[Greapyjeory]

Why does it matter what faith the loonies are?

Duh.....because the Muslim loonies are the ones wanting to blow your ass up.

Now, go have a latte and have a nice evening.

[Metrujectiktus]

Duh.....because the Muslim loonies are the ones wanting to blow your ass up.

Now, go have a latte and have a nice evening.

But coffee keeps me up and I'm cranky if I don't get enough sleep.




I suspect that there are a lot of loonies kept off planes as it is now. All I'm saying is that we should use our security systems to keep all the loonies off the planes. It doesn't matter to me what the belief system is of the person that blows up the plane I'm on. I'd just prefer that they be prevented from doing so. I think that we can do just that without having to resort to some "he looks Muslim" strategy.

[lymnCymment]

In some ways we can never do what the Israelis do......they have one major airport....we have hundreds of major airports. So our cost of implementing either technology or human security is prohibitive.

But I do think that we can take some methods and policy ideas. I've been through security at Ben Gurion and personally didn't see profiling as a bad thing. I wasn't set aside, but my Chinese traveling companion was. I was asked more questions than the usual airport, but then let though. My co-worker was led away and reported that they simply asked him more detailed questions in a private room. It took about 30 minutes. When you are profiled in an airport, you are asked more questions and perhaps your belongings are searched. It's not like being arrested, charged, brutalized or humiliated.

Airport security should be able to act on a complaint, or as little as a suspicion or a hunch. Sometimes they will be wrong, but of course, given the stakes, it is rational to err on the side of caution. For the sake of public safety, we have all lost some liberty at the airport......the racial or ethnic proportion of screening will absolutely not be balanced or equitable, but then neither has the racial or ethnic makeup of previous hijackers/bombers. Security screening is just not something that can be 100%, so they're dealing with odds for successful prevention......and the odds are that an Arab-looking person is both more likely to be screened, but also more likely to be a terrorist.

[Lgcjqxlw]

In some ways we can never do what the Israelis do......they have one major airport....we have hundreds of major airports. So our cost of implementing either technology or human security is prohibitive.

But I do think that we can take some methods and policy ideas. I've been through security at Ben Gurion and personally didn't see profiling as a bad thing. I wasn't set aside, but my Chinese traveling companion was. I was asked more questions than the usual airport, but then let though. My co-worker was led away and reported that they simply asked him more detailed questions in a private room. It took about 30 minutes. When you are profiled in an airport, you are asked more questions and perhaps your belongings are searched. It's not like being arrested, charged, brutalized or humiliated.

Airport security should be able to act on a complaint, or as little as a suspicion or a hunch. Sometimes they will be wrong, but of course, given the stakes, it is rational to err on the side of caution. For the sake of public safety, we have all lost some liberty at the airport......the racial or ethnic proportion of screening will absolutely not be balanced or equitable, but then neither has the racial or ethnic makeup of previous hijackers/bombers. Security screening is just not something that can be 100%, so they're dealing with odds for successful prevention......and the odds are that an Arab-looking person is both more likely to be screened, but also more likely to be a terrorist.

What Israelis do with their airport security is based on the certainty of life and death. They do it because they know they are totally surrounded by those that would destroy them without hesitation. The United States must get on the same playing field or suffer the consequences.

I have been inconvenienced, embarrassed and aggravated before in airports in this country and abroad.

Muslims can just get over it, IMO. They should began to get riled that their fellow Muslims have caused them such grief or shut the hell up about it if they're all so innocent of a world wide movement to either turn all it's inhabitants into Muslims or kill us.

[varrozans]

In some ways we can never do what the Israelis do......they have one major airport....we have hundreds of major airports. So our cost of implementing either technology or human security is prohibitive.

But I do think that we can take some methods and policy ideas. I've been through security at Ben Gurion and personally didn't see profiling as a bad thing. I wasn't set aside, but my Chinese traveling companion was. I was asked more questions than the usual airport, but then let though. My co-worker was led away and reported that they simply asked him more detailed questions in a private room. It took about 30 minutes. When you are profiled in an airport, you are asked more questions and perhaps your belongings are searched. It's not like being arrested, charged, brutalized or humiliated.

