[Duseshoug]

Countering jodan? Hmm.. It sometimes depends on how their kamae is.. Also, how do they play? Are they jittery? Are they just standing there? Go to the Westside Kendo Dojo site and they still might have the Jodan vs. Jodan video that somebody recorded during the SCKF championships. You will see how the more experienced players look like.

The only thing else (for people playing against Jodan using chudan) is to have the shinai pointed towards the left kote of the opposing player. Left kote is a valid target if the opposing player is using Jodan. you also have to play with the maai. I was told that you generally move back and to your right to keep your distance. But of course, you don't want to spiral out of the ring.

My $0.02,

Tim

[Ternneowns]

Thats right. Jodan is very hard. If you don't have a good sense of timing and maai, you will be killed in Jodan.

[oyymoss]

I tried to do jodan sometimes for fun ,, but it's too hard for the arms. You need to be really strong!

But I don't really like jodan because you can't (well I can't) really do tobi komi men from jodan no kamae . But I still think I will learn it at one moment, when my right shoulder or right feet is too painfull to do normal chudan. So jodan is only for me when I'm injured!

[bestcigsnick]

Matthew Raymond? That's courious, I've been practicing Kendo for a few months and I've already heared about this canadian kendo team member who played Nito at the last WKC.

Do somebody knows if he will be at Glasgow?

For an absolute beginer as myself, Nito (and Jodan) is very exotic and have lots of appeal, but I'm still waiting to someone in Spain practicing those styles.

Ciao!

[L0KoxewQ]

alexpollijr:

The length of the shoto has to be >62 cm for both men and women. One shaku is approximately 30.303 cm, therefore a shoto is roughly 2 shaku in length.

Also, the daito has to be less than >114 cm long, i.e. a 37 shinai. Again for both sexes.

For men, the shoto has to weigh between 280 - 300 g and the daito has to be

[C7JjVczP]

yup Matthew Raymond will be at Glasgow.
He was selected in team canada at the round robin that was held in Vancouver last july.

I think that guy is super usefull to the team, he can get hikiwake against anyone...I even heard he can even get hikiwake against the devil.

Last world championship he got hikiwake against Naoki Eiga...Canada almost won against japan that time..I think everyone knows the story of what happened in that fight.

[hLabXZlK]

Hi there


In yesterday's practice I 've used jodan for a while in shiai geiko.
Although I had no sucess, my partner also did not. I noticed that employing the jodan waza is relatively simpler than i thought.

The resulting thoughtds about the experience is that
a) kote from jodan is effective in debana only. Otherwise is too risky since a miss results in your having to defend yourself with the left hand onyl.
b) migi men from jodan seems to get most people off guard, since they expect shomen and often would go for aiuchi. But if just bend the head a little (yes i know I should not ), he misses his shomen and the yokomen knocks him out

[kavaTeexy]

Against jodan?

Tsuki tsuki tsuki!

I think mune tsuki was removed as a valid point because it was too effective against jodan people. is that the case?

[Anypeny]

It's interesting that you'd ask such a question, I often wondered bout that myself. In this last Brazilian Champ there was only one guy doing nitoryu. This same guy was wearing a f* real Same Do.

Mind you, I found out later when he removed his men that he was a eighteen year old westerner one-year-and-a-half-of-kendo shodan.

Some guys from Paraguay who stood next to use made some pretty funny coments

Anyway, he was bad. He polished the right side of his opponent Dodai with about 20 blows with the shoto, and no one of them was valid. He lost in the first round to a ittoryu guy who unleashed such a wonderfull barrage of four strikes into about 1,5 second that almost tore his two swords from his hands, and finally ended into a nice yukodatotsu to the upper kote (the one holding the daito).

Recently I asked sensei if he could help me with Jodan fighting. he told me very puzzling things. Not like 'fear leads to hate, hate leads to suffering', but he asked me if I was lefthanded (which I'm not) and then he told me that I could change stances during the match at will. And that was it

So for the last three months I've been arriving an hour before renshu to practice Jodan waza , but I've still got to try it in shiai.

[Immampdah]

Alexpollijr:

Bottom of page: http://www.boudicca.de/jap-10.htm

Just do a google search. I recall seeing similar information on one of the online budo retailers' web site. Maybe it was kendoshop.com

[sat23neus2]

Originally posted by inner_cent
Actually, i don't exactly agree with Richard. recently, Toda sensei came down to Melbourne and taugh us about Nito. He did mention that it is possible to gain a point using shoto. .......... Hi Innercent, we were at the same seminar !

