[MipRippoomamn]

agreed... wasnt it in the craigslist thread I made about a person who bred "two pitbulls because I have pitbull experience and need money for tuition"

never in my post did i say i was breeding for money since that is not one of my motivations. i live comfortably and could care less about the money.

[netamargr]

actually i am very familiar with that line of thinking and i agree. in fact, the only real dogman that ive known never registered any of his dogs and back when they used to fight dogs around here the winners came from his yard.

i did not create this thread to rub it in anyones face, i am not a petty person and i have no time for things like that. i just hoped to learn something new.

i appreciate you wishing me well, thanks.

Well ask your dogman friend if he bred all his stud and brood stock just because.
Even the winners threw a lot of crap that I hope was culled, sometimes the entire yard was culled.

[WumibBesowe]

actually if i am wrong about my male dog and he turns out to NOT live up to his potential then i wont breed him and i will seek out a better dog. as for doing everyone a favor and not becoming another BYB, i feel that im already doing that.

---------- Post added at 09:34 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:33 PM ----------



i also said that he will be a good conformation standard "for those interested in that sort of thing". looks dont mean much to me.

Like Lilliana said, you have no interest in showing the dog (in any sort of venue), so how exactly are you planning on "proving" the dog?

I mean, I originally thought about using my Border Collie as a stud dog when I had the money to put into herding him. The plan was IF I could get him to trial at a high level, I would let him stud. Once I realized I did not have the money to train him to that high a level, I had him neutered. He has an AMAZING working pedigree, but unless a border collie is working at an "open" level, they do not deserve to breed. If I wanted to, he could be an AKC herding champion, but those aren't real working dogs, and I refuse to dual-register him with them, since they're destroying the heart of the breed.

Since you have no plans to do any sort of "proving" activity with your dog, how exactly are you going to determine him breed-worthy?

[QualityReachOut]

The same way every other backyard breeder does. If it's pretty, and a nice dog, it's breed worthy.

[MipRippoomamn]

This says it all right here for me. And yes, I did read your post. I'm here to clarify.
HOW are you going to prove your dogs worthy if you don't work them in a testable arena? What exactly are you breeding for?



This breed is already being kept alive (barely) by people FAR more experienced than you with dogs FAR more proven than yours.

Please do us all a favor and don't breed. You're mind's already set on it, but I really hope you change it.

how much weight a dog can pull or how obedient it is are interesting but not of prime importance to me. and the entire showdog scene just doesnt interest me. i agree that this breed is being kept alive by people more experienced than i am and probably with better dogs. however, i am looking to join their ranks and do what i can to keep the true APBt alive.

---------- Post added at 09:45 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:44 PM ----------

Like Lilliana said, you have no interest in showing the dog (in any sort of venue), so how exactly are you planning on "proving" the dog?

I mean, I originally thought about using my Border Collie as a stud dog when I had the money to put into herding him. The plan was IF I could get him to trial at a high level, I would let him stud. Once I realized I did not have the money to train him to that high a level, I had him neutered. He has an AMAZING working pedigree, but unless a border collie is working at an "open" level, they do not deserve to breed. If I wanted to, he could be an AKC herding champion, but those aren't real working dogs, and I refuse to dual-register him with them, since they're destroying the heart of the breed.

Since you have no plans to do any sort of "proving" activity with your dog, how exactly are you going to determine him breed-worthy?

i think my idea of breed worthy and your might differ a little.

[WumibBesowe]

how much weight a dog can pull or how obedient it is are interesting but not of prime importance to me. and the entire showdog scene just doesnt interest me. i agree that this breed is being kept alive by people more experienced than i am and probably with better dogs. however, i am looking to join their ranks and do what i can to keep the true APBt alive.

---------- Post added at 09:45 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:44 PM ----------



i think my idea of breed worthy and your might differ a little.

Yes, your idea is, "well, the dog seems to conform to the breed standard looks-wise." Mine isn't.

[MipRippoomamn]

The same way every other backyard breeder does. If it's pretty, and a nice dog, it's breed worthy.

i think ive said numerous times that im not going to be breeding for looks. but to clarify.....im not breeding for looks. im breeding for the traits i feel to be that of a TRUE APBT.

