[majestictwelve]

Love boat? No, 'a hate boat' - NYPOST.com Now they want to describe the boats as "hate boats" that were being used to bring in weapons. The ships were checked and no weapons were found. I don't even have a problem with Israel checking ships to make sure that no weapons or bomb making materials are found, but this hate rhetoric just has to stop. It seems like it's a tactic that the Israeli government uses to get the support of the people. Reminds me of times when black people use the topic of slavery to suite their purposes. Of course it happened, but how much are you going to bring up the past to get what you want now?

Can anyone answer why exactly America is such a strong supporter of Israel? I was thinking because it's one of the few democratic nations in that region. But there has to be something more.

[enurneAcourdy]

Hell we did NOTHING when they attacked the USS Liberty, why should this be any different?
Just israel trampling human rights with our tax dollars.

[gMUVgw71]

Now they want to describe the boats as "hate boats" that were being used to bring in weapons. The ships were checked and no weapons were found. I don't even have a problem with Israel checking ships to make sure that no weapons or bomb making materials are found, but this hate rhetoric just has to stop. It seems like it's a tactic that the Israeli government uses to get the support of the people. Reminds me of times when black people use the topic of slavery to suite their purposes. Of course it happened, but how much are you going to bring up the past to get what you want now?

Can anyone answer why exactly America is such a strong supporter of Israel? I was thinking because it's one of the few democratic nations in that region. But there has to be something more.

Top 50 countries by Jewish population Rank↓ Country↓ Jews↓ % Jewish↓ % of all Jews↓
1 United States (2008)[1] 6,489,000 2.2% 45%
2 Israel (2008) [2] 5,569,200 75.5% 37%
3 France 490,561 0.8% 4.2%
4 Canada 393,660 1.2% 3.0%
5 United Kingdom 350,000 0.5% 2.3%

[curcercanty]

FOXNews.com - French Judge Says Turkish Charity Behind Gaza Flotilla Had Terror Ties

Oops, guess it's not so cut-and-dried as some would want us to believe.

I come down in the middle on this one....while I think the embargo of the Gaza is heavy-handed and overreaching, it's pretty clear the folks in the flotilla were seeking confrontation. Well, they got one. I have little sympathy for people who seek confrontation to make a point, then complain when they get exactly what they ask for.

Beyond all that, can we agree the IDF's mission was poorly conceived and executed? That was a pretty stupid approach, guaranteed to escalate into violence and create an international incident that puts Israel's allies in a position that's tough to defend. Really dumb. It's interesting that the IDF has managed to badly bungle so many missions in the past few years.

[kasandrasikl]

Do the Israelis know what the word "discretion" means?

[ephennaCypota]

Israel should ask NCIS to give them back Ziva David.

[lrtoinbert]

Beyond all that, can we agree the IDF's mission was poorly conceived and executed? That was a pretty stupid approach, guaranteed to escalate into violence and create an international incident that puts Israel's allies in a position that's tough to defend. Really dumb. It's interesting that the IDF has managed to badly bungle so many missions in the past few years.

Definitely.

[Ekrbcbvh]

A bit excessive I would say...

Do the Israelis know what the word "discretion" means?

A U.S. citizen who lived in Turkey is among the nine people killed when Israeli commandos stormed a Turkish aid ship heading for the Gaza Strip, officials said today. The victim was identified as Furkan Dogan, 19, a Turkish-American. A forensic report said he was shot at close range, with four bullets in his head and one in his chest, according to the Anatolian news agency

American Furkan Dogan Killed on Gaza Aid Flotilla - ABC News

[gMUVgw71]

How dare the IDF give these humans any food or clothing.

[Ekrbcbvh]

I come down in the middle on this one....while I think the embargo of the Gaza is heavy-handed and overreaching, it's pretty clear the folks in the flotilla were seeking confrontation. Well, they got one. I have little sympathy for people who seek confrontation to make a point, then complain when they get exactly what they ask for.

I would say the commando's were seeking confrontation guns a blazing against an international contingent in international waters. I don't see anything to be in the middle about. The blockade is the issue not the so called "terrorist" flotilla. The Netanyahu reactionary gov't is defending an illegal blockade which you yourself admit is "heavy handed" and "overreaching"..one that precludes delivery of cement, coriander, and freakin marmalade..

[curcercanty]

I would say the commando's were seeking confrontation guns a blazing against an international contingent in international waters.

I did say the actions of the IDF were stupid, ill considered. Yes, they were seeking a confrontation too. Everybody got what they wanted.

I don't see anything to be in the middle about. The blockade is the issue not the so called "terrorist" flotilla. The Netanyahu reactionary gov't is defending an illegal blockade which you yourself admit is "heavy handed" and "overreaching"..one that precludes delivery of cement, coriander, and freakin marmalade.. Hey, I think the blockade is wrong. I also appreciate the position of Israel. Rocket attacks from Gaza isn't something they shouldn't have to tolerate. So they have a genuine interest in keeping weapons and the means to produce them out of Gaza. If it takes a blockade to do it, so be it. That said, most of the things they're keeping out present no danger. The blockade isn't wrong, they way they're conducting it is.

