[FYvWldC0]

I was wondering this morning if we tend to neglect the fourth precept in the modern world because some people don't seem to worry about lying - or telling what's called "white lies "

What's your opinion ? Do you ever tell lies ?

The fourth precept is:

"I undertake the precept to refrain from incorrect speech."

and:


"Furthermore, abandoning lying, the disciple of the noble ones abstains from lying. In doing so, he gives freedom from danger, freedom from animosity, freedom from oppression to limitless numbers of beings. In giving freedom from danger, freedom from animosity, freedom from oppression to limitless numbers of beings, he gains a share in limitless freedom from danger, freedom from animosity, and freedom from oppression. This is the fourth gift..."

AN 8.38


http://www.accesstoinsight.org/ptf/d...pancasila.html


.

[fereupfer]

A while back I realized I told a lot of "harmless lies." So since than the fourth precept has actually been my focus. Occasionally I give out information I know is incorrect, just because I wasn't thinking when I said it. I don't think that's a lying problem as much of a mindfulness problem, though. Either way, it's been a while since I've purposely misled somebody.

Not lying is harder than I would have thought. I told a lot of lies with the intention of not hurting somebody.

[lungumnentibe]

I think in the modern world we have gotten a lot more caught up in what people want to hear ("white" lies) and protecting peoples feelings / egos. It often seems more important to protect someone's self-esteem and ego than to tell them the truth. My culture in particular emphasizes status and feeling good about oneself, despite the truth of the matter.

IMO, it is better to be honest than to try to protect someone's feelings. I think we live with a lot of uncertainty, because of how complex our lives our (economics, politics, environmental issues, etc.); much of this is far beyond our control. I find if comforting in a way when someone tells me the bare truth, even if it hurts, because then at least I know where I stand. This small amount of concrete knowledge can make it easier to deal with other uncertainty.

I would like to say that I do not tell lies. I certainly try to be honest at all times; or if I cannot say something positive or if I think my opinion will hurt someone and does not need to be expressed, I keep it to myself. However I am pretty sure I still slip sometimes. And as Johnny said, I think sometimes it is more of a mindfulness issue, not getting caught up in what is going on and being aware of what you are saying.

With metta,
monkey

[cindygirl]

Imo, focus should be our intentions rather than blind adherence to precepts even if it means more overall harm than good.