---------- Post added at 09:49 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:47 PM ----------

Yes, your idea is, "well, the dog seems to conform to the breed standard looks-wise." Mine isn't.

i also said im not breeding for looks. in fact, thats probably the last time ill say it again lol.

[molaunterbizone]

Find a mentor, stick around with them, learn as much as possible, and when the time is right, they will help point you in the right direction. It takes years of getting educated on the breed, breeding standards, etc. and hands on work with someone who knows what they are doing before just jumping in and calling one's self a breeder, if one wants to be an excellent breeder.

[gooseCile]

how much weight a dog can pull or how obedient it is are interesting but not of prime importance to me. and the entire showdog scene just doesnt interest me. i agree that this breed is being kept alive by people more experienced than i am and probably with better dogs. however, i am looking to join their ranks and do what i can to keep the true APBt alive. I'm still trying to figure out how you're going to prove your dog worthy.....
Obedience titles show mental soundness, and while not true to original standard, pulls can demonstrate drive as well as physical soundness. Participating in pulls also requires health screenings (which you have not stated you will be doing). Showing your dog shows that your dog is a good physical specimen and of correct type. While type may not be important to some people and can be abused in many breeds, I feel the APBT shows have remained true to form.
Some breeders choose to breed for catch dogs, and test their stock that way.
None of these arenas are the only ways to prove your dogs, but many feel they are good ways to not only keep your dogs mentally and physically healthy but also make sure you're breeding what you want to be breeding.
PROVE to us that you will PROVE your dogs, but until then, no one here will take you seriously.

[MipRippoomamn]

Well ask your dogman friend if he bred all his stud and brood stock just because.
Even the winners threw a lot of crap that I hope was culled, sometimes the entire yard was culled.

unfortunately that man is no longer around to give me any advice. i do have quite a bit of his knowledge since i was always interested in bulldogs even as a kid. if he was still alive i wouldnt be on here asking people i dont know for advice. and yes, he culled quite a few of his dogs. in fact, he would cull almost all of them for different reasons and only sold the very best he had. his reasoning was "i dont want any dogs to lose and trace it back to my yard." he bred his dogs soley for the purpose of fighting them.

[rasiasertew]

I'm still trying to figure out how you're going to prove your dog worthy.....
Obedience titles show mental soundness, and while not true to original standard, pulls can demonstrate drive as well as physical soundness. Participating in pulls also requires health screenings (which you have not stated you will be doing). Showing your dog shows that your dog is a good physical specimen and of correct type. While type may not be important to some people and can be abused in many breeds, I feel the APBT shows have remained true to form.
Some breeders choose to breed for catch dogs, and test their stock that way.
None of these arenas are the only ways to prove your dogs, but many feel they are good ways to not only keep your dogs mentally and physically healthy but also make sure you're breeding what you want to be breeding.
PROVE to us that you will PROVE your dogs, but until then, no one here will take you seriously.

I agree! How are you gong to prove that your dogs are worthy of breeding?

[EvaQWmrm]

You should come to the PA show this weekend. I could introduce you to some fantastic dogmen and women who you could learn a great deal from. I know I have.

[MipRippoomamn]

I'm still trying to figure out how you're going to prove your dog worthy.....
Obedience titles show mental soundness, and while not true to original standard, pulls can demonstrate drive as well as physical soundness. Participating in pulls also requires health screenings (which you have not stated you will be doing). Showing your dog shows that your dog is a good physical specimen and of correct type. While type may not be important to some people and can be abused in many breeds, I feel the APBT shows have remained true to form.
Some breeders choose to breed for catch dogs, and test their stock that way.
None of these arenas are the only ways to prove your dogs, but many feel they are good ways to not only keep your dogs mentally and physically healthy but also make sure you're breeding what you want to be breeding.
PROVE to us that you will PROVE your dogs, but until then, no one here will take you seriously.

all of those shows prove everything about your dog but you can also prove such things to yourself or to the people youll be placing puppies with without ever taking them to a show. when my male is old enough i will train him in weight pulling amongst other things but even if he had the potential to one day become champion i wouldnt take him to a show. also, all of my animals get the very best health care. that includes health screenings and regular vet check ups. lastly, im not here to impress anyone so im not interested if anyone takes me seriously. i joined the forums to share my knowledge and hopefully learn something from others. if someone doesnt want to take me seriously, thats up to them.

