[Vobomei]

Dear Effie,

I didn't mean to sound harsh, or to pick on Greece. As I said in my post, the same could be said of virtually all Christian countries and religious groups (except for the Anabaptist who never killed anyone). I only mentioned Greece because it was Greeks making the boast about pluralism. Thus, I meant my comment to be more ironic than condemning!

****

But about the question of pluralism raised by someone else...

I mentioned Emperor St. Theodosius' persecution of the pagans as an example of the beginning of Christian persecution. By way of contrast, however, his predecessor, Emperor St. Constantine the Great, in his Edict of Milan, declared all religions legal. It's actually a very enlightened document, and a fine example of pluralism and the importance of property rights. Unfortunately, the edict was later effectively reversed by Theodosius. (Of course, St. Constantine wasn't averse to killing his own wife and son, among others.)

But if you want to go to the earliest case for pluralism, I would suggest reading the New Testament, where the only sword Christians are allowed to use against the pagans is the double edged sword of the Word (Hebrews 4:12-13). The only instance of a disciple of Christ using force against another, so far as I know, was when Peter tried to protect Jesus with his sword, and was soundly rebuked for it (Matthew 26:51; Mark 14:47; Luke 22:50; John 18:10).

-Shawn

[SypeKifef]

There is an article in the wikipedia on this (usual caveats apply, but it looks interesting). It seems to support the idea (as in Paul's original post) that the harmony of state and Church was a major part of its symbolism. Sorry for the garbled version I posted earlier.

[acceraStoof]

Dear Effie,

I didn't mean to sound harsh, or to pick on Greece. As I said in my post, the same could be said of virtually all Christian countries and religious groups (except for the Anabaptist who never killed anyone). I only mentioned Greece because it was Greeks making the boast about pluralism. Thus, I meant my comment to be more ironic than condemning!

****



-Shawn

That's OK Shawn. I always refer to Greece because I use my own personal experience as examples of what I am trying to say. If I lived in another country I would use that country to illustrate my arguments. I can get a bit tiresome always referring to Greece, but I would be dishonest if I started going on about things I haven't personally experienced.

Peace in Christ

Effie

[Asianunta]

I think the Roman eagle became double-headed in Constantinople, possibly in reference to the geographical situation of the city, bridging East and West; though I have read that this motif also occurs earlier in Middle-Eastern mythology (I can't remember where or with what significance). It was then adopted by the "Holy Roman Empire" (hence the Habsburgs) and by the Ottomans, as well as of course by the Tsars. All of these claimed in some sense to be the heirs of Constantinople.

Yep! That's the true meaning about the double headed eagle. And also what Paul said.

On a funny note: I read from some American-tourist-guy's accounts that when he went to that area of the world and saw the double headed eagle said: "Why would some people have on their flags something that looks as a result of exposure to radiation caused by nuclear explosion?"

[Charryith]

The double-headed eagle has just stepped out of Oxford University's Bodleian Library and is looking this way and that to work out from where the sound of the call to prayer is coming.