[P1international]

My wife is a retired public school teacher. The problem today is NOT the teachers. It's the parents or the lack of parents. Teach for awhile and discover the REAL truth of inferiour education.

So if I cant do well at my job can I blame the customers? This tactic that you used is stupid cause the whole point about a teachers job is to teach and if they dont do than it falls on their shoulders.

[yxn2dC07]

It's obvious to me from that video, but what difference does it make? These people are getting fake doctor's notes. You're ok with that?

Yep, sho am. One dirty trick calls for another dirty trick, in my book. Course, you would rather the teachers just relent, and worhip at the feet of this jackwag gov'ner. Afterall, you are not affected, are you? But if you were, you might well be protesting your ass off too. Should I take that "right" away? Or are you more comfortable just taking the rights away of those folks you don't agree with?

[lollypopz]

So if I cant do well at my job can I blame the customers? This tactic that you used is stupid cause the whole point about a teachers job is to teach and if they dont do than it falls on their shoulders.

Yes, and the GOP mandated NCLB, which the school administrators thought meant to teach children the answers of the test, instead of teaching them to learn. Many teachers were against NCLB because it was not funded, and as worded in many states meant they could only teach so that students could pass a selected test.

Oh great thinker, please answer that.

[Hedkffiz]

Oh really, asinine, you say, it is asinine when Democrat politicians pander to the teacher unions and give them anything they want in exchange for their vote.

Anything they want?

Like what? Give some specific examples of LAW.

Try and fire a bad teacher. I'll give you one better - try to identify a bad teacher. I've never argued that tenure systems (there are more than one of them out there) are perfect. However, you have to look at the situation beyond a set of sound bites and bumper sticker quotes.

The facts are a bit more difficult. To become a teacher requires a commitment to a degree, plus a certificate program at the teacher's expense, with the knowledge that the starting salary is going to be less-than-competitive, and difficult to live on for the first significant portion of the teacher's career. If you'll recall from our earlier calculations, the low-end of the scale is ~30K, at 5 years and change of experience. So, as a starting teacher, you're basically looking at starting your career at a salary that is less than the total of your student loans. And, while you do get the option of union protection, tenure usually takes 5 years to kick in. So, you're hanging your ass out in the wind for your district, at their whim.

Now, because it's a government job, there are 2 ways to get pay raises. Promotions and time. Time with a bachelor's degree basically means a very small bump every year. So, at some point, you're going to have to go earn yourself a master's degree, again on your own dime, so you can earn the equivalent of a promotion.


In return for this type of commitment, the teachers have said, "if I do enough time, I want job security." This is reasonable for several reasons. 1) It stops districts from firing the senior teachers who are finally getting into the real (i.e. comparable to the private sector) pay scale. 2) It helps to mitigate the risk of super-specializing: if you have been a teacher for 15 years, it is a real bitch to find a job doing something else and earn a salary that compares to what you were earning before. You've taken a risk for the district, and are asking for something in return.


Now, the other trick - how to identify "bad" teachers. Yes, there are always those glaring cases that make the news. But, real teacher evaluation is incredibly complex. There are so many factors involved in student performance, and only a handful are under the control of the teacher. An evaluation system must only evaluate an individual's performance on those factors which he or she can control, right? So, how do you control for things like nutrition, poverty, lead toxicity, drug abuse, working outside of school, domestic abuse, parental neglect/uninvolvement, etc when evaluating a teacher?

Of course you on the left bury your head in the sand and try don't look at what's going on. Take Wisconsin it's only the Dem's including your Anointed One supporting the teacher union. The rest of the country is telling the governor to stay the course. Your just not getting it. Who is the one burying their head? The one oversimplifying and repeating what they heard on Rush or the one who actually understands the complexity of the issues?

Oh, and that anointed one line is so played out, I don't know why you guys even bother. It only makes you look even more ridiculous.

Yes the teacher unions have destroyed our education system. They hold a monopoly, which the Democrats gave to them, all for their vote.

Yes the teachers have a monopoly in teaching. That's kind of how it works.

[Mangoman]

Yep, sho am. One dirty trick calls for another dirty trick, in my book. Course, you would rather the teachers just relent, and worhip at the feet of this jackwag gov'ner. Afterall, you are not affected, are you? But if you were, you might well be protesting your ass off too. Should I take that "right" away? Or are you more comfortable just taking the rights away of those folks you don't agree with?

I'd rather tax dollars don't feed protected monopolies. Let them negotiate their own salaries based on their individual worth, like everyone else - not in a union. You are equating collective bargaining with the right to protest? Give me a break.

[Mangoman]

My wife is a retired public school teacher. The problem today is NOT the teachers. It's the parents or the lack of parents. Teach for awhile and discover the REAL truth of inferiour education.

Of course it's not the teachers! How could teacher quality affect the quality of our education system? You are dead wrong. There are private schools that do wonders with those same kids and parents. I hope you misspelled inferior on purpose.

[Hedkffiz]

Of course it's not the teachers! How could teacher quality affect the quality of our education system? You are dead wrong. There are private schools that do wonders with those same kids and parents. I hope you misspelled inferior on purpose.

There are?

Let's see some links to those private schools doing "wonders" with poor inner-city kids.

The ones that can't pay them.

[Mangoman]

There are?

Let's see some links to those private schools doing "wonders" with poor inner-city kids.

The ones that can't pay them.

Google inner city charter schools. I would have thought an ex-teacher would be more on top of these things. I'm going to ignore future tutoring requests from you.

I'm assuming you taught at a public school.

[Hedkffiz]

Google inner city charter schools. I would have thought an ex-teacher would be more on top of these things. I'm going to ignore future tutoring requests from you.

I'm assuming you taught at a public school.