[rasiasertew]

If you are so interested in "keeping the breed alive" then you need to be taken seriously otherwise your are just another piece of shit BYB.

[molaunterbizone]

If what we know or what we say does not matter, then why come to us in the first place?

If you are going to do it anyway, and do it any way you wish, which really you can they are your dogs, your property, then why even ask us? Just do what you are going to do.

[gooseCile]

all of those shows prove everything about your dog but you can also prove such things to yourself or to the people youll be placing puppies with without ever taking them to a show. when my male is old enough i will train him in weight pulling amongst other things but even if he had the potential to one day become champion i wouldnt take him to a show. also, all of my animals get the very best health care. that includes health screenings and regular vet check ups. lastly, im not here to impress anyone so im not interested if anyone takes me seriously. i joined the forums to share my knowledge and hopefully learn something from others. if someone doesnt want to take me seriously, thats up to them.

So you're not going to prove your dogs. You're going to breed them based on what you THINK is ok. You say you want to learn but you're close minded. Open your eyes and see you're sounding no better than the dude next door with a 'red nose' and a 'blue razorback gator mouffed' who wants to breed and doesn't give a crap what anyone else thinks.
I don't care if you don't like shows, or you don't want your dogs to be a champion anything. I care that you are going to be bringing into this world unproven dogs to do.... what? WHAT are your dogs going to be contributing that the other THOUSANDS of pet quality dogs in shelters and running the streets don't already have? A pedigree? Whoopdeedee!
Take that pedigree and DO something with it.

[Doctor-CTAC]

If you really want to be a breeder.. better think twice on this..

If what we know or what we say does not matter, then why come to us in the first place?

If you are going to do it anyway, and do it any way you wish, which really you can they are your dogs, your property, then why even ask us? Just do what you are going to do.

Amen to that!

[MipRippoomamn]

You should come to the PA show this weekend. I could introduce you to some fantastic dogmen and women who you could learn a great deal from. I know I have.

normally i would take you up on that offer but this weekend is bad. i work basically every night this time of year and my wife is out of town. so between work and taking care of my house/pets i have no free time this weekend. ive actually been to a couple local dog shows but never anywhere else.

---------- Post added at 10:20 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:12 PM ----------

So you're not going to prove your dogs. You're going to breed them based on what you THINK is ok. You say you want to learn but you're close minded. Open your eyes and see you're sounding no better than the dude next door with a 'red nose' and a 'blue razorback gator mouffed' who wants to breed and doesn't give a crap what anyone else thinks.
I don't care if you don't like shows, or you don't want your dogs to be a champion anything. I care that you are going to be bringing into this world unproven dogs to do.... what? WHAT are your dogs going to be contributing that the other THOUSANDS of pet quality dogs in shelters and running the streets don't already have? A pedigree? Whoopdeedee!
Take that pedigree and DO something with it.

i will be doing something with my dogs i just dont care to show them. ive never understood why people obsess with showing their dogs, thats just not my style. like ive said, i will work my dogs and ill definitely have them trained in weight pulling but i have no interest in taking them to shows and having them work at a show.

[Rememavotscam]

normally i would take you up on that offer but this weekend is bad. i work basically every night this time of year and my wife is out of town. so between work and taking care of my house/pets i have no free time this weekend. ive actually been to a couple local dog shows but never anywhere else.

I hope you are ready for a 24/7 additional job because puppies sound fun until they happen. You also better hope that female takes care of her puppies and/or doesnt end up physically unable to care for them. Also as of 3 weeks be ready to be changing the ENTIRE breeding room twice daily, feeding, watering, separating. I just had to separate 7 week old puppies due to aggression but around 5 weeks seems to not be abnormal.

[MipRippoomamn]

If what we know or what we say does not matter, then why come to us in the first place?

If you are going to do it anyway, and do it any way you wish, which really you can they are your dogs, your property, then why even ask us? Just do what you are going to do.

i came here because i thought there might be an experienced breeder available that would be willing to part with some knowledge on the actual breeding process and anything else i might need to know when the time comes. i dont recall saying that what you say does not matter.