[PemiaGefe]

Patty, I am running BECAUSE of Atkins!! Before, I could barely run a block without wishing for a short and painless death. Now I'm running for the first time in years. I guess I don't have any comparisons to go by since starting Atkins except for before I couldn't and now I CAN!! (JOY!!)

[Theateetetuig]

you know, it is funny that you should mention hunter-gatherer ancestors.. i've often said (when complaining about farm standards and cash issues) that we should return to our roots and fend for ourselves with food. hunt and kill when hungry..! but.. that's just a dream. an extreme dream.

ok Fight club boy :P :wink:

[realfan87]

I guess I'll need to do my own trial and error and see what's right for me.

By the way, Teuthis, I like the new pic. You look great!

[BenBoobmers]

This is very interesting. Maybe some trail-mix in the morning?

[Pippoles]

All I know is that my endurance (as to running) immediately dropped after starting Atkins. I wasn't expecting it, and didn't think about the carb connection until later, so it wasn't something that was in my head.

I began Atkins on a Friday (after regular 5-mile run). On Sunday, I ran in a 5K. Usually, from pushing too hard, I would start to feel it in my lungs. But, this time, I felt it in my legs. They just felt like they didn't have the strength to go on - it was realy weird. Halfway thru, I had to start taking walking breaks.

For the next few weeks, I could barely run 3 miles. I kept at it tho. Eventually, my endurance came back. About 3-4 weeks in, I just was able to run 4-6 miles again. My pace as dropped dramatically.

We are specifically talking about endurance. I don't think the low carb has affect on strength and energy. Only on going for the long haul.

I personally feel that I will do better when I'm able to get more carbs again. Induction level is definately low.

[flopay]

Did you find that you slowed down since starting Atkins? I've had a few "carb binges", but didn't have any great bursts of speed. I do have a 5k coming up, tho

[85IbLcwQ]

Teuthis:

Pray tell how do you know about the "incredible" strength and endurance that hunter gatherers had? There's no evidence that they had anything of the sort.

Unless you've published or have knowledge of some ground breaking research, why not stick to facts instead of wild guesses.

I can picture them running 20 yards and bending over puking, then passing out.

The facts suggest that they were a rotten toothed, brittle boned, disease ridden, short-lived pack of mangy rats - not the ubermensch you describe.

[eFDMBwKH]

I t was probably the cookies.Has anyone ever heard of a Strict atkins dieter finishing a marathon?Might be agood goal for you patty/No i couldnt w/0 the carbs myself.They help my running so much.

[costamarianavia]

patty, i wouldn't reccomend eating hi GI foods such as pasta to increase your cab count for excercise... not if you're working on this WOL. rather, stick with extra helping of veggies, and nuts, and maybe some berries, instead. and of course, you know what atkins says, increase it slowly.. like 5g a week.

teuthis, i agree, our ancestors didnt eat the carbs we eat, at all. but remember, we are built differntly, raised differently. i think i drastic reduction in what we're used to being sustained on can have a negative effect on performance, and why should we suffer that? if we're able to run, we should run comfortably. i think the 20g carbs a day for induction is best suited to the inactive, as many beginners are. that's who he wrote the book for. as we pass induction, and get more active, we increase our carb intake. im on 20 to kick start this loss, but have no qualms in then doing 30g a day, to keep my performance up. my body still will be burning fat, but it (hopefully) wont feel the shock of running on a new source of energy. the transition would have been made, but there will still be some of those nutty carbs. (Mmmm nuts..)

you know, it is funny that you should mention hunter-gatherer ancestors.. i've often said (when complaining about farm standards and cash issues) that we should return to our roots and fend for ourselves with food. hunt and kill when hungry..! but.. that's just a dream. an extreme dream.

[emupsMaispubs]

Great!!

I was really bad yesterday. I ate about 5 chocolate chip cookies this morning and 2 cups of coffee Needless to say, I went out for a run. I never ran more than 7 miles, and I was determined to reach that 8th.

It was such a great running day. Sunny and 35 degrees. One layer of pants, t-shirt and fleece, hat and gloves, and lots of time. I ran 10 miles! I even had negative splits! (meaning my pace got better in the last miles).

I'm not creditting this run to the cookies. Everything was just in sync today, from the weather to my will

10 miles
1:51:17 (11:07/mile)
10.44/11.24/11.28/11.25/11.26/11.20/11.22/11.00/10.57/10.15

[Jxlacvio]

I agree with Patty - could just be one of those runs.

I started the coolrunning program and the first week (I started at the 4 week stage) I was not doing well at all! Then suddenly one day, I started running and did a full two+ miles without a stop! Don't know why, and I hadn't had any additional carbs - just increased water. The next time, I had to go back to the 5 week program, but it went smoothly - without getting out of breath. However, I didn't get back up to the full out 2+ mile run.

I keep looking for studies on running (or any endurance activity) and low carbing and I find conflicting information and no definitive explanation as to the effect of low carbing on endurance.

[violalmina]

This is my story and I'm sticking to it...
Yesterday was our Christmas potluck. Nothing can match the destructive power of a Christmas potluck on persons dietary plan. I ate enough pasta to make Chef Boyarde blush. I felt guilty for ten miniutes and forgot about it. This morning I roll my fat butt out of bed expecting to be punished for my discretion during my run but lo and behold! I ran my fastest three mile time since leaving the Marines (3 miles, 25 minuites)!!! I know if I'm gonna continue the WOL, I have to stick to the plan, but WOW!!