A charter school is a far cry from a private school. They receive public money. They use publicly licensed teachers. Yes, they receive waivers from some of the standards to which other schools are held, but they are NOT private schools.

Again, your "tutoring" consists of only lessons in failure. While you excel at it, I'm really not interested.

[fotochicaes]

The performance of charter schools relative to public schools is far from settled.

I also enjoy the many posts here, filled with grammar and spelling errors, debating the effectiveness of education.

[citicroego]

I'd rather tax dollars don't feed protected monopolies. Let them negotiate their own salaries based on their individual worth, like everyone else - not in a union. You are equating collective bargaining with the right to protest? Give me a break.

QUOTE=CharlesDavenport;1856729]I'd rather tax dollars don't feed protected monopolies. Let them negotiate their own salaries based on their individual worth, like everyone else - not in a union. You are equating collective bargaining with the right to protest? Give me a break.[/QUOTE]

"I'd rather tax dollars don't feed protected monopolies. Let them negotiate their own salaries based on their individual worth, like everyone else - not in a union. You are equating collective bargaining with the right to protest? Give me a break"

Skettic1
Some states have a RIGHT TO "HIGHER AND FIRE AT WILL" should non union workers put pressure on their employer they would be fired.

Dallas Area Rapid Transit - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The Dallas Transit System (DTS) was the publicly owned mass transit service operated by the City of Dallas, Texas (USA), from 1964 to 1988. ... the company was formerly known as the Dallas Railway and Terminal Company when Dallas had an extensive ... Most trips in the DART system are carried by the bus system. ...

At one point the buss company union said they would walkout and paralyze the system. The City promptly shut the whole thing down until the the workers and union capitulated.

We now have a system named DART "Dallas Area Rapid Transit. Fort Worth has a similar system we call FART

[Enrobrorb]

Probably they're just sympathetic to the plight of the protesters and decided to help out in an ethically questionable way.

Like the people all over the world that are sending pizza to the protestors....

Egyptians Order Pizza for Wisconsin Protesters | Ron Paul 2012 | Sound Money, Peace and Liberty

[P1international]

it is not about teaching it is about monday

[googlopharm]

This falls under the ends justify the means category, so long as it is a liberal agenda standing up for the "little guy." Conservatives are not allowed this, just saying.

[EsAllCams]

Well--this cuts it. Unbelievable video of how far the Union goes. To me--it's one thing to say--Yeah I missed work to go to the protest--(thereby being a stand up person and admitting it)--but for the Union to organize doctors to write out fake sick slips--so these people will be excused from work--is beyond the pale. And they're on the tax-payer dime-- Meaning with a sick note fom a doctor--they get paid for it. I really don't think I would want my kids being taught by these teachers. I mean--after all--they apparently don't understand the concept of you-tube--and video cameras yet--LOL. Who is dumb enough to call in sick--and then get their mug in front of a camera at a protest-and one that is certain to show up on the net--or cable network news?--LOL

WATCH THIS VIDEO:

Video: Doctors handing out fake medical excuses at WI union protest Hot Air

teachers getting false notes from doctors; lawmakers hiding in next state instead of doing the job they were elected and get PAID to do by taxpayers; Well great role models for kids huh?

[EsAllCams]

This falls under the ends justify the means category, so long as it is a liberal agenda standing up for the "little guy." Conservatives are not allowed this, just saying.

Wait till their kids use the same tactic. What can they possibly say then? Kids watch and listen and learn,

[Teprophopay]

Do you have any evidence whatsoever that the notes that the doctors signed were fraudulent in any way?

Have you actually examined one of the notes? Seen what was written on one?

No?

Then how dare you call for someone to lose their entire livelihood? To lose their license to do their business?

Did you watch the video? There was someone on a micro-phone telling protestors where to go to get a doctor's excuse for their absence. Doctors--about six of them conveniently located on the premises where the protest was being held. Some even signed with their license numbers.

Now when I get sick--I go to my own doctor-who is located in his doctor's office. Upon thourough evaluation--heart and blood pressure--my symptoms etc.--he will then write a prescription and or write a note (if I need one) to an employer.

How dare you to be so ignorant. I have many family members in the medical field that wouldn't dream of doing something like this. It's called MAL-PRACTICE. Mal of course meaning BAD. And I hope they all get busted--and are up in front of their state licensing board--with severe penalties levied--for their MAL-Practice.

FINALLY--when you call in sick--you're suppose to be home in bed--not at a protest--out in the cold carrying a sign--screaming your guts out and banging on a drum--LOL.

[agolutuaddiff]

teachers getting false notes from doctors; lawmakers hiding in next state instead of doing the job they were elected and get PAID to do by taxpayers; Well great role models for kids huh?

You better believe it! Kids need to know how to protest unfairness in effective and peaceful ways. Guns are not the solution to all problems.

In lesson 2 they need to be able to carry these skills to the classroom and protest unfair and arbitrary school rules.

[Teprophopay]

You better believe it! Kids need to know how to protest unfairness in effective and peaceful ways. Guns are not the solution to all problems.

In lesson 2 they need to be able to carry these skills to the classroom and protest unfair and arbitrary school rules.

You know I would be really ticked, as a parent, if I saw my kid at this protest, because the teacher dragged them there--if I wasn't notified of it--or had signed a permission slip for my kid to participate in it.

I wonder if these moron teachers thought about that? I kind of doubt it--LOL.

[agolutuaddiff]

You know I would be really ticked, as a parent, if I saw my kid at this protest, because the teacher dragged them there--if I wasn't notified of it--or had signed a permission slip for my kid to participate in it.

I wonder if these moron teachers thought about that? I kind of doubt it--LOL.

I would be too. What teacher would do that? I can not believe any teacher would drag an unwilling student. Or even choose to be responsible for a willing student. Has that happened?