[Jeaxatoem]

It's a farce when people speak of this election demonstrating that Americans are not prejudiced. If, as I hope, Obama is elected, it will hardly vindicate this backward, prejudiced country. Anti-Islamic sentiment among Christians, Jews and other groups is alive and well. People constantly discuss that Obama is "secretly a Muslim"! While that's not true, so what if he were? Is it a crime to be a Muslim in this supposedly free country? Did Emma Lazarus intend to exclude Muslims from the "huddled masses" who allegedly are welcome here?

When Palin and McCain speak of Obama associating with terrorists, I believe that they're focusing less on Ayers than on trying to conjure up fear regarding Barack Hussein Obama.

The media should come down hard on the anti-Islamic sentiment that pervades this country, but it does not. If someone made comments about other ethnic groups, his or her career would be over, but it's seemingly acceptable when such vitriol is directed at Muslims.

Do you recall when even in our most enlightened city, the public rallied against an Arabic public school in Brooklyn? If people spoke openly against a Jewish school, an African academy or a Latino school, they would be villified and rightly so.

Do you recall the controversey a few years ago when a Muslim who was elected to Congress from Minnesota sought to swear an oath upon the Koran rather than the Bible? Those who opposed this should have been instantly chided as prejudiced, but they were not.

I find this all disturbing.

[jstizzle]

Well put londonlawyer, I agree completely.

[Dastyh]

Thanks, Derek.

I have thought this for a long time but was really offended this morning while listening to a report on NPR regarding rural voters' mistrust of Obama. The things that they said about Islam were egregious.

[UJRonald]

Question is this: What can we do to stop this? It seems that many people in this country has no idea about the fundamental principle of Islam. Many people don't realise that Islam is the 2nd largest religion in the world. And there are some experts who believe it can surpass Christianity by this century. Many people don't know that Arabs make up a small population of Muslims, and most Muslims are of Southeastern Asian origin ( Indonesia has the largest Muslim population in the world.) Even more scary, many people don't even realise that Muslims, Christians, and Jews, all pray and worship to the same God. I find this ignorance appalling.

[marcusdexz]

Thanks, Derek.

I have thought this for a long time but was really offended this morning while listening to a report on NPR regarding rural voters' mistrust of Obama. The things that they said about Islam were egregious.

A dumb voter, is a dangerous voter. I believe in everyones right to vote, but if someone has NO idea of the issues and what the hell is going on in the world, They're better of doing this country a service and STAY THE HELL HOME!!! Sad thing is, both major parties need these voters in order to stay in office.

[U2DnBGFE]

What you're experiencing now are the views of an extreme group magnified by their control of the Republican Party, and especially now during an national election.

In reality, many studies over the years have shown that prejudice against Muslims is relatively low in the US compared to other countries.



http://pewglobal.org/reports/display.php?ReportID=262

Muslim Americans: Middle Class and Mostly Mainstream

Think about the narrative against Muslims in the US. It's hardly ever about Muslim-Americans; it's usually foreign Muslims infiltrating the US. Even attempts to portray Obama as a Muslim involve characterizing him as a foreigner.

Presidential elections in the US are very close; 10% is a blowout. One state decided the last two elections. So the bigotry of a group can tip a state, and deliver ALL of its electoral votes, thus amplifying its effects.

[Kiariitf]

And when the crazy-a$$ lady at the MCCain rally called Obama an Arab and McCain said, "no he's not... he's a fine person... he's... etc."

Certainly Mccain was in a tight spot, was rattled, did his best and can't be blamed, but the response was cringe inducing.

[Nurfzerne]

McCain ran a backwards campaign. Instead of solidifying his core (Party) support during the primaries and then moving toward the middle during the general election, he went into the RNC convention still needing to convince the base in order to win the election.

So you get Palin and the morons at his rallies front and center. Voters tuning in for the first time say, "What the hell is this?" And McCain is stuck with them.

During October, there's been an across-the-board movement from McCain to Obama - even the RURAL vote.

During the first three weeks of October, the University of Kentucky commissioned a survey of 13 rural counties in New Hampshire, Pennsylvania, Ohio, Michigan, Wisconsin, Iowa, Minnesota, Missouri, Florida, Virginia, Colorado, New Mexico and Nevada.




Fundamentalists get leverage because of the structure of the Electoral College. All states except Maine and Nebraska are winner take all. But even the assignment of the number of electors to a state isn't strictly proportional.

Take California and Montana, which get 55 and 3 EV respectively. That seems fair until you factor in state populations. Montana gets 1 EV for every 320,000, while California gets 1 for every 660,000.

Also, moderate Republican voices from CA, IL and NY are never heard, because the Party knows those states will go Democratic.

[stunnyravytal]

....

In reality, many studies over the years have shown that prejudice against Muslims is relatively low in the US compared to other countries....

That's true. I have seen articles regarding that. Nevertheless, the press does not castigate the minority of people who make these claims. As I noted, if people made comments like that against Jews or black people, there would be hell to pay. The same does not hold true with respect to negative comments about Muslims (or for that matter gay people).

[Konidurase]

It's obvious that the majority of the MSM want Obama to win the election.