Toda Sensei explained that it was possible to cut with the shoto (of course) as one would, if fighting with two swords. A tsuki with the shoto when in close is a joy to receive (!)

But, the original question was about scoring in shiai. He did emphasise that cuts made with the shoto would not be awarded a point in shiai.

Possibly to even the odds a bit for the opponent with only one shinai.

Richard

[BebopVT]

I've been attempting to learn Jodan no Kamae for a few months, and like most people say...its tough! The hardest part in my opinion is distance. You need to re-learn what your range is in Jodan vs your range in Chudan. Secondly, although the swing is fundamrntally "the same", learning to swing from Jodan has some subtle differences. Then, of course, is the most difficult thing in all of kendo to learn well: footwork.

I've had to learn all i know so far regarding Jodan (which really isn't much) by reading various books, watching videos, and experimentation. "learn to do by doing" applies i guess.

I recommend anyone interested in Jodan to purchase the "All Japan Police Competition" from kumdovj.com. Its a huge team competition, with at least one Jodan player on each team.
Second, if you can read Korean or Japanese go to Amazon.co.jp and search for Kendo. You'll encounter a lot of "textbooks", and most of the ones written for "non-beginners" will have some Jodan sections.

A friend of mine (who reads both Korean and Japanese) ordered a few books, and we frequently split on ordering videos. One of the texts he got shows various diagrams and explanations on how to attack (via Jodan), as well as how to incorporate it into your regular practice.

In the end, i think this quote from Musashi is appropriate:

"What is important in this path is to realize that the consumate guard (kamae) is the middle position. The middle position is what the guard is all about. Consider it in terms of large scale military science: the centre is the seat of the general, while following the general are the other guards. This should be examined carefully."

-Miyamoto Musashi, Gorin No Sho.

[Ilaubuas]

That makes sound sense to me

[streMunford]

The way to properly do Jodan is to master chudan first. That's the way I was told. if you have bad chudan basics, then it translates straight over to when you try Jodan.

Tim

[santorio]

Are there any jodan and/or nito-ryu players on this forum?

If so, I am curious to learn how you got started and how you study. Also, at what level did you change your style?

In my experience, sensei who play jodan and/or nito-ryu are not so common. The only nito-ryu person I can think of is Toda sensei, who used to be a jodan player before he began practicing nito-ryu. There are a couple clips of him in the "Goodies" section of Kendo World.

[Grapappytek]

Well I tried jodan once when I was injured at my right shoulder and also injured at the bottom of my right feet (because my fumi komi was incorect and I had a cut in my foot lol), Well actually it was really less painfull than when I was doing chudan injured.

The right shoulder in jodan doesn't do as much movement (just helps push the shinai foward a little) as when I am in chudan where it has to do a bigger motion and I need to extend my right arm to get reach.


I don't know I may also be all wrong.


Jodan is hard to get a point against so it's a good stategy to have a jodan fighter in a team match! hikiwake for sure!

[Quality4Qty]

Originally posted by dr_evil
I tried jodan just a few times but really is interested in doing more. I found that doing fumikomi with the left foot to be extremely hard. Anybody knows the training method for jodan??????

Cheers,
The Evil One VERY curious here "dr_evil" ........... Did Chan sensei actually alow you doing that in NUSKK ???? :P I'm surprise he didn't teach a lesson or two for using them at your level :P

PS - Keep guessing who I am .......

[Tuqofiw]

"Although I had no sucess, my partner also did not. I noticed that employing the jodan waza is relatively simpler than i thought."


That was also my initial impression, until I encountered people who knew how to fight against jodan .

Jakob

[vipBrooriErok]

kendo chick

Yes, Matthew Raymond is well known to have made his way to the 11 WKC fighting nitoryu. He's very good. I've read an interview with him in the Iaido Newsletter from the Guelph School that he started nito practice while he was shodan, with three years of practice.

This kind of stuff as 'it's not well looked upon' to me is a whole load of nonsense, but it happens sometimes. I've hardly seen though a high level kendoka (yondan and so) look down to any jodan or nito students. The lower level are the ones who try to diminish these two 'styles'.

The personal opinion I've got from two sixth dan down here is that Jodan is OK from shodan if you want to practice. I believe the same goes for nito .