[cwgwowcom]

Nah, someone just has to make a solar powered Ethanol plant!

Think od it as converting sunshine into a storable commodity/energy source.

[Crazykz]

EPA says no to California greenhouse gas rules waiver

Posted Dec 19th 2007 8:44PM by Sam Abuelsamid
Filed under: MPG, Legislation and Policy



Environmental Protection Agency Administrator Stephen Johnson today announced the agency was rejecting California's application for a waiver that would allow the state to regulate greenhouse gas emissions. California and seventeen other states had wanted to impose rules that would limit CO2 emissions. The rules would have effectively raised fuel efficiency requirements since CO2 emissions are directly related to fuel burned.

Johnson used the energy bill that was signed into law by the President today as part of the rationale for the decision. Since the new fuel economy regulations apply to all fifty states denying the waiver would avoid having multiple state level regulations that would make life more difficult for carmakers. Immediately following the announcement California Attorney General Jerry Brown said he and Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger would sue the EPA at the earliest possible time to overturn the decision.

[tadacia]

How can the EPA forbid the state to regulate that?

If anything, the EPA should be able to set national MINIMUMS. Each state should be allowed to add whatever it wants on top of it.

Federal mandate again. This really needs to be stopped.

[GfBTWMmV]

^
Actually, no. We really need to set a single national standard. What happens when each state sets its own? Companies are going to have to make cars (or other stuff besides cars) to cater to each state? That's ludicris. If anything, the authority that California was granted to set it's own pollution standards should be revoked.

[inhitoemits]

I am kind of surprised to see you take that position.. all along, i took you for a 'states rights' and small federal govt kind of guy.. live and learn.

[gregmcal]

I believe the vast majority of US biofuel is ethanol from corn. The corn-ethanol piece of the energy bill, to me, seems like pure pork-barrel legislation by the Cornbelt congressmen (as well as a bit of green-wash). Under current technologies, it takes about as much fossil fuel to produce corn-ethanol as is saved. Sugar cane has a somewhat better efficiency. Greater promise lies in switchgrass (cellulose) and algae.

aaahhh but we would have to import sugar cane from south america.. and where's the fun in that??

Much better to line to pockets of the farm lobby... how else do can you expect to carry the iowa caucus??

You see, there is the "issue" and the "ISSUE" (meaning the politics) and never the twain shall meet.

[Jorcelirl]

^
Actually, no. We really need to set a single national standard. What happens when each state sets its own? Companies are going to have to make cars (or other stuff besides cars) to cater to each state? That's ludicris. If anything, the authority that California was granted to set it's own pollution standards should be revoked.

1st, Ludicrous. Ludicris is a singer, I think...

Second, car makers wouldn't have to do jack. IF they wanted to sell a car in Cali, have it registered there, they would have to make consessions.

You would have to limit the restrictions to ones that are common, like emmissions and milage, but if a state wants 100mpg, let them do it. Their "free market" will start to pressure their politicians to reduce restrictions to where they are tolerable.

The thing that gets me though is that states should be able to call what they want for their state. It is not saying that trans-state vehicles have to do this, they are not harming american interests as much as your statements seem to imply (where do you think most of the Auto industries $$s are going? It ain't Detroit anymore!!!).

We, as a nation, were not set up so the feds could control everything. If they are concerned about national interests, so be it, but they should back off when it comes to almost anything else.

[Zs3ZASpA]

The so-called "federal government" has its hands in way too many things. As it stands right now, I can't buy a toilet that flushes properly, and heaven forbid if I even TRY to buy lawn darts. Quick! Call out the state police! Bob bought some lawn darts at a tag sale!

As for the CAFE standard, I have thought about that a bit more. Let's see...the current standard is 27.5 mpg, ok. The new standard bumps this to 35 mpg by 2020. That's 13 years, and that seems somewhat reasonable. Technology alone should be able to make much of this within reason. In fact, I suspect the automakers met privately with many of the key decision-makers and told them what could be done and by what time. So even though I would prefer there be no CAFE rule, it is what it is. And I'm hoping it's not all that bad. Look -- it's not that I oppose higher fuel economy. I simply oppose further meddling in the auto industry by Uncle Sam, the same well-loved but occasional knucklehead who brought us the 5 MPH bumper.

[GtmFeqJJ]

Come to think of it, I am pretty upset about not being able to buy lawn darts in the U.S. Fortunately I saw the future many years ago and scarfed up at least six complete sets of them.

Hey! It's a free country!

[Optosypoeds]

Come to think of it, I am pretty upset about not being able to buy lawn darts in the U.S. Fortunately I saw the future many years ago and scarfed up at least six complete sets of them.

Hey! It's a free country!

You bought Lawn Darts living in Arizona?

[AliceFromHouston]

Re: LAWN Darts

Damned good for you lawn-loving desert-dwelling sodders that it's a free country,

Just remember: The water isn't free -- or necessarily abundant. That's what made it a desert.

[durootrium]

Off topic, but the lawn darts are still at my house in New York. Of no use in Arizona, as the ground is essentially concrete!

Back on topic: anybody here think the President will push the 35 mpg standard ever higher?

[Buhoutsoupfap]

I hope so, but before that, he needs to remove SUV's from the "truck" category.

They are, by no means, "work vehicles" (unless you are a politician or a pimp....or both).

[Allbrunette]

How high would you push the standard? 45? 60? 100? (Serious question.)

[lalffibra]

Mileage standards (and testing methods) should be the same for all countries... after all, the product is global.

Europe currently requires a 40 mpg average and it will go up to nearly 50 in the coming years.... and the US should do the same.

But nothing like that will happen in the US unless gas prices are taxed heavily and kept artificially high as they are in Europe.

[Paul Bunyan]

How high would you push the standard? 45? 60? 100? (Serious question.)

It really depends on the efficiency possible.

I would not want a 200 MPG vehicle that gets only 40HP. It would be like driving a golf cart.

But if they can get me 200HP (instead of 300) at 40MPG, I would say 40MPG (etc etc).

Again, they need to get rid of certain standard exceptions hey made for things that are being used inappropriately.

A Hummer is not a work vehicle, or at least the commercial version of it isn't. Allowing that 9 mpg boehemoth on the road was the pinnacle of our bloated capitalistic arrogance. The ONLY thing it ver said was "I have money to throw away, AND I want to use it to make me a tough guy".

Horrible.




As for gas tax?That is a tough one. I do not thnig we need to do like Europe to encourage higher CAFE standards, but it would help.

And we also need to get rid of that 9/10¢ thing. It mattered when gas was 20¢ a gallon, but now it is just pointless.

[agracias]

"I have money to throw away, AND I want to use it to make me a tough guy".

Horrible.

Who cares?

And what is the psychology behind buying a Rolls, a Maybach or a Ferrari?

[zabiqapara]

Who cares?

Not enough.

And what is the psychology behind buying a Rolls, a Maybach or a Ferrari? F' you all, I have money.

[Smabeabumjess]

So?

[SoftrermaBioniaSat]

In the big picture, a Hummer (or a Farrari) has zero impact.

Hummers account for 1% of GM sales.