It's foolish to think the members of the flotilla weren't looking for confrontation. They knew what they were getting into. I doubt they anticipated the gross over reaction of the IDF, but hey....when the centerpiece of your civil disobedience is a heavily-armed military force, you really should plan for the worst.

[Anymnillulky]

Four Qassam rockets fired from Gaza towards Israel - Haaretz Daily Newspaper | Israel News

[majestictwelve]

Four Qassam rockets fired from Gaza towards Israel - Haaretz Daily Newspaper | Israel News

It would seem that the blockade isn't curtailing rockets being fired into Israel.

[gMUVgw71]

It would seem that the blockade isn't curtailing rockets being fired into Israel.

They need to point to an article showing some other attack to they can correlate it to blocking food from women and children.

[Ekrbcbvh]

It would seem that the blockade isn't curtailing rockets being fired into Israel.

That's because occupation continues and the blockade of Gaza is an extension of occupation....of course that is always removed from the context of the conflict.

Having said this the rockets are indiscriminate and their use is against international law. However, there have been numerous ceasfires arranged that have held but they are usually worked out while the two parties are in formal negotiations. Right now given Israel's current rejectionist and reactionary gov't and most recent act not to mention their numerous daily acts of humiliation and aggression against palestinians that go unreported..the peace process is for all intents and purposes on ice. Hence the continuation of rocket attacks and tit for tat between Israel and the palestinian militant factions. Unfortunately, Israel chooses to respond with disproportionate force constantly and engages in collective punishment to "send a message." That is all well and good but it's more a counter-productive political strategy rather than a sound military strategy to force the Palestinians to reject Hamas which was elected into power legitimately. Israel and US would like to force the palestinians to accept a more supine palestinian authority because the only democracy that is allowed is one that can be controlled....until this is accomplished the screws will continue to be turned and it will only make matters worse for everybody...

[Ekrbcbvh]

The blockade isn't wrong, they way they're conducting it is.

It's foolish to think the members of the flotilla weren't looking for confrontation. They knew what they were getting into. I doubt they anticipated the gross over reaction of the IDF, but hey....when the centerpiece of your civil disobedience is a heavily-armed military force, you really should plan for the worst.

The blockade is wrong outright because it's an act of war and denies the palestinians the right of self-determination. It is an extension as I noted of occupation. Doesn't matter that a few thousand settlers were pulled out of Gaza a few years ago and made to look like some kind of concession. What was done was more in the interest of Israel as it was too expensive to protect these settlers and it allowed them to consolidate their hold on the West Bank. This was all part of policy and is a matter of public record for those who wish to do the research.

The flotilla was obviously aware of Israel's penchant to react disproportionately..they only have Operation Cast Lead (read the Goldstone report) and the last Lebanese War as an example. However, your reasoning is severely flawed as it doesn't justify piracy in contravention of international law....

BTW which is it?

Hey, I think the blockade is wrong. The blockade isn't wrong, they way they're conducting it is.

[Ekrbcbvh]

Like I said ...a matter of public record

"The significance of the disengagement plan is the freezing of the peace process," Prime Minister Ariel Sharon's senior adviser Dov Weisglass has told Haaretz.

"And when you freeze that process, you prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state, and you prevent a discussion on the refugees, the borders and Jerusalem. Effectively, this whole package called the Palestinian state, with all that it entails, has been removed indefinitely from our agenda. And all this with authority and permission. All with a presidential blessing and the ratification of both houses of Congress."

Top PM aide: Gaza plan aims to freeze the peace process - Haaretz Daily Newspaper | Israel News

[majestictwelve]

Dr. Doom wrote: Unfortunately, Israel chooses to respond with disproportionate force constantly and engages in collective punishment to "send a message." That is all well and good but it's more a counter-productive political strategy rather than a sound military strategy to force the Palestinians to reject Hamas which was elected into power legitimately. Israel and US would like to force the palestinians to accept a more supine palestinian authority because the only democracy that is allowed is one that can be controlled....until this is accomplished the screws will continue to be turned and it will only make matters worse for everybody... Agree. I think it's very hypocritical for the U.S. and Israel to try and undermine Hamas (however they feel about it) just because they don't agree with them, even though they were elected. I'm sure the U.S. has dealt with more brutal governments that weren't elected by the people, like um Iraq.

[Soulofpostar]

What about the fact they Israel killed an American citizen on the flotilla? Four bullets to the head and one to the body. Oh, but he just a birthright citizen, not that important. Unlike the fellow that Obama order assassinated, I guess, in the name of terrorism. You know that movie Minority Report? It's here.

Read the flotilla article on Salon

Israel is a menace to the world, not the we aren't though. It always cracks me up when people scream and shout from the highest hills that the government lies all the time about everything under the sun, except for death penalty and war cases. Why are people such suckers for the constant lies?

[curcercanty]

BTW which is it?

It's both. I believe the blockade is wrong, largely for the reasons you state. I also believe that it is justified, as Israel has a right to be secure within its own borders, and keeping weapons and the means to produce them out of Gaza is a necessary part of that. So, I support the blockade if it goes only far enough to promote Israel's internal security. If that was as far as it went, I'd be cool with it....the wrong thing, but for the right reason. In the real world, sometime that happens. That said, I think Israel is going way beyond what is needed to serve its national security interest. What it's doing with the the blockade borders on the criminal.