[betraaaus]

So nothing and nobody really exists, in absolute terms.

How then does "love" work?

How does that which does not really exist deserve "love"?

And how do we express that "love"?

[Wrasialat]

'Self' is a product of craving. Where there is craving, there is need. Where there is need, love acts to resolve need.

[PekHyvac]

'Self' is a product of craving. Where there is craving, there is need. Where there is need, love acts to resolve need.

As I see it life has a great need of the presence of love. Not the sort of love that is based on lust, passion, attachment, discrimination, and prejudice; rather compassion, non-conditional love which seeks to see happiness, to remove other's suffering and being kind in the process. It is the best part of being human in my opinion.

[JorgiOLusinio]

The Buddha's "Four Sublime States" (Brahma Viharas) are loving kindness (metta), compassion(karuna), sympathetic joy (mudita) and equanimity (upekkha):


I. "Here, monks, a disciple dwells pervading one direction with his heart filled with loving-kindness, likewise the second, the third, and the fourth direction; so above, below and around; he dwells pervading the entire world everywhere and equally with his heart filled with loving-kindness, abundant, grown great, measureless, free from enmity and free from distress.

II. Here, monks, a disciple dwells pervading one direction with his heart filled with compassion, likewise the second, the third and the fourth direction; so above, below and around; he dwells pervading the entire world everywhere and equally with his heart filled with compassion, abundant, grown great, measureless, free from enmity and free from distress.

III. Here, monks, a disciple dwells pervading one direction with his heart filled with sympathetic joy, likewise the second, the third and the fourth direction; so above, below and around; he dwells pervading the entire world everywhere and equally with his heart filled with sympathetic joy, abundant, grown great, measureless, free from enmity and free from distress.

IV. Here, monks, a disciple dwells pervading one direction with his heart filled with equanimity, likewise the second, the third and the fourth direction; so above, below and around; he dwells pervading the entire world everywhere and equally with his heart filled with equanimity, abundant, grown great, measureless, free from enmity and free from distress".

— Digha Nikaya 13

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/a...006.html#basic

[leijggeds]

I completely agree that love is a great thing, and that in this world be can never have enough of it. But from a Buddhist perspective, I think for most of us love still stems from desire. While there is still an idea of a "self", then there will also be the idea of "other" and I am not sure love, or compassion or whatever can be said to be "non-conditional."

But it is something to certainly work for. Being kind and compassionate towards others creates the causes of happiness for ourselves and others and helps us to purify our minds. If we aim to have the mind of always looking to benefit others, then we have have good results.

[elektikakass]

I think having the traits of a Buddha requires a complete Sunatta mind else the Atta concoctions are very perverted versions of Metta, Karuna, Mudita and Upekkha.
My imagination runs wild on this one if it’s an emotional affair of desires, fears, hopes, aversions and attachments or for reasons of politics or propaganda like bait to reel in the fish.

[xIuvyAuT]

So nothing and nobody really exists, in absolute terms.

Buddhism merely teaches that there no constant quality within the five aggregates to be called a self. I don't think the Buddha denied the conventional self or the existence of the five aggregates.

[darieBarexish]

The Buddha's "Four Sublime States" (Brahma Viharas) are loving kindness (metta), compassion(karuna), sympathetic joy (mudita) and equanimity (upekkha):

Sure. But Brahma's (God's) Vihara may give the impression love is something personal or generated by a 'self', just like the object of love is personal or a 'self'. Love can be another element (dhatu). For example, often when women have given birth & their breasts are full of milk, just the sound of another baby crying can cause their breasts to spontaneously spurt milk. Such 'love' is pure biology.

[immewaycypef]

[

Sure. But Brahma's (God's) Vihara may give the impression love is something personal or generated by a 'self', just like the object of love is personal or a 'self'.

I always thought that "Brahma" could also mean a purer state of mind beyond anything to do with a "god" or a personal "self."

For example, often when women have given birth & their breasts are full of milk, just the sound of another baby crying can cause their breasts to spontaneously spurt milk. Such 'love' is pure biology

I wouldn't know. When my baby died a few hours after birth my breasts definately weren't spurting milk when I heard other babies cry.

[SAUNDERSAN]

I completely agree that love is a great thing, and that in this world be can never have enough of it. But from a Buddhist perspective, I think for most of us love still stems from desire. While there is still an idea of a "self", then there will also be the idea of "other" and I am not sure love, or compassion or whatever can be said to be "non-conditional."

But it is something to certainly work for. Being kind and compassionate towards others creates the causes of happiness for ourselves and others and helps us to purify our minds. If we aim to have the mind of always looking to benefit others, then we have have good results.

I agree with you Terma about the individual expression of love. Being human means a work in progress, after all. My post was in response to Elemnt's about the nature of love.

[CowextetleSix]

So nothing and nobody really exists, in absolute terms.

The Buddha did not teach this.

[P9CCd35R]

The Buddha did not teach this.

It is seems to be a common online misunderstanding which I have not encountered elsewhere. In the same way, love exists and is more than our foibles and much bigger than our failings and disappointments.

[K0aM7urg]

I wouldn't know. When my baby died a few hours after birth my breasts definately weren't spurting milk when I heard other babies cry.

Good to hear from a woman. Quite often I find people generalize and stereotype gender identities and related biological aspects this way but each person is a separate personality imo apart from the core human qualities. This is why a human being is called "lokaya" (a world) in certain contexts. Each person has his/her own "sensory world".

[ticfarentibia]

Could you please define what do you mean by the word "love"?

Is love desire? is it pleasure? passion? remembrance?

Can love be understood through language (words)? or through silence?

Are we capable of experiencing love without understanding and negating all of that which is not love?

Regards,
Bundokji

[iklostardinn]

The love spoken about in Buddhist teachings is different to understandings about love which involve close relationship with the other, strong feelings of attraction, connection and attachment.

I like the definitions of love which stress the seeking happiness for the other - irrespective of what that means in regard to gains for us.

It is unconditional rather than conditional in nature and requires something from us - patience, courage, acceptance in being willing to love and be loved.

[clomoll]

Hello andyrobyn,

It is unconditional rather than conditional in nature and requires something from us - patience, courage, acceptance in being willing to love and be loved. To call it unconditional, does it mean that "Love" is beyond cause and effect (Karma/mind)? or am i jumping to the wrong conclusion?

Regards,
Bundokji

[beenBinybelia]

Here's an example of Buddha mentioning "a mind of love" In Kakacupama Sutta MN 21 :


"Phagguna, if anyone were to reproach you right to your face, even then you should abandon those urges and thoughts which are worldly. There, Phagguna, you should train yourself thus: 'Neither shall my mind be affected by this, nor shall I give vent to evil words; but I shall remain full of concern and pity, with a mind of love, and I shall not give in to hatred.' This is how, Phagguna, you should train yourself.

"Phagguna, if anyone were to give you a blow with the hand, or hit you with a clod of earth, or with a stick, or with a sword, even then you should abandon those urges and thoughts which are worldly. There, Phagguna, you should train yourself thus: 'Neither shall my mind be affected by this, nor shall I give vent to evil words; but I shall remain full of concern and pity, with a mind of love, and I shall not give in to hatred.' This is how, Phagguna, you should train yourself.


http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipit...021x.budd.html

[AgindyMinnife]

So nothing and nobody really exists, in absolute terms.

Its not that anything doesn't exist in absolute terms. From my understanding (and shoot me down folks if I've got it ass backwards), its that nothing has a separate individual existence. You are the product of the genes of your ancestors right back to mitochondrial eve, the food they ate, the water they drank, the sun that warmed there skin, the furs and textiles that kept them warm in winter etc. Even your thoughts are the products of the thousands of decisions both skillful and unskillful of everyone, of you, your ancestors, your teachers and your culture and if your into the whole rebirth thing your karmic predispositions.

@Aloka-D thanks for the sutta quote - liked that one a lot.

[Jffxljtw]

Its not that anything doesn't exist in absolute terms. From my understanding (and shoot me down folks if I've got it ass backwards), its that nothing has a separate individual existence. You are the product of the genes of your ancestors right back to mitochondrial eve, the food they ate, the water they drank, the sun that warmed there skin, the furs and textiles that kept them warm in winter etc. Even your thoughts are the products of the thousands of decisions both skillful and unskillful of everyone, of you, your ancestors, your teachers and your culture and if your into the whole rebirth thing your karmic predispositions.

@Aloka-D thanks for the sutta quote - liked that one a lot.

That is how I understand it too Traveller. I would like to add at this point that how it actually works ( ie. how all those decisions, actions, conditions, causes etc. become genetically stored and passed on ) is not something I dwell on as worthy of pondering and trying to understand, at this point in time.

[ëàìèíàò]

Hello andyrobyn,



To call it unconditional, does it mean that "Love" is beyond cause and effect (Karma/mind)? or am i jumping to the wrong conclusion?

Regards,
Bundokji

Hi Bundokji, the unconditional nature is the loving attitude comes about in our minds first and then we can action on it ... Hope that answers your question.