Islam is a hot-button election issue. I figured that for a period of time after 09/11, Muslim-Americans were just going to have to ride out the hysteria. If it wasn't for Bush and the neocons, it would have subsided by now. There aren't as many Muslims in America as African and Jewish Americans to form a significant voting block, so it's been ignored during a long election cycle.

Just another reason to strip power from the social-conservatives.

[oplapofffe]

Human nature. We are, by in large, a pack animal that has a very strong link between our visual cues and the way we associate things.

Our evolution has made it so that we can group things together that LOOK like something and be able to make a decision that would have, in times past, told us not to go play with the Bengal Tiger even though we had never seen one before.

BUT, add in society and our own egos and we forget about this. We deny our propensity for this, and other basic instincts, and are puzzled when they come out in ways that still fit the mold, but no longer serve the same purpose they were intended.

So now we stick a bunch of people in contact with each other, whether it be like we have here in NYC, people literally on top of each other but still forming little clusters of comfort (Chinatown, Little Italy, Indian Row, Korean Alley), or ones who only know of others through the media and through the internet.

We get these illogical instinctual groupings of people that claim that all "Arabs" are bad because they have lumped All of Islam together. It is easier for their minds to avoid all of a certain class they do not have to deal with on a daily basis than to break it down further to get to the actual association.

This "instinct" runs so deep that they are ready to criticize a man for being "muslim" and still criticize him for having an angry BAPTIST minister he went to for 20 years. Logic be damned!


I think the only key here is to acknowledge our own weakness and try and find a way around it. As much as many women decry being treated like "objects" and bemoan the difference in treatment between the sexes, an attractive woman showing her bottom can get people to buy anything from the magazine they are on to a hamburger, to a set of golf clubs.

Do not get me wrong. I am not advocating this behavior, or lauding our own primitive instincts. But accepting this as a behavior that, on a societal level, will always have to be dealt with is the only way to change things. Denying this, refusing to accept our own nature of doing this kind of thing will never yeild a solution.

[Doctorpills]

To be fair, the Obama campaign hasn't been too chummy with muslim Americans -- not wanting to feed the fear of wary voters.

Politico 6/18/08
Two Muslim women at Barack Obama’s rally in Detroit on Monday were barred from sitting behind the podium by campaign volunteers seeking to prevent the women’s headscarves from appearing in photographs or on television with the candidate.

The campaign has apologized to the women, both Obama supporters who said they felt betrayed by their treatment at the rally.

“This is of course not the policy of the campaign. It is offensive and counter to Obama’s commitment to bring Americans together and simply not the kind of campaign we run,” said Obama spokesman Bill Burton. “We sincerely apologize for the behavior of these volunteers.” It's sad to say, but Obama may even have won some voters with this small fiasco.

Meanwhile, al Qaeda endorses McCain (who claims the terrorists fear him -- that's why they are trying to damage him with the endorsement).

Londonlawyer, the acceptance of anti-islam is so prevalent that in some circles one's lack of it is nearly an indictment of anti-semitism.

I remember an instance where I was talking politics and mentioned Ron Paul who was immediately accused of being anti-semitic because of his opposition to, and use of codewords such as "neocons" and "the Federal Reserve." As a sardonic response I said, "well, he doesn't want the military to keep killing middle eastern muslims, -- I guess he must be."

This mistaken underlying assumption depicting Israel's geopolitical struggles within a theological framework is, I fear, quite widespread and the primary reason for the toleration of anti-muslim sentiment.

[Qutlsilh]

To be fair, the Obama campaign hasn't been too chummy with muslim Americans -- not wanting to feed the fear of wary voters....
Londonlawyer, the acceptance of anti-islam is so prevalent that in some circles one's lack of it is nearly an indictment of anti-semitism....

I agree with everything that you said. Obama was forced to act in a reprehensible way toward those Muslim women.

Moreover, as you correctly note, in some circles, sympathy for Muslims is construed as anti-Semetism. This is one fu...cked up country.

[Si8jy8HN]

I think we have a few too many Hatfields.

[MikeGotTalentz]

Do you know that muslims are humans like all the world ?!!! not devils or angels

[Indidockobeni]

Open the book and read Londonlawyer maybe you will learn something.Islam is far from a religion of peace...It happens to be a political ideology masked as a religion.


http://bigpeace.com/smandel/2010/12/...s-battle-plan/

[mikapoq]

This bump (oh no, another anti-Islam crusader) brought to my attention this thread and I agree with many points made. Thanks for this contribution, LL.

Oh and don't bother with the above link, it's one of those right-wing-crazy sites where you get a big ad for Anne Coulter and something about Hillary wanting a global gun ban. LOL.

[Hrennilasi]

You actually clicked on a link from a drive-by poster?

SP is probably a web spider MTG! Always be careful of the SpiderBots, some sites have nasties that can do a number on your machine.....

[Jorcelirl]

I'm a curious guy.

But that's why I use a good firewall and little snitch

[Styparty]

Web spiders can't register or post, especially something so specific to this forum as addressing one member.

Remember the flood of porn links we used to get? They were posted by Bots. The user-id's were random letters to guarantee no duplicates; they posted the exact same thing on any open forum. That's been eliminated by registration that requires human interface.

SilentPete is a real person; however, his mind may be programmed.

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I have all scripting disabled initially, and only allow it after I determine the site is OK.