Airport security should be able to act on a complaint, or as little as a suspicion or a hunch. Sometimes they will be wrong, but of course, given the stakes, it is rational to err on the side of caution. For the sake of public safety, we have all lost some liberty at the airport......the racial or ethnic proportion of screening will absolutely not be balanced or equitable, but then neither has the racial or ethnic makeup of previous hijackers/bombers. Security screening is just not something that can be 100%, so they're dealing with odds for successful prevention......and the odds are that an Arab-looking person is both more likely to be screened, but also more likely to be a terrorist.

Well said, and I agree with everything except your first statement. I think we could do it like the Israelis.
A few more questions by better trained people who know what to look for would go a long way. And the Israelis don't just do it at their own airport.
This practice alone would have stopped the Christmas bomber.

[Filling25]

Well said, and I agree with everything except your first statement. I think we could do it like the Israelis.
A few more questions by better trained people who know what to look for would go a long way. And the Israelis don't just do it at their own airport.
This practice alone would have stopped the Christmas bomber.

I'm with you, I'm all in for better trained people working for our security at airports!

Unhappily I don't believe that many governments are able or willing to provide the funds and resources needed for it and so the whole spin about new technical tools like body scanners, just will be used to hide the fact that the government/airlines/airports underperform in the human factor of security and don't/can't pay for it!

I mean, the last time I went to Japan, they had all the hardware and legal assets to detect possible wrongdoers (drug/explosive dogs sniffing at passagers/lugguage, fingerprints/photos taken like in the US and so on..), but when they picked me out for inspection (due to my age and so probably for drug smuggeling? me?), I faced an officer unable to truely communicate with me, so imho it was a waste of time!

Somehow I guess the female custom/immigration officer, asking me just a couple of questions in perfect German at the Dubai airport, got a clearer picture about me, than the little Jap inspecting my lugguage for 30 minutes!

[Almolfuncomma]

It should be left to the airline owners, no? If a private airline wants to only allow KKK members to fly on their planes, so be it.

[avdddcxnelkaxz]

It should be left to the airline owners, no? If a private airline wants to only allow KKK members to fly on their planes, so be it.

No, that wouldn't work. How many downed airliners would it take for people to be able to identify the safest company to go with? Too many.
When it comes to public safety the govt always has to play a role.

[Pipindula]

No, that wouldn't work. How many downed airliners would it take for people to be able to identify the safest company to go with? Too many.
When it comes to public safety the govt always has to play a role.

Totally. I think we should have a few TSA workers in your house giving you and your family pat-downs. But only if you ever have guests at your house.

[exchpaypalgold]

Totally. I think we should have a few TSA workers in your house giving you and your family pat-downs. But only if you ever have guests at your house.

Silly comment.

Next!

[obHQNsY2]

Silly comment.

Next!

How many ruined house parties would it take for people to be able to identify the safest party host to go with? Too many.

[effebrala]

Yep. Profiling people who look Arab would have stopped the Christmas "bomber."

[FailiaFelay]

Interestingly, this was written 3yrs ago.....probably many times since 9/11. The question now becomes, 'how many attacks will the US endue before the US institutes a zero tolerance policy against Muslims?


By Jeff Jacoby, Globe Columnist | August 23, 2006

THE SAFEST airline in the world, it is widely agreed, is El Al, Israel's national carrier. The safest airport is Ben Gurion International, in Tel Aviv. No El Al plane has been attacked by terrorists in more than three decades, and no flight leaving Ben Gurion has ever been hijacked. So when US aviation intensified its focus on security after 9/11, it seemed a good bet that the experience of travelers in American airports would increasingly come to resemble that of travelers flying out of Tel Aviv.

Of course most Muslims are not violent jihadis, but all violent jihadis are Muslim. ``This nation," President Bush has said, ``is at war with Islamic fascists." How much longer will we tolerate an aviation security system that pretends, for reasons of political correctness, not to know that?

What Israeli security could teach us - The Boston Globe

I have read of all these measures, but I don't see them solving anything in the long run. The Israelies are still hated by the Palestinians and neighboring Arabs, so anything short of fixing that is not any kind of a solution.

Me? I say "in the interest of US national security, if you are from any enemy state, you are instantly denied access to any American flight originating in any place and you are further denied access to this country". That is a serious measure that speaks more to the rest of the world about getting involved, particularly enemy states - like Yeman, and solving this problem at the local level.

[gopsbousperie]

Yep. Profiling people who look Arab would have stopped the Christmas "bomber."

Asking him a few more questions and taking a closer look at his situation probably would have. A young male travelling alone on a one way ticket with no luggage should have prompted some closer scrutiny. It certainly would have on El Al.

[rojettafoxx]

Asking him a few more questions and taking a closer look at his situation probably would have. A young male travelling alone on a one way ticket with no luggage should have prompted some closer scrutiny. It certainly would have on El Al.

So why are you being so socialist in your recommendations? Can't someone operate a business without having the feds walking all over their private property 24/7?

People should have no government guarantee of flying. Because of this, they should also have no guarantee of exceptional security for the purposes of flying. It is both expensive for the taxpayers and sometimes unjust for the property owners. Frankly, if you don't like the security, then you don't fly on that plane! I don't get a free bodyguard when I get in a taxi, do I? What about when I go to a restaurant? All of these serve the public and they do not come with forced government bodyguards.

[russianstallian]

Asking him a few more questions and taking a closer look at his situation probably would have. A young male travelling alone on a one way ticket with no luggage should have prompted some closer scrutiny. It certainly would have on El Al.

Except he purchased a round trip ticket.

Key dates surrounding the Christmas Day attack - KansasCity.com

[stuck_in_WA]

So why are you being so socialist in your recommendations? Can't someone operate a business without having the feds walking all over their private property 24/7?

People should have no government guarantee of flying. Because of this, they should also have no guarantee of exceptional security for the purposes of flying. It is both expensive for the taxpayers and sometimes unjust for the property owners. Frankly, if you don't like the security, then you don't fly on that plane! I don't get a free bodyguard when I get in a taxi, do I? What about when I go to a restaurant? All of these serve the public and they do not come with forced government bodyguards.

There is nothing socialist about govt regulation. All goods and services have to meet regulations. They are like laws, and law enforcement is the responsibility of govt.

I like the fact that I can go to the supermarket and buy food that meets a certain standard and is unlikely to make me sick. Same goes for resturant meals and all other goods and services. They are only as safe as regulation and enforcement requires them to be.

[StitlyDute]

The original claims are misleading. El Al has been subjected to many terrorist attacks and shootings. Most of the time they aren't successfully getting to the airplane itself (since the 1960's), but the terrorists are shooting people at ticket counters. By contrast most American-based airlines have not had people shot at ticket counters.

El Al - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

By contrast, Southwest airlines has never had a terrorist attack.

[irrascaft]

Yep. Profiling people who look Arab would have stopped the Christmas "bomber."

It's not as simple as that. Profiling includes more than how a person looks.

Nation of origin, nation of birth, stamps on passport, stated purpose of trip, whether or not they are on a watchlist based on their father telling authorities that his son is dangerous, etc.

More than that it's psychological profiling. Observing physical mannerisms and watching the way people respond to questions as much as what their answers are.

I was detained one time for extra questioning simply because I had a Jordanian stamp on my passport from a self-guided weekend trip. If I had not offered a reasonable explanation for it or acted all nervous I fully expect that they would have done further questioning/checking. And If I was from Saudi Arabia or Yemen instead of the United states, they probably would have had a few more questions for me.

It's not base racial discrimination, it's being rationally discriminatory towards a collection of suspicious flags (based on previous incidents) of which gender and race are a part.

[Ayyfjicg]

There is nothing socialist about govt regulation. All goods and services have to meet regulations. They are like laws, and law enforcement is the responsibility of govt.

Right, and it's illegal for you to kill your guests. So, why are you against having a few government agents staying at your home and searching you and your family (and/or your guests) when you get home?
I like the fact that I can go to the supermarket and buy food that meets a certain standard and is unlikely to make me sick. Same goes for resturant meals and all other goods and services. They are only as safe as regulation and enforcement requires them to be. I think you're relying on the government way too much. If the restaurant gives you bad food, they won't have many customers left. This is why two restaurants can have different food and service qualities, charge different amounts, and still operate within government regulations.