[SingleMan]

Not the norm, by any means.

I was referring more towards the gentry within the religion itself....

The only time THEY have problems is when they find someone that does not agree!

[anolbom]

Actually Mother Teresa was not without contraversy... but let's remember however: there are thousands of priests and nuns out there who do wonderful and selfless work for the benefit of others.--

I am aware of that, and I tried to couch my reply in deference to them. I do not want to seem like I hate the basic tenets of the religion itself, just what the bureaucracy has become of what was a home grown peacefully rebellious call to worship.

Jesus, as he was then, would never be allowed in to the higher levels of the Church now... Ultimate oxymoronic irony........



BTW, I never changed your name Fab... I wonder why the reply thing did......

[yQvpyNt3]

I was referring more towards the gentry within the religion itself....

No difference. Those that buy into it are part of it.

[Nubtoubrem]

Maybe the Tabriz thing is God telling me I should be a Muslim.

Ninj: Anyway... look... I have to be honest: I have a hard time with your posts... now you are saying that gold/wealth is a sin. It's not.

And ...uh... ditch the pagentry?: pagentry in the Church is celebration, joy, culture, a link with history.... etc. I'm not saying you must agree with it... but it does have another meaning to many.

[Hinigyday]

No difference. Those that buy into it are part of it.

Let me rephrase it then.

Most religions work on a premise that allow more harmoneous relation between people based on a comon unifying belief. Pack instinct, people have an instinct to follow each other.

So most religions have, at least on the surface, a sort of "help your neighbor" clause put into it. Provided, of course, your neighbor is "one of you" as well.

Some religions are more obvious of this exclusion, but some, like Christianity as it stands in the Catholic Church, are not. Do not even get me started on some of the denominations we harbor in the south (Baptist, I think?) and their inherent "we love all people, so long as they agree with us!....

Anyway, whatever. The statement I made was a generalization that can, with small effort, be picked apart on individual issues, but the premise stays the same. Religions teach solidarity. Very few say "kick your neighbor". At least, not as such.

[h98hhYxM]

Ninj: Anyway... look... I have to be honest: I have a hard time with your posts... now you are saying that gold/wealth is a sin. It's not.

then why is it forbidden to be posessed or won by lower priests?

And ...uh... ditch the pagentry?: pagentry in the Church is celebration, joy, culture, a link with history.... etc. I'm not saying you must agree with it... but it does have another meaning to many. I know. People are shallow. We can't give money without a Run/Walk or a Fruit Cake sale. We can't believe in God without dancing around with colored eggs on Easter, or having a parade of ornately costumed "officials" walking through a huge plaza to tell everyone that, in a nutshell, God is still around and you should all follow what Jesus talked about....

Religions that do not do this do not attract the sheeple.

Look at the televangelists! the whole point of a sermon is to take the word to the people, to give a more personal message. But you get that many people together, it is no longer personal. It is a popularity contest which ties directly into human beings desire to be part of the strongest pack.


Odd, for a religion that started with 12 people following a prophet that hated the establishment and organized religion.....

[iioijjjkkojhbb]

Ninj, the Catholic Church (especially the Catholic Church) is also about austerity. It's the Church of the opulence of the Vatican and the austerity of a monestary. (It's very cool.)

And in other cultures (like here in the Mediterranean where this all got started) pagentry and celebration whether it's for the pig slaugter or the Easter procession... it's how we live (thank God). We're not Calvinists.

--

[Fiesialenp]

Ninj, the Catholic Church (especially the Catholic Church) is also about austerity. It's the Church of the opulence of the Vatican and the austerity of a monestary. (It's very cool.)

As a cultural center and a reference to such, it really is extroadinary (been there done that! )

And in other cultures (like here in the Mediterranean where this all got started) pagentry and celebration whether it's for the pig slaugter or the Easter procession... it's how we live (thank God). We're not Calvinists.-- I am not saying we have to forego celebration, but we havea tendency to lose site of the real reasons behind the parade and focus on the floats....


I like celebration myself, I just find it odd what we celebrate, how and why. Sometimes we celebrate not for the event, but for the celebration itself. That is fine when you are having a party, but for Christ? Some of the very things he protested against the organized religious institutions of his day are being performed in his name today.....

Humanity keeps coming back to what it likes and is comfortable.

Isn't that right, Neo?

[imictiorume]

Odd, for a religion that started with 12 people following a prophet that hated the establishment and organized religion.....

Matthew 5:17
Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. .

[iouiyyut]

Really.

You have to post context or the quote is worthless Zip. What was Matthew positioning for? What was his direction? Was he saying that he is not there to stop the Law of God, but merely to suggest that the Law of Man no longer follows it?

He does not protest the origin or basis of the religion, but his actions were not exactly extolling the current state of Judaeism. They wanted change, and you cannot change by staying the same and agreeing to continue what has come before in perpetuity......