themselves. Way too often in black churches, the congregation let's the pastor get away with murder, because they're under the delusion that somehow, he or she can save them. Maybe it's time for sheep to learn to choose there own path.

Reminds me of the incident with the Haggert dude. Usually when someone goes out of their way to condemn something, they might be guilty of it.

I like the comment someone posted: "Idolatry posing as Christianity."

[agrismhig]

I like the comment someone posted: "Idolatry posing as Christianity."

I wonder if all the attention and money, went to his head and after that it was a wrap! When people treat you like you're infalliable, you'll start believing it.

[jinnamys]

I have often wondered about these one church denominations led by a charismatic pastor. Frequently the pastor has parlayed his calling into a very posh life style while the congregation remains poor. In the book A Hope in the Unseen, the pastor of a D.C. church was driving around in a Rolls and spending times in his sermon laying a guilt trip on poor people about giving money to the church. One wonders why they fell for him. Clearly, he was filling some need they had but were they blind to what he was doing with a lot of their money?

[robstamps]

I have often wondered about these one church denominations led by a charismatic pastor. Frequently the pastor has parlayed his calling into a very posh life style while the congregation remains poor. In the book A Hope in the Unseen, the pastor of a D.C. church was driving around in a Rolls and spending times in his sermon laying a guilt trip on poor people about giving money to the church. One wonders why they fell for him. Clearly, he was filling some need they had but were they blind to what he was doing with a lot of their money?

A shame. As much as many Catholics wonder why we need a Vatican, this is why. Now, if the leadership at the Vatican is weak, that's a different story. But what you won't see in the Catholic church is a priest driving a Rolls.

[vipBrooriErok]

A shame. As much as many Catholics wonder why we need a Vatican, this is why. Now, if the leadership at the Vatican is weak, that's a different story. But what you won't see in the Catholic church is a priest driving a Rolls.

No, but the church can and does do equally insultuing things with our money. They're just more discrete about it, because, you know, what do they have to fear?

[dafodilkemmy]

No, but the church can and does do equally insultuing things with our money. They're just more discrete about it, because, you know, what do they have to fear?

Well, it depends on the fund. If your parish takes a collection for a mission run by nuns to help feed and educate an African village, you can bet those nuns aren't spending that money on anything but the African village. If the money is going to the Archdiocese, you run into "administrative costs". Although the Catholic Standard and Times published the ADP's annual budget for the past year down to the dollar with where the money goes and I don't remember reading anything out of the ordinary (you had education, aid, etc). I'm no fan of the AD because too often it comes off sounding more like a business than a source of Christ (that doesn't apply to individual parishes or missions). But I can only criticize based on what I know.

[VIAGRA-VIAGRA]

Well, it depends on the fund. If your parish takes a collection for a mission run by nuns to help feed and educate an African village, you can bet those nuns aren't spending that money on anything but the African village. If the money is going to the Archdiocese, you run into "administrative costs". Although the Catholic Standard and Times published the ADP's annual budget for the past year down to the dollar with where the money goes and I don't remember reading anything out of the ordinary (you had education, aid, etc). I'm no fan of the AD because too often it comes off sounding more like a business than a source of Christ (that doesn't apply to individual parishes or missions). But I can only criticize based on what I know.

Right, parishes generally use their donations for legitimate purposes. It's the Archdiocese itself that's the problem, and I don't trust anything the Catholic Standard & Times says on the matter; they're basically an AD PR outfit, so it's not like they're ever going to publicly oppose them on anything.

There was a really good independent piece published by the National Catholic Reporter some years back. I'll have to see if I can find it. It painstakingly detailed the numerous ways Bevilaqua pissed away millions on trivial, overly ostentatious and / or incredibly self-serving things (like his own residence).

[legal-advicer]

A shame. As much as many Catholics wonder why we need a Vatican, this is why. Now, if the leadership at the Vatican is weak, that's a different story. But what you won't see in the Catholic church is a priest driving a Rolls.

Priests and nuns might take a vow of poverty, but doesn't the Pope live in a palace?

[sciectotacype17]

I have often wondered about these one church denominations led by a charismatic pastor. Frequently the pastor has parlayed his calling into a very posh life style while the congregation remains poor. In the book A Hope in the Unseen, the pastor of a D.C. church was driving around in a Rolls and spending times in his sermon laying a guilt trip on poor people about giving money to the church. One wonders why they fell for him. Clearly, he was filling some need they had but were they blind to what he was doing with a lot of their money?

My dad's a baptist deacon and I would always get into debates with him about why pastors get paid so much and have a tendency to flant their wealth. His only reply would be, "They have to make money too, right,?" I didn't agree. Don't know much about other groups, but too often, black people are too caught up in a lively service and a charismatic preacher, to question certain things within the church. You have to remember that some of these people are from a generation where you never question a man of God and unfortunately, it seems that younger generations are falling in line. It's amazing to me, because a church like the one that Bishop Long preaches at, must have a nice number of educated members, but they obviously say nothing. Then again, there are a number of educated people in the world that believe in the divinity of Christ. Why I don't know.

[seooptiman]

Priests and nuns might take a vow of poverty, but doesn't the Pope live in a palace?

He does. As a practicing Catholic, I no doubt agree with you. But the pope's human and human's have always been and always will be corrupted by power. I know priests who laugh at the hypocrisy of the pope's palace. But I don't worship the pope, nor do I know the guy. Those things are between himself and God.

[kubekniekubek]

The vow of poverty, as I understand it, relates to limits on one's personal possessions and wealth. I guess since the pope lives in luxury but does not actually own anything, the vow is honored.

[yWleIJm4]

I think the Vatican COVERED UP more corruption then stop it...

After all they believe in Absolution.

[Lorionasodi]

When I was young, the parish priest rode around in a new Buick. My father would always laugh and say he was glad his weekly envelopes were allowing the priest to drive a better car than he had. But my Dad gave every week, I think because he grew up in a Catholic orphanage and had a feeling of obligation to the church.

I, on the other hand, wouldn't give them a nickel!

[weaddercaps]

When I was young, the parish priest rode around in a new Buick.

When I was young, our parish priest used to cruise around town in a Caddy, smoking a big stogie. I thought it was only the nuns (but, of course) who take a vow of poverty.

Ya know, with all the scandals and coverups, I'm really glad my sister and I, when sent by ourselves to church with the donation envelope, would often skip mass and buy candy with the intended $1 offering. And back then, a dollar bought a hell of a lot of candy.

[Kthzltje]

When I was young, our parish priest used to cruise around town in a Caddy, smoking a big stogie. I thought it was only the nuns (but, of course) who take a vow of poverty.

Ya know, with all the scandals and coverups, I'm really glad my sister and I, when sent by ourselves to church with the donation envelope, would often skip mass and buy candy with the intended $1 offering. And back then, a dollar bought a hell of a lot of candy.

I've never seen a priest in anything nicer than a Honda Accord, if they drive at all. I guess there's an exception to every rule. If my pastor starts driving around in a Cadillac, I'll give him an earful and send my weekly contribution to a neighboring parish or the poor box.

[katetomson]

He does. As a practicing Catholic, I no doubt agree with you. But the pope's human and human's have always been and always will be corrupted by power. I know priests who laugh at the hypocrisy of the pope's palace. But I don't worship the pope, nor do I know the guy. Those things are between himself and God.

It's true that Catholics don't worship the pope, but I always feel uneasy when I see people kissing his ring. Reminds me of The Godfather. I personally, think that it's time for some sort of revolution, in the Catholic Church. They need to rethink some of their positions, when it comes to birth-control and priests getting married. Oh...and I wouldn't mind seeing some female priests. If they don't change there tune, they'll see the membership numbers dropping even more.

[st01en_lox]

It's true that Catholics don't worship the pope, but I always feel uneasy when I see people kissing his ring. Reminds me of The Godfather. I personally, think that it's time for some sort of revolution, in the Catholic Church. They need to rethink some of their positions, when it comes to birth-control and priests getting married. Oh...and I wouldn't mind seeing some female priests. If they don't change there tune, they'll see the membership numbers dropping even more.

Women should be allowed to be ordained, no doubt. I don't think priests should be allowed to marry for very practical reasons, particularly given the church's stance on birth control. If every priest is raising 5+ kids, that's a hell of a lot more money needed to keep a parish afloat. Or you can make priests provide for their families independently meaning they have to find a full time job. That's terrible for the strength of the church. Right now, the parish is a priest's family. He will show up to a hospital at 2AM to sit by a dying patient if alerted. He'll act as essentially a free psycologist to anyone who stops in just to clear their mind. I know these are not the reasons why priests were originally forbidden from marriage, but they are the reality in today's world.

[LypeReexy]

lol, You make it sound like Priest are rabbits.

But yeah if its a problem, change the church's stance on birth control!


I always found it amusing how people who "control" their sexual desires know anything about birth control.

[mudozvonf]

Women should be allowed to be ordained, no doubt. I don't think priests should be allowed to marry for very practical reasons, particularly given the church's stance on birth control. If every priest is raising 5+ kids, that's a hell of a lot more money needed to keep a parish afloat. Or you can make priests provide for their families independently meaning they have to find a full time job. That's terrible for the strength of the church. Right now, the parish is a priest's family. He will show up to a hospital at 2AM to sit by a dying patient if alerted. He'll act as essentially a free psycologist to anyone who stops in just to clear their mind. I know these are not the reasons why priests were originally forbidden from marriage, but they are the reality in today's world.

I've heard that argument before, when it comes to Catholic priest getting married. The Catholic's position on birth control can be amended, I don't recall any verse in the bible that states that the representatives of God have to be unmarried. It does say though, that you should be fruitful and multiply, so if a priest did have a high number of children, the parish would just have to do what it can. Not to mention the fact that the Catholic Church is rich and I'm sure that if some of the higher members of the Church could do without so much finery, that they could do alot more with what they have. Baptist preachers usually have jobs and they're still expected to show up, whenever a member of their church has some type of crisis. Also, like another poster mentioned, I find it kind of odd that someone is going to counsel someone else about marriage, when they've never had the pleasure. It's like a virgin, trying to give a couple tips on sex.