[thehhhyips]

Our hunter/gatherer ancestors ate relatively few carbs. The Inuits and American Indians ate practically none. They ran and were more active in a day than we are in a week; even with our exercise programs. I just do not agree that carbs are necessary for endurance.

I was a navy diver, and also did some other grueling things in those years. We had protein requirements back then; and we ate lots of fat too. Foe sustained energy. We never had carb requirements. I tended, in those days, to eat fewer carbs than I did later. I never had a stamina problem then. I once went for four days with no food or water, making my way over some considerable landscape, and although for the first couple of days I was hungry, I was never weak or lacking stamina.

I think we need to look back at our genetic selves more and read less of what "experts" write in magazines. If you get the perception that low carb reduces your endurance, it just might. If you realize what our ancestors ate, and the incredible endurance and power they had, then it probably will not affect you. Perception is often more powerful than reality.

Since I've been on Atkins, I've had very few low blood sugar episodes and much increased endurance, with fewer and smaller hunger pangs if I am forced to miss meals. I just not get the weakness any more. That's just my take on it, but I don't believe that high carb equals endurance any more than low carb does.

Good Luck!

[orerviche]

Steve is back! We thought you left us

[juptVatoSoito]

Kyop I suggest that you do some more reading. I can give you a partial list if you need it. Even on the internet you can find excellent information. You are making statements that do not bear up against the massive amounts of research done on the subject.

Hunter/gatherers, including the American aboriginals were possibly the most healthy people in the history of the human race. They had, and [Loriann] Required considerable endurance; must greater than we have today. They lived lives as hunters, moving miles a day at high speeds on occasion. More modern examples are existing cultures of bushmen in the kahalari.

None of these people evinced any signs of major tooth decay as you suggest. They did not have signs on arthritis either. I don't want to go into spouting facts here. You should read them for yourself. But one fact is that the hunter gatherers of the Mesopotamian delta were fully 15 centimeters taller than the later farmers dwelling in the area. They did not have the signs of arthritis or dental decay that the farmers did. Our species has a genetic history of hundreds of thousands of years without the "benefits" of grains, potatoes, sugars. They ate what we are trying to eat now. Minor levels of carbohydrates, vegetables and proteins, with large amounts of fat included.

Good Luck!

[Immerymopay]

Yesterday I ate a regular thanksgiving meal for lunch and then a piece of pie later.I have been running and today I could not believe how much farther I could run with the only difference being the added carbs from yesterday.I usually run 5 minutes then walk 5 for 30 minutes total because that is the stage I am on in my begginning to run program and by the end of the 5 minutes i am starting to get a little tired or out of breath.Today I was at the 5 minute point and I wasn't tired at all so I kept going for a additional 10 minutes.Does anyone else think that only difference was the additional carbs??

[Unonounaple]

Dax. how, pray tell, are we "built differently" than people who lived a mere ten thousand years ago? In evolutionary terms that is yesterday. How are we built differently than aborigies who lived the hunter/gatherer lifestyles until a mere 100 years ago?

We are raised differently; but that is to our own detriments. The biggest difference is that they got more exercise. They did a lot of it, and had stamina we never will, with very low carbohydrate consumption. To posit that we somehow require all those carbs is is physiologiclly illogical.

Remember, most of humanity did not have access to potatoes or even rice until quite recently. And grains in general have only been with us as major sources of nutrition for less than ten thousand years.

I think protein/fat loading is far superior to carb loading in generating sustained energy.

[replicamuse]

i've done a LOT of reading about low-carb these past few weeks, and am also subscribed to runners world magazine. what i can tell you is this: if you're wanting to run, you need more than the induction level of atkins allow. minimum of 35carbs per day.

i see you're an established member, which means you're proberbly past induction, but i really do think that those extra carbs would have helped you with a burst of energy. how long have you been on the run/walk program? by 4 weeks, you should be jogging more, walking less, if it's 5 mins jog and only 2 mins walking. so you need to decide whether it's worth increasing your carbs a little (even by 5 a day) for the extra energy, to improve, or not.

im taking a break from running for this first week on atkins, am going to walk and cycle, instead. but next week, when i pick up the training again, i'll be on induction at 30carbs a day. our bodies NEED carbs to be at its most efficient in excercise - we just need to know the right amount for the job, whilst still using fat cells for then rest of the day...

[GoveMoony]

Thanks, Dax. I plan to do induction for 1 more week (to get over the binge on Thanksgiving weekend ). I then plan to add some carbs at dinnertime, avoiding sugar. Sugar is my weekness, I can't stop eating it.

I'm thinking of having pasta at dinnertime - which I really miss. I'll start with whole wheat, and see how it goes.

[Slchtjgb]

I could be the carbs. My pace dropped dramatically since I started this diet. For the first couple of weeks, I struggled thru short runs, not sure I could even do the distance.

Then again, some days you have bad runs and some days you have good runs. One day recently, I ran almost 7 miles, and didn't want to stop. I just had that extra burst of adrenaline